JB- if you own the pax terminal you can tell it that you want the flights to go to smal/med/large airports, if thats what you mean by your revenue flightsNick- did you find out what the problem was?

Thanks... I sold all my FSE FBO's since they were justa Virtual Money Pit... I actually enjoy the system jobs sending me to unimproved strips anyway... It's a nice challenge and the J41 with the Zinc Chromate Paint Job looks good on the dirt strips in FSX. :( JB

Nick- did you find out what the problem was?

Noah,The symptoms were indicative of an overweight/misloaded airplane, so we had the baggage weighed when we got to IAD. We found that at takeoff, the airplane was above the performance limited MTOW by almost 800 pounds.On the stroke sheet, the ramp agents "forgot" to include almost 30 bags that were left over from a previous cancelled flight. They were mainline employees who typically worked 727's and 737's, and had gotten used to padding the bag count. While a thousand pounds might not get noticed on a 737, it's pretty obvious in a J41. Especially one that was already weight restricted due to temperature and field length.Regards,Nick

Noah,The symptoms were indicative of an overweight/misloaded airplane, so we had the baggage weighed when we got to IAD. We found that at takeoff, the airplane was above the performance limited MTOW by almost 800 pounds.On the stroke sheet, the ramp agents "forgot" to include almost 30 bags that were left over from a previous cancelled flight. They were mainline employees who typically worked 727's and 737's, and had gotten used to padding the bag count. While a thousand pounds might not get noticed on a 737, it's pretty obvious in a J41. Especially one that was already weight restricted due to temperature and field length.Regards,Nick

Ouch!!!!Unfortunately this happens all too often, especially now that it's harder for the air carriers to make a buck compared to years ago.. Nick, about what point in the takeoff roll did you "Pucker Up" LOL... Funny comment about the Seat cushion though.JB

Noah,The symptoms were indicative of an overweight/misloaded airplane, so we had the baggage weighed when we got to IAD. We found that at takeoff, the airplane was above the performance limited MTOW by almost 800 pounds.

Eerily similar to what happened to the Emirates A340-500 in Australia huh?Paul

Wow I hope the ramp crew, at the very least, got some 'training' on the problem.

Ouch!!!!Unfortunately this happens all too often, especially now that it's harder for the air carriers to make a buck compared to years ago.. Nick, about what point in the takeoff roll did you "Pucker Up" LOL... Funny comment about the Seat cushion though.JB

The pucker factor set in when the F/O put his hands on the column to help pull. That and the yellow edge lights zipping past.You're right though, this happens all the time...and not just on commuters. Do a quick search of the ASRS database to see just how frequently this happens, even on MD-80's and such.Nick

Wow I hope the ramp crew, at the very least, got some 'training' on the problem.

Pshhh! Not even a wrist slap. Express can't make Mainline do anything.I wish I had a dollar for everytime a Mainline station told me to "pound it" when I told them they had to stick around because I had filed them as an alternate for one of my flights. All complaining ever accomplished was to earn you phone call from an annoyed duty manager telling you to change the alternate to something far less desirable. And that children, is how an underworked/overpaid mainline ramp agent dictates operational policy to the SOC and costs the company a few thousand dollars in fuel, and maybe a bumped pax or two.But anyway, the crew filed an ASAP report, and maybe they got some additional info or closure from the ASAP committee, but I never heard another word about it.Nick

Since I was the OP, I wanted to chime in and thank you Nick and JB for your input.Nick, I specially found your story/posts interesting. Thanks for sharing them.Now a question somewhat unrelated to the J41. What about a jet engine? Does several minutes of over stressing a jet engine just up the maintenance bill or can it do actual damage while in operation?

Noah,The symptoms were indicative of an overweight/misloaded airplane, so we had the baggage weighed when we got to IAD. We found that at takeoff, the airplane was above the performance limited MTOW by almost 800 pounds.On the stroke sheet, the ramp agents "forgot" to include almost 30 bags that were left over from a previous cancelled flight. They were mainline employees who typically worked 727's and 737's, and had gotten used to padding the bag count. While a thousand pounds might not get noticed on a 737, it's pretty obvious in a J41. Especially one that was already weight restricted due to temperature and field length.Regards,Nick

Hi Nick,this is quite a story. Did the passengers notice anything?It is good to see you all came out well.Take care,Wijnand(EHBK)

Hi Nick,this is quite a story. Did the passengers notice anything?It is good to see you all came out well.Take care,Wijnand(EHBK)

Wijnand,By the nature of what had occurred, it was a very gentle affair. From any perspective other than in the cockpit, it would have appeared to be a normal takeoff followed by a straight out departure with a shallow climb.Nick

What about a jet engine? Does several minutes of over stressing a jet engine just up the maintenance bill or can it do actual damage while in operation?

It depends.Most modern jet engines are capable of safely delivering thrust in excess of the rated value for short periods of time without causing an immediate failure. But at a minimum, you will shorten the lifespan of the engine by several hundred hours or more.If the exceedance resulted in a very high EGT, then damage to the HPT blade tips is common. The Pinnacle CRJ that had the dual flameout at FL410 is a "good" example of this. Examination found that the HPT turbine blades had lost more than 80% of their area as they melted and resolidified further aft in the LPT section.Otherwise, all manner of problems are conceivable. Fan blade failures due to excessive rotational forces, flameouts or surging due to fuel metering or bleed demands, cracked/melted/deformed combustion chambers, etc.In all likelihood, if the exceedance was of a short duration, the engine will be ok, but you have to make a logbook entry, Mx will have to borescope the engine and do power assurance runs, and there will be all kinds of paperwork.On the other hand, if you had a "no-crap" emergency that necessitated a lengthy exceedance, or an exceedance of gross proportions, the engine will probably get you home, but the damage will significant and will likely need to be replaced.Nick