Where do I begin?

[Guest Nick527]

Hi,I'm using xp v7.63 and I recently got a copy of Goodway/Benedict Stratman's Boeing 737-800. I'm damned if I can get the effing thing to start. The manual which came with it has clearly been written assuming you spend ten hours a day in the plane and isnt much help for a simmer like me. What doesn't help is altho I'm using a 15.4-inch laptop, you cannot make out half the upper console switch names.A trawl of the net only elicited a u-tube video of the 737-800 startup on FS/FSX, and it was clearly made by a 17-year old baboon, who didn't stop to think the end use, ie me, might not want to see it rushed through at lightning speed. Even though I downloaded the video, on realplayer its impossible to slow it down. Not only that, but the fs9 cockpit is a great deal more detailed than Stratman's one, on top of which half the switches in fs9 differ greatly from his.I'm not interested in changing my laptop - it does me for everything else I need bar this issue with xplane - but I'm now at the stage of what to I do now, do I move to fs9 (fsx has no chance of running on my laptop, neither has xplane 9xx) or hope that sooner or later by chance someone might p-rick up Stratman's ears and get him to write a legible manual? I noticed someone else on here had asked exactly the same question about this exact issue of the 737-800 and the thread just ended abruptly (in 2005) without an answer. I've also fallen foul of the nasty attitude on the xplane forum and of the sarcastic wit of Randy Witt at their sales office and frankly there's no point going any further than with v7.63 so I'm hoping to either make the most of v7.63 for the moment or to change to fs9.If anyone could give me any advice re the 737-800 startup I'd be grateful, else I expect pcworld will be getting a visit from me to exchange some cash for a copy of fs9.Nick527Laptop - 1.6GHz Celeron, 1.25G ram, 256DDR shared graphics,

[Guest Callmecapt]

Hi NickMay I suggest you go to the current version of X Plane.V9.42V7 is extremely outdated. Goran

[Guest Nick527]

I tried to download it Goran, I'm on mobile broadband which would've taken days to download and eaten a huge hole in my broadband limit. On top of which it's way over the spec of my machine. If I could've walked into a shop and walked out with a copy I'd've done that and all I got was sarcasm from mr witt. I'm done with parting any investment to them.I guess what I'm trying to find is a successful way of starting the 737-800. It may then make xplane enjoyable enough to stick with.

[Guest Nick527]

WOW, twenty-one views and only one reply! That means twenty of you are stealing oxygen and should go watch tv instead. This is supposed to be INTERACTIVE.Never mind. I'll sort it out myself. You've given me the answer. The lack of response would indicate I would be better off with fs9, far far away from people who do not reply.GOODBYE

[Guest Callmecapt]

Nick,It appears you are assuming that Version 9 is a free download. However, Version 9 is not free. It must be purchased at either www.x-plane.com or www.x-plane.org. V9 is over 70GB and there is no way that would be made available for download.There is not much that will run on V7 these days. If an add on was made in version 9, there is no way it will run the way it is supposed to in V7.Also, not as many people frequent these forums as the forums at www.x-plane.org or www.x-pilot.com.Goran

[rightseater 0]

WOW, twenty-one views and only one reply! That means twenty of you are stealing oxygen and should go watch tv instead. This is supposed to be INTERACTIVE.Never mind. I'll sort it out myself. You've given me the answer. The lack of response would indicate I would be better off with fs9, far far away from people who do not reply.GOODBYE

Well that was uncalled for. X-Plane is a popular sim, but AVSIM tends to draw more in the MSFS crowd. But we do have a growing number of XP regulars here, and if you give them a little time I'm sure they would be more than happy to help you out as they have with me many times. If you're going to be so impatient, perhaps you'd be better off checking out x-plane.org, or whatever that other site is (someone fill in the blank here).*EDIT* X-Pilot.com, that's it. Didn't see Goran's post.

[Guest Nick527]

Sorry but I really got ticked off. I'd made it clear enough (or so I thought) in my initial post that changing the laptop or going for v9xx was not an option:""I'm not interested in changing my laptop - it does me for everything else I need bar this issue with xplane - but I'm now at the stage of what to I do now, do I move to fs9 (fsx has no chance of running on my laptop, neither has xplane 9xx)""..and I'd made it clearer still in my second post when I again stated I was trying to find "a successful way of starting the 737-800."However why is it that half the people I seem to encounter on forums just can't seem to read plain English text in front of them? Not only that but I wasn't asking for assistance in upgrading my version of xplane. I'm fairly happy with 7.63, but I'm unhappy at finding aircraft (free- and -payware) that often don't work properly on the version they are "designed for," and the manuals for them are often written on the assumption you're already a working First Officer.So already the main jist of what I was after was ignored - help in getting Strattmann's B737-800 startup sorted out - and then you get one comment which is totally inept, and in the busy hours for most of the US, you notice there are more "guests" than members looking, and not one of them's got anything to say!I'm not particularly impatient, but I find it so annoying when sites are chock-full of people but no one bothers to reply. If I was on a site, believe me I'd lock out anonymous guests, they're like the flotsam that reads the newspaper in the shop but won't pay for it.I also was not inferring v9xx was a (free) download, the trial version is; which I wanted to try in order to see if it would run on the laptop I do not want to replace, but again that moot point was read wrongly. There are also plenty which will run on v7 these days, but I don't doubt there are also plenty on v9xx which either don't run properly or are missing vital information from their manuals, like the model I'm asking for help with. I'm also not in any rush to try out a new version when it's planes may also be sometimes lacking.It's also incredibly insulting to be told the version you're on is outdated. Something is only outdated when it can't be run, and not everyone either wants to, or can afford to, change their pc every time laminar brings out a new version.On top of which upgrading xp is not easy if you don't use credit cards and you use mobile broadband. No shop stocks xplane, but they do stock msfs, and mobile broadband is prone to dropping downloads, so unless xp comes on a disk via the post no way to buy. I went out on a limb to try to download the demo, as it's a lot smaller.I found the xplane forums are all well and good if you like dealing with ignorant people who can't read properly and pontificate on problems you don't have, that's why I tried Avsim. Didn't expect one of them to already be here.

[Guest Callmecapt]

Ok NickIt's obvious from your post that I or anyone else cannot read or understand plain English as said (or typed in this case) by you. Version 7 is outdated. Just the same as FS2000 being outdated. They are both 2 versions ago. Sorry, it's a fact. There is very little support offered for it, and that is only from a select few people who are willing to keep that support going. Updates cannot even be downloaded from the official x-plane.com website.I apologize for wasting my time, and yours.I wish you the best in solving your problem. Something I have obviously failed to do.CheersGoran

[Janov 2,383]

Hi Nick, as posters before me said, there is less of an X-Plane crowd at this site than on some other sites (which I hope will change). I invite you to post a thread on the other forums about how to get the PMDG 747-400 to run on FS95. Let

[Geofa 108]

