Hi All!Jeepers! Go away for one second and all these replies start popping up! Well, the saga continues when I say that yesturday another member of my family (twin bro) bought a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, which doesn't have force feed back. I can very confidently say that this was many many many times better than the Logitech WingMan Force 3D! So much more precise. Why do so many people want to get force feed back that is that crummy. The new joystick literally costs half the price! If the CH Yoke pedals are better than the precision of the Extreme 3D Pro I'd be very impressed ;)And John, who wouldn't already have a subscription to Computer Pilot mag? It is just too good :DGeoffrey Balean (YSCB)

Logitech don

Since ten years, I use CH PRO pedals combined with F16 TQS and F16PRO from Thrusmaster. I did change the two potentiometer just two years ago.If i had to buy a new joystick, i would choose the Cougar system with a CH PRO USB without any doubt. I know that cougar was criticized, and it is true that the programming is a little time investment to do, but the rsult is that you dont need anymore to worry with the keyboard or controls. except for the throttle zones which were too easy to overpass. Hope it will help you in your choice. philippe Strasbourg

But the X-45 is way cheaper than the Cougar and have more programming capabilities. And The Cougars aren

Hi.I use C&H USB yoke and pedals. I found over time the yoke didn't seem to seek center position as when new. I purchased a spray can of Silicon based lube. Worked like a charm. The yoke returns to center perfectly every time.I wold not go back to my joystick, to be honest the only ones I ever used were MS sticks the regular and FFB.Regards

Hi again!"And how do you compare the CH Yoke pedals against the twist function of 3D PRO? That is an illegal comparison ;) lol"lol He already has the rudder pedals :)The force feed back system on the WingMan Force 3D just didn't allow me to perform an accurate visual approach. The 3D Pro is much stronger and perfectly precise. Not at all on par with Microsofts pphh! lol That's a different debate anyhow :) "Sweeping generalisations with no substantial evidence!" - I like logitech stuff.Yes it is true it was good for combat flying but the only thing i've used was European Air War. Strangely, the next combat game I will get should come with the CH Yoke and Rudder Pedals package :)Thanks for all your comments! I like the little flamey icon beside it on the front page :(Geoffrey Balean (YSCB)

You mean you got the Wingman force feedback wheel and it

Yeah, I had the MS Sidewinder w/o force feedback, and when it died :( I was lost when I couldn't get a new one, as they stopped making them. I first got the Saitek X45 setup and thought it was going to work great. I liked having a more realistic throttle, except it's on the wrong side! If you reverse it, then you aren't able to use the buttons. It simply isn't designed the right hand usage. My biggest complaint was the stiffness it had. I really felt like my wrist was going to need surgery before to long. LOLSame complaint for the Logitech 3D Wingman. Way too stiff and hard on the joints and tendons.The CH is really the way to go. I wouldn't pay a thousand dollars for a yoke and pedals. I'd much rather put that towards real lessons. :)Chris

I flew with the USB CH stuff for many years and there good. The PFC is on a whole different level though and now I REALLY feel like Im doing the deed... Mike B.

Mike,Great shot of your setup. Mind if I ask how much that cost you? (The PFC stuff, not the entire rig) Also is that RFP on the screens? Looks great!

> "The CH is really the way to go. I wouldn't pay a thousand dollars for a yoke and pedals. I'd much rather put that towards real lessons. :)"Here here (Bar the CH bit - haven't got them yet)!Geoffrey Balean (YSCB)

"Mind if I ask how much that cost you?" One wife, one house, a good retirement and other hidden "costs".. Here is their web sight.. http://www.flypfc.com/ Yep, RFP in the display although I don't fly it much. "Too intense". I prefer the twin jets mostly. My current favorite is the supurb Citiation X by Eagle Soft, followed by the Beach 1900 by thses folks.. Mike B.

Thanks for the website. Ill have to check that out. Great stuff. I love the B1900, fantastic plane!