Nikdunaev

So the crew was still able to do everything they would do in such case these days even before the Tokyo convention? Was there any kind of document that somehow protected them from accusations of inappropriate usage of force and stuff of that sort? I certainly know that such things exist now but what was it all like back then? Sorry I just did not get it right probably. Those universities may have excellent curricula but I do not study there so how is it going to help me? Sorry again if I do not see something simple. I tried searching the web but probably I am not very good at it and that is what made me ask these questions. Anyway thank you for all your replies!

Just so was the kind of that immediate required crew response actually the same before the Tokyo convention appeared? Or what would it look like? The document on the link is interesting but again it generally describes the modern state of things. For example it says there that before the seventies most countries did not officially recognize an offense such as an aircraft hijacking. And that again sends us to my original question. Hijackers were prosecuted before that if they were caught. What were the legal grounds for prosecution then?

Thank you for your reply! I have been thinking about that myself and it seems logical if you look at the normal legal powers of a ship captain to consider an aircraft captain just the same vessel captain if you have no reasons to treat them differently... It is just that I do not know for sure too and the modern web sorely does not seem to consider it a question lots of stuff should be written on. Or at least I can not manage to find it. For me that is a really interesting question

Hello! I did not find much useful information about that so I decided to ask a question. Nowadays there are legal acts and agreements which state what country jurisdiction is applicable to something happened on board of a flying aircraft. Also if you have to react to a crime right on board somehow for example as landing will take some time you have Tokyo convention for this and other things like that. But the Tokyo convention came into force only in nineteen sixty nine and some other things of that sort even later. What was there before that? After all problems similar to the ones we have nowadays always existed and there certainly were lots and lots of passenger flights and passengers worldwide as well as the cases of crimes on the aircraft and dangerous air rage incidents. I guess the involved countries can decide which ones of them will be applying their law to the incident but what is the crew supposed to do when an immediate response is required in flight? It would be very interesting to know Thank you!

Well in most countries and also according to some international documents disregarding a lawful instruction of an aircraft commander is a criminal offense. But those things also limit what the captain can or can not demand from passengers and or crew members. And I bet rising the seat back for the guy behind to open his tray table is not on the list of the allowable instructions as well as it is not a safety issue

That is a prosecutable criminal offense. What I am talking about shouting or swearing loudly or just making the passenger next to you feel uncomfortable in any other way. And another one question here. Most documents and regulations take sexual assaults extremely seriously. What is the actual difference here between something that can happen in any crowded area anytime where slapping this guy in the face is enough to make him stop and a serious offence that is enough for prosecution?

Of course they will divert should someone be a real safety issue for the passengers around or should this person commit a criminal offense that can provide reasons for prosecution. But what about someone who is doing enough to spoil the experience of other passengers but not enough to be a threat for their safety?

What do you mean under an actionable offense?

And then what do you think of my post?

Is this topic at a risk of closure? I believe that guy did actually post that missing message so I will answer him in this post. Regarding the first of my original questions you can always firmly ask such person to calm down and if that does not help you can call the police at least to make this person leave the premises if that is happening on your property. But of course if you are in an airplane you can do no such thing for obvious reasons... And if you keep trying to deescalate or solve the situation it may just create a conflict and have the opposite result as you guess... And regarding the second of the questions of course it is obvious that this person can and will face prosecution no matter if that happened on an airplane or not and of course the pilots will decide to land at a nearest suitable destination but the problem again is that it will take some time anyway. And how to prevent or at least minimize further damage or maybe even injuries during this time? Thank you!

I have received a message in my mailbox telling me that there was another new reply in this thread from a user called Vargveum... As far as I can see it is not here now?

There is no connection between those topics those are just questions about the aviation things I would like to know. I do not know myself if the next one will be about the flight sim settings or just anything else out there. I personally prefer to sleep most of the time while sitting in an airplane in flight And please guys I am asking those seriously I can make up lots of funny stories or phrases about airplanes myself Thank you!

Hello! I have a couple of questions regarding this quite famous problem. What can happen to a passenger who is continuously disrupting the comfort of other passengers around but does not escalate the conflict to the level of a prosecutable criminal offense or something that would be a safety issue so he could not be easily threatened with diverting the aircraft and calling the police and such things? For example this guy is talking very loud or abusing people around or prevents the passenger behind from eating his meal with his seat backrest position and continuously refuses to stop doing such things? What to do with those guys? And what about the opposite situation with a quite aggressive passenger who is fighting or otherwise resisting but is physically too strong for the crew members or other passengers to deal with in such way? For example this guy is aggressive threatening him with police and prosecution does not work as well as attempts deescalate and there is nobody onboard who can force him to calm down until landing? Or should such situation be treated as hijacking? I am a great aviation fan and I always think of many different kinds of situation that could happen in flight and a disruptive passenger of some sort have always been one of my nightmares about this matter if I can call it this way...

That is a nice picture!

The latest posts start to look more like the real thing at least that is how it looks for me Regarding the previous ones who are those guys mentioned above here supposed to be actually? Did not you think that one has to commit a crime to get to the no fly list or even get arrested?

That thing says that they absolutely must give any such thing to the authority if asked as that is required by law. As in accordance with the general law that certainly does not mean the opposite thing. It does not state that they should not give the same documents to somebody who is not an authority. And everything that is not directly prohibited is legal again in accordance with general law. So it is not their duty by law to provide papers to the passenger but at the same time if they decide to do so there is nothing bad about it. Also I think that thing describes the procedure of providing those documents for official processing in cases such as mayor inspections of airlines not taking a quick look on them while they are on board. Regarding talking to the pilots directly and being in the cockpit at that time especially after the flight I have done that many times in many countries and it have always been a pleasant experience of talking with friendly people. Touch wood Even in America why would anybody take you off the plane for just asking something unusual? Especially if that is happening after the flight? Also I doubt that some bad guys would actually need to see the exact fuel on board number to plan their bad business

My opinion at the moment is based on what I believe to be the actual radio recording of the moment supported by the interviews of the traffic controller and the Russian crew as well as a couple of other flight crews who have been around.

Hello I understand that it would be quite an unusual situation and such thing is very unlikely to happen, but what do you think will happen should a passenger ask somebody of the crew to see some of the usual standard flight papers like the load manifest and such other things? I can not think of a good reason for a usual passenger to ask for that, maybe of pure personal interest, as you guess, this guy would likely be a great sim and aviation fan... What do you think of such a situation? Thank you!

All that is already proven to be the actual severe fault of the Skyteam crew on the runway. Russians had their landing clearance. Skyteam guys also had the clearance to cross the runway but after the traffic on short final not before! They received this message and provided correct readback. Nobody knows for sure why did they go after acknowledging the crossing instruction correctly and certainly nobody expected this! The traffic controller apologized to the Russian crew right after this.

The guys there actually sent me here. Please help me.

Hello Please help. How to get rid of an annoying starter spoolup sound when flying with a failed engine? Or, at least, make it sound at constant tone? Thank you! Best Regards

Maybe, I am really bad at looking through forums, but either I can not make a right request, or there is no such discussion, at least, I can not see it

The folks there just seem to ignore me. Nobody of the staff has ever replied to my posts.

That does not seem to make a difference

Hello Please help. How to get rid of an annoying starter spoolup sound when flying with a failed engine? Or, at least, make it sound at constant tone? Thank you! Best Regards