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Greatest Airline 737-400 or Pro AirBus 320 Which is B

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I only have money to buy one sim. I have been thinking of the 737-400 Greatest Airline sim or the Pro Air Bus 320. I would like your opinion as to which one you think is the better add on sim.I would prefer a sim that is somewhat realistic with different available liveries, but at the same time with a reasonable time for a learning curve. I do not want to spend weeks learning to fly the aircraft, and constantly having to fly the aircraft in order just to be able to stay proficient at a minimum level.I welcome your suggestions and opinions.Thank you.Stanner

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you will need FS2002 for both of them!!! they're only add-ons!! regards, peter

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I realize that these are only add ons. I do have FS2002 Pro.Stanner

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Hi,right they are only add-ons, but let us assume that you have FS2002.If you do not want to get into learning, reading and trying stay away of both these planes. Especially from the bus.Get one of them turboprops first if you want something a lttle complex yet easy to use right away. I would suggest the Cessna 421C Golden Eagle. It really is a nice plane.Alex

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Hi StannerI would also agree with Alex's choice, the FSD Cessna 421C. The 737 and A320 packages you mentioned require much study and practice. If however you are willing to follow the tutorial flights I would highly recommend the PSS A320. It can't be beat !! I would think what you describe here though is the default FS2002 aircraft. Real world liveries are available in the AVSIM file library. I have been a participant in these forums and flying sim aircraft for several years and I am still learning.:-) This is why I love it!!SteveCYYZ

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I *wouldn't* recommend Dreamfleet for anything.The 'support' forum is only for people who have good comments about their products. Also the LOC & GS performance of the 737 is abismal, at best.Tom EvansBAV 757/767 Training Captain

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I agree with the support forum, c my reaction to today's locked thread thread but you can really handle the glideslope with a little experience and the right approach speed. I really do not like the arrogance of these people but hey, the product is great.Alex

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I for one actually like Dreamfleet as a company far more than I do PSS. Yes, they both make fantastic products, and I fly them all the time, but Dreamfleet gets my vote over PSS anyday.People like Lou Betti are the reason why flight simulation is so great, they're people who've had a lot of real world experience and wish to express their love for avaiation in our flightsim community. Dremfleet has put up with more than their fair share of angry people, yet they still have not gone to a "Preview before it's Posted" forum like the 'other guys' have. I have a lot of respect towards Dreamfleet for doing this, it shows true commitment to thier loyal 'fans' by not giving into the 1% or people on their boards looking for trouble.Both companies offer great support, don't get me wrong. If I really didn't like one or the other, I wouldn't buy their products. ;-) The whole "The LOC and GS on the DF734 doesn't work" deal is not true, mine works just fine. Then why are people having problems with it? It's because they don't fly the aircraft correctly. The DF734 happens to be a bit more picky about V-Speeds and intercept angles than other aircraft, and I personally like this. It forces you to actually read and study the manual. It also makes you a better pilot, and in the long run, you'll appreciate this. Just my 2 cents. :-)

And as I say in any response like this... this tread was in no way intended to flame anyone or any company. :-)

Ryan-Flightpro08 :-coolVATSIM Pilot/ControllerZLA ARTCC Controller 1 (C-1)SAN TRACON Lead [link:www.taxiwaysigns.com]Taxiwaysigns.com Scenery Designer

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>I only have money to buy one sim. I have been thinking of >the 737-400 Greatest Airline sim or the Pro Air Bus 320. >I would like your opinion as to which one you think is the >better add on sim. Hi,If I only had one choise, I wouldn

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These slams against Dreamfleet are completely unwarranted - that issue of glideslope and localizer capture has been explained and beaten to death god knows how many times on their forum - it's not their fault and they're sick of seeing the topic come up!!! The DF737 was designed and coded under FS2000 where the autopilot was good. MS screwed it up royally in FS2002 and as a result the DF737 has some problems autolanding in FS2002. Go try it yourself - install FS2000 and watch it nail it on the numbers everytime. DF was not about to spend hundreds of hours creating a brand new custom autopilot to appease people using FS2002 for FREE. Lou has stated many times that there will probably eventually be a new DF737 released with the NG panel, a new autopilot, and a GMAX model. The FS2002 patch was a gift - they DID NOT have to do that for us. Go fly their FS2002-native Piper Archer and find just ONE problem with it - I've been flying it for months and there are ZERO issues I can see.

