AirFrance A330 missing

[Guest belga1]

Hello,

Did they forget or not bother to get weather info before take-off?

It's unfortunate you had not read the BEA preliminary report ... you had know the answer.The preliminary report in englishhttp://www.bea.aero/docspa/2009/f-cp090601...090601e1.en.pdfSome more legals actions:http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news/local...e_crash_lawsuithttp://www.mithofflaw.com/index.htmlSome comments:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-t-halli...t_b_304737.htmlhttp://scholar.lib.vt.edu/ejournals/JOTS/v...1/cummings.htmlAlso interesting analyse to read:Part1http://tinyurl.com/n4a6prPart2http://tinyurl.com/msbpklRegards.Gus.

[mabe54 17]

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/20...ritical-issues/Cheers,MAB

[mabe54 17]

Why am I not surprised of this???http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/inter...9/24/104012.htmEasy to throw mud onto others than to clean your own.Cheers,MAB

[Guest belga1]

Hello,

LE BOURGET

[mabe54 17]

I never liked it when the Director of the BEA the second or third day after the crash came out stating that he thought that most likely the boxes would never be found. Too self-defeating at the onset of an investigation. Now they look like they are stalling for time as to forget the whole thing. It never really happened folks.Let's see in January what happen with the now famous phase three in high sea. Not good.Cheers,MAB

[3Green 80]

Another Air France declares Mayday due to severe turbulence. Interesting...http://www.avherald.com/h?article=42380873&opt=0RJ

[Guest belga1]

Hello,

The BEA has launched an investigation into the event that occurred during flight AF 445 from Rio de Janeiro to Paris, during the night of 29 November 2009, to the A330-203 operated by Air France. An analysis of this event is likely to throw some additional light on the accident on 1st June 2009 between Rio de Janeiro and Paris to the A330-203, flight AF 447.

BEA link (english)http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/flight.af....ecember2009.phpRegards.Gus.

[mabe54 17]

Hello,BEA link (english)http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/flight.af....ecember2009.phpRegards.Gus.

So what have they been doing up until now??? Silly BEA.Cheers,MAB

[Guest belga1]

Hello,

So what have they been doing up until now??? Silly BEA.

You will know the 17 December of this year Regards.Gus.

[Peter Clemenko 0]

I think it's about time these suckers are grounded, at least until they figure out why they go down so easily.

[EngineRoom 205]

I think it's about time these suckers are grounded, at least until they figure out why they go down so easily.

Are you referring to Air France, or the A330? I may be mistaken but neither are falling from the sky on a regular basis. The crew for whatever reason against all conventional wisdom and practice flew their aircraft into a very large and powerful storm, resulting in the loss of the aircraft. The question shouldn't be "why did it crash" - it should be "why did they fly into that storm?"Unfortunately I think the French investigative authorities will come to whatever is deemed to be the most politically expedient conclusion, just as they did with the Concorde crash.Nick

[vololiberista 205]

Are you referring to Air France, or the A330? I may be mistaken but neither are falling from the sky on a regular basis. The crew for whatever reason against all conventional wisdom and practice flew their aircraft into a very large and powerful storm, resulting in the loss of the aircraft. The question shouldn't be "why did it crash" - it should be "why did they fly into that storm?"Unfortunately I think the French investigative authorities will come to whatever is deemed to be the most politically expedient conclusion, just as they did with the Concorde crash.Nick

They need also to ask why the Air Chance crew were the only crew not to avoid that storm!!!!!Vololiberista

[Guest belga1]

Hello,A opinion (and I agree)"Take a Chance, take Air France" :)Readed on a other forum (french one)Sorry .. Google translation !!