Sorry but I really got ticked off. I'd made it clear enough (or so I thought) in my initial post that changing the laptop or going for v9xx was not an option:""I'm not interested in changing my laptop - it does me for everything else I need bar this issue with xplane - but I'm now at the stage of what to I do now, do I move to fs9 (fsx has no chance of running on my laptop, neither has xplane 9xx)""..and I'd made it clearer still in my second post when I again stated I was trying to find "a successful way of starting the 737-800."However why is it that half the people I seem to encounter on forums just can't seem to read plain English text in front of them? Not only that but I wasn't asking for assistance in upgrading my version of xplane. I'm fairly happy with 7.63, but I'm unhappy at finding aircraft (free- and -payware) that often don't work properly on the version they are "designed for," and the manuals for them are often written on the assumption you're already a working First Officer.So already the main jist of what I was after was ignored - help in getting Strattmann's B737-800 startup sorted out - and then you get one comment which is totally inept, and in the busy hours for most of the US, you notice there are more "guests" than members looking, and not one of them's got anything to say!I'm not particularly impatient, but I find it so annoying when sites are chock-full of people but no one bothers to reply. If I was on a site, believe me I'd lock out anonymous guests, they're like the flotsam that reads the newspaper in the shop but won't pay for it.I also was not inferring v9xx was a (free) download, the trial version is; which I wanted to try in order to see if it would run on the laptop I do not want to replace, but again that moot point was read wrongly. There are also plenty which will run on v7 these days, but I don't doubt there are also plenty on v9xx which either don't run properly or are missing vital information from their manuals, like the model I'm asking for help with. I'm also not in any rush to try out a new version when it's planes may also be sometimes lacking.It's also incredibly insulting to be told the version you're on is outdated. Something is only outdated when it can't be run, and not everyone either wants to, or can afford to, change their pc every time laminar brings out a new version.On top of which upgrading xp is not easy if you don't use credit cards and you use mobile broadband. No shop stocks xplane, but they do stock msfs, and mobile broadband is prone to dropping downloads, so unless xp comes on a disk via the post no way to buy. I went out on a limb to try to download the demo, as it's a lot smaller.I found the xplane forums are all well and good if you like dealing with ignorant people who can't read properly and pontificate on problems you don't have, that's why I tried Avsim. Didn't expect one of them to already be here.

Nick-I suggest a change of attitude-real quick.

[Guest Nick527]

Hi JanIndeed the 737-800 I have does work with xp7, specifically "7.50 and above", it's available from http://www.eadt.eu/index.php?aircraft-for-x-plane-7, and it's even available for xp9xx. However altho the manual is easy to understand on v9xx, the manual for 7.63 is convoluted and ambiguous. Having sent an email to Strattmann at that address, I came across said thread on here from 2005 in which another member had exactly the same problem, which shows it's not a v9xx aircraft backdated - there's obviously a line of development. It's clearly now been addressed in v9xx as the v9xx manual is now a lot more detailed, but I can't get a response from the developer.Perhaps what I should have asked was if anyone (who now uses the 737-800 in v9xx) remembers what the routine was for 7.63 as I'm sure it was a big enough pain in the &@($* back then for someone to have found the answer. It's not a problem you'd forget over time.I also appreciate about the cost. The cost is nothing, it's the fact I can't run it and I'm damned if I'm going to treat my possessions as throwaway every time Laminar emits. I don't chuck away a perfectly good computer just because it's obsolete according to one program. If it breaks I have it repaired, if it expires then I chuck it.As said before, it's not so much the plane not working, more the manual for it is not descriptive enough for the startup procedure. Not being a 737 pilot, and not being familiar with the switch locations to know what does what in the absence of being able to read the switch names, the manual is gobbledegook. In all other areas the plane functions great, if you start with engines running all the time. Clearly I'm not the only one since 2004 who can't work out how to get it started, but someone other than the elusive designer must have come across the answer and I thought maybe I'd encounter one of them on here.As this particular plane's been developed from v7xx thru to v9xx it is/has been clearly popular and I'm sure this forum's users haven't just starting using xplane after v9xx; there must be a large percentage who used v7xx and they would have come across this plane and its problem. I'd be astonished if that isn't the case.I appreciate that v7.63 is an older program, but I think the answer I was given is perhaps symptomatic of why xplane always has been, and always will be, an also-ran to msfs; a 3rd party add-on has a paperwork problem so bin your laptop and upgrade xplane? You don't change your car when a fuze blows. And if your mechanic advised you to upgrade your car in that situation, I'm sure most responses would've been similar.Nick

[Janov 2,383]

Hi Nick,in a way I admire your attitude towards keeping hardware that is not broken, but just old. I feel some pain, too