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>>>>It's because they don't fly the aircraft correctly.I'll bite my tongue.Tom EvansBAV 757/767 Training Captain

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This is just my feeling but I know hundreds (actually thousands of simmers) love the DF GA 737!Why you ask?Simple!You get photo realistic panel (no hand drawn panels), you get a great working FMC, overhead, Nav/com panel, APP (I will get into this below), FA and pilot chatter, and 100's of FREE liveries. Oh and pretty darn good performance, also add moving map, TCAS, and more that I have forgotten.Some people say the AP stinks to them ask me why the AP works just fine for all of the over 200 FS2002 patch beta testers, as well as the developers?I have dozens of photos showing a good AP/LOC capture no issues what so ever as well as a good auto land. This is all fact not fiction. Also with DF 737 you get well over 200+ Free liveries, the TOM (Tex-O-Matic) that allows you to create any scheme you want, also you get load master.IMHO the only real choice is the DF 737.Now if you want a heavy jet I have two words for you PIC 767 :)The FMC will take some time to get used to be the tutorials are very good, plus they have a nice audio tutorial that will direct you step by step how to setup the FMC (No other company offers this)John

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Such a dangerous thread. :)If you bought either of the two (or even PIC 767), you would not be going wrong.* PSS Airbus - You get a GREAT visual model, well-functioning systems, and a good feel overall. You also get Airbus's little quirks and quandries. But if you haven't learned Boeing yet, you'll probably be OK. Liveries are not free, unfortunately. * DF 737 - You get a good visual model, with HUNDREDS of FREE liveries available. And the toolkit to make your own. It is a stable package, and because 737's are so common in the skies, you may find yourself flying this one more than others. * PIC 767 - Hands down bar none, you get THE best rendition of an aircraft's flying feel and systems management for MSFS. If you want to learn how a real pilot flies an airliner, this one will make you learn. The visual model is not great, but its fixable through replacement. PIC 767, a few years after its initial release, is STILL the king of the skies in my book. All three have excellent things to offer a sim enthusiast. It may be easier to learn Boeing's first though - the PSS manual is written knowing that many of its users have first flown Boeings, and adds little gotcha-notes to the text. I would recommend the 737 first, then graduate to the 767, then perhaps slide into a second major with the Airbus. Good luck with whatever you choose,-Greg

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WARNING: PERSONAL OPINION FOLLOWS -- CONSUME WITH CARE. ;-)IMHO, I'd rank these as follows for the following reasons:1. 767 Pilot in Command. Most functioning systems, lowest framerate impact of the three panels, easy to use FMC (thanks to keyboard assist). The visual model is not up to speed, but the panel works magnificently with the POSKY birds, so who cares. Bonus: I've seen this addon at Electronics Boutique for as low as $19.99. 2. Dreamfleet-Greatest Airliners 737. Great panel, possibly the one I fly the most (I like short haul), great audio FMC tutorials. Not so great on the frames, partially because the FMC runs external to FS. The visual model is very disappointing. Inaccurate and unnecessarily framerate-heavy. Fuselage cross-section and engine shape are completely off.3. PSS Airbus A32X. Great looking panel, but buggy. Flight dynamics are questionable. The aircraft has some odd behavior at low speeds. Magnificent looking Virtual Cockpit, but until someone figures out how to make clickable switches in VC mode, I don't see much of a point in VCs. Inaccurate visual model. The nose looks like it's from some other aircraft not made by Airbus and the landing gear is way too high. No match for the freeware Project Airbus model. Plus, if you're buying online, getting all the liveries you would want can get expensive. Misha

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As Greg says, all three have excellent things to offer a sim enthusiast but I think you may want to keep in mind that only some of the packages offered and mentioned here are true FS2002 offerings. Those older 2000 packages that required patches will more than likely not work at all on Microsoft's next FS release.SteveCYYZ