Re: AF 447: pending com BEA (December 17)Messagepar HMC on Fri December 11, 2009 14:47The failure of feedback confirmed!It took the death of the Airbus A-330 flight AF 447, its passengers and crew in the depths of the Atlantic Ocean to the small world the responsibility to monitor the airworthiness of such aircraft wake up and take emergency a number of decisions. These decisions have been taken before this tragedy if the BEA had made the necessary recommendations based on analysis of numerous serious incidents precursors that were known, if the DGCA had exploited the events of its database, if EASA and Airbus were not content to ask the drivers to accommodate the lack of pitot probes, if Air France had taken corrective action.Thus, receiving at Bourget Association of Professional Journalists of aeronautics and space, the Director of BEA, Jean-Paul Troadec said a few days ago that the next report will include "an analysis of inconsistent measurements of speeds listed on other flights. "It confirms that the BEA had not done before the accident flight AF 447!Thus, 2 months after the accident, EASA and Airbus have removed the pitot probe Thales AA holding that the probe was not reliable (the manufacturer had made this observation in July 2002!), Then in October, l EASA has changed the standards for certification of pitot probes, standards it was classified as obsolete in September 2007.Thus, having limited, in November 2008, an "information security" requiring drivers to remain vigilant in flight conditions which produce abnormal anemometer, Air France has created an accident after meeting specific simulator " speeds questionable "on Airbus, strengthened monitoring positions of long-range aircraft, created training materials ice crystals, launched the re-engineering of the preparation and monitoring of flightsAs for the DGAC, it "does not know what to do" of the database in which are collected all incidents occurred during flights, as well as Florence Rousse, Director of Safety, was admitted last November 30 on Europe 1!The failure of feedback was demonstrated with the Concorde crash in July 2000, the Air France confirms 447.How they will try to defend themselves."The Pitot probes have failures, but these shortcomings are offset by a procedure applied by the crews," said Patrick Goudou, the head of the European Agency for Aviation Safety (EASA) November 18 in Paris. This communication strategy will be resumed in the next report of the BEA that we will "understand" if the pilot of flight AF 447 were unable to leave the dangerous situation caused by the blockage of pitot probes, is that they did not correctly apply the procedure.The blockage of pitot probe is a defect (not fail) linked to the architecture of these probes and certification standards obsolete. If the drivers have a responsibility to deal with failures of processes are well adapted, eliminating defects in a plane is the responsibility of the manufacturer and the bodies responsible for the airworthiness of aircraft.After the drama of flight AF 447, Airbus, EASA and all others, however, reminded drivers that in the case of inconsistency in the measured velocities must apply the procedure available to them. This gives, in addition, a false idea of the complexity of the problem. In fact, failure to succeed induced cascade leading to the execution ... 12 procedures and found that the BEA in its first report.This is not a training session in the simulator and this kind of very complex event does not always happen during a flight peaceful and good weather. As Murphy would say, it can also happen during the passage of the ITCZ (intertropical convergence zone very active), as turbulence and evasive storms, so in an area of very limited flight.From memory, the PF shall display incorrect values of thrust and attitude, values that will be corrected at page 4 of the procedure in question, if you're lucky enough to get that far, while the Christmas tree lights (alarms in all genres) accompanied by the sweet music of different horns. To make it, there may also be a false alarm "stall" but that must be met according to the instructions in force, a situation not comfortable but it is dealt with Air France in an unusual procedure that will require additional research feverishly good page of the document in question to get out.A system complexity, we add the complexity of procedures! It is very easy in these conditions, leaving an area of very limited flight (risk identified by the DGCA and the FAA in 2001!).According to the chronology of messages ACCARS, the crew of flight AF 447 has probably had a little thirty seconds to react to events that have succeeded.When it comes to obscure responsibility, the pilot line standard, which is neither a test driver or Buck Danny, is easy prey. Especially if he is not here to defend himself!The DGAC also confess!In its report on aviation security which has been (finally ...) published the DGAC on page 65 confirms that in 2008 more (how?) Events have been reported on the Airbus A320, A330 and A340 on wind data inconsistent attributed the ingestion of water or ice crystals by Pitot probes, that "these events have been analyzed by the specific manufacturer of the aircraft" and that "following the crash of flight AF447, a detailed review is conducted by the BEA. "We must recall that the DGAC trafficking incidents operating first by "combing" of events and lists them to follow more precisely to finally decide what action to take.We knew that the DGCA had issued no safety information or operational instructions about blocking pitot probes, we now know that this great institution to maintain the safety of air travel at its highest level has not even the analysis of these events!With Security 2008 report of the DGAC, also known now as the official list of serious incidents in 2008 to French operators of public transport has been a technical investigation of BEA. In this list of 5 incidents (page 30), there is no event related to the pitot probes!It should be recalled that in August 2008, the crew of an A-340 Air France en route Tananarive had issued a distress message "MAYDAY" following a blocked pitot probes in the region of Addis Ababa . This was probably not enough for the BEA survey ...

Regards.Gus.

[vololiberista 205]

re: the above. That's why UK pilots are rigorously trained "not" to fly through thunderstorms!!!!!!Vololiberista

[Guest CX355]

Are you referring to Air France, or the A330? I may be mistaken but neither are falling from the sky on a regular basis. The crew for whatever reason against all conventional wisdom and practice flew their aircraft into a very large and powerful storm, resulting in the loss of the aircraft. The question shouldn't be "why did it crash" - it should be "why did they fly into that storm?"Unfortunately I think the French investigative authorities will come to whatever is deemed to be the most politically expedient conclusion, just as they did with the Concorde crash.Nick

Sad, but probably true......bad press = Bad profits...I don't know who they can blame Airbus Industries or Air France...how will they square that?