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Just read the responses from the DF group, that is a small indication of how they treat "non-conformists". In one breath they will say it is not their fault - it is FS2k2 (despite a statement early on regarding full compatibility with FS2k2).If that doesn't get you then its the point that in truth not every one has the problem - so "YOU must be ignorant" (forget the other statements that "it's not PS1 after all" you expect too much realism, BUT your PROBABLY too fast, too heavy, etc). For me, numerous CATIII ILS's don't work,and you'll easily auger in if you allow the plane to try and do what it "should".There have plenty of statements on their board from people that have legitimate glidescope issues - do look for yourself (some from people with real life experience- if threads still are present).PSS has had issues and rough edges in the past no doubt - but I fly the A320 series 10 times more than I fly DF. PSS has demonstrated significantly more concern and less hostility over the last several months. I'm glad I bought PSS.I for one was following DF's A340 project hoping maybe they would get it right. Now that it is canceled I don't even visit their forum twice a month - no need, no desire for any of their products or grief.Joe

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Hmm.. Being that I have both DF737 and 767PIC, I can assure after two weeks of reading the material, the DF737's autoland perfectly in FS2k2.767PIC works great too. I am still debating whether or not to purchase PSS 777 or 747. I don't know much about the Airbus though. Sway me! :)Julian

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If it's not Boeing, it's not Going.--------------Paul Meyerwww.KryptonAir.comwww.LAARTCC.org

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Hi Julian,Your reply is "under" mine so, if your asking me, the BUS is a different experience. I fully enjoy it, though it is so different in many respects from the Boeing/DF (which I had 70+ VA hours in). The BUS is more of a computer simulating a computer flying an aircraft - but I do enjoy it and find the realism level satisfying (want something different - fly the bush - it is great!!). I really believe PSS has continued to try extra hard on this one and it shows. I am not sure it is as intricate with "dummy" switched as DF (pressurization, cabin calls, CVR, etc) hard to tell since the closest I've come to flying either is about row 5. :)FYI - glad to hear autoland DF works for you - it works for me in all applicable PSS AC, PIC, and the PIC 757 converts. DF is 100% hit or miss - never now until GS capture if it is "monitor closely" or "pull up NOW for dear life".Best to you.Joe

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Same here. Autoland works for me on default FS2002 -aircrafts, PSS A320, PSS 747, PSS 777, PIC 767 but not on the DF 737. So its hard to believe that I am only too dumb to use the DF 737-autoland while I have no problem to use autoland on any other aircraft...O.K. using the same runway sometimes the 737 just manages (while crying PULL UP, PULL UP desperately) to do an autolanding, sometimes it just nose-dives and crashes. So probably there is some configuration (different for every runway?) concerning the distance from the runway where you select to do the autoland etc which will -with much luck - get you to the ground without crashing. But if this were a realistic 737 - behavior I would never ever fly in one of these machines again in real life!Walter

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Well, the Dreamfleet-fans are really funny people: they will assure you that there is ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM with the DF-737-autoland at all and at the same time they will tell you that the (non-existing) autoland problems are CAUSED BY Microsoft

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Tom,My comments about people not flying the aircraft correctly where in no way specifically aimed at you. Though, with my experience around the Flightsim fourms, I've found out that more often then not that the reason the DF734 won't properly autoland is because of poor pilot knowledge. Over at the DF734 forum, I see questions all of the time about people not being able to do something, or say soemthing doesn't work. Lou, or one of the other Dreamfleet members will responde and say "Did you read the manual?" The original poster most of the time respondes "Well, no, but I should be able to fly the aircraft without reading it, right?"With this advanced payware aircraft, it doesn't work that way. Again Tom, these comments and my previous comments where in no way aimed at you or any other individual. Just, in general, I believe quite a few people have difficuilty flying advance payware aircraft because they flat out don't know what they're doing :-)Ryan-Flightpro08 :-coolVATSIM Pilot/ControllerZLA ARTCC Controller 1 (C-1)SAN TRACON Lead [link:www.taxiwaysigns.com]Taxiwaysigns.com Scenery Designer

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Thank you Paul!It's not really in my nature to give up at things easily. I put up a fight in the fairest and best way that I can and you win some, you lose some Ryan, I understand! I was just a little peeved at the time. Some people are like how you describe, I agree, hence the birth of the abbreviation RTFM :-).I'm making slow progress in the quest of 'acceptable' LOC/GS behaviour. But now I'm off to see my girlfriend for a week, should be able to relieve some of the stress, if ya get my drift :-)Best wishesTom EvansBAV 757/767 Training Captain

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>Well, the Dreamfleet-fans are really funny people: they will >assure you that there is ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM with the >DF-737-autoland at all and at the same time they will tell >you that the (non-existing) autoland problems are CAUSED BY >Microsoft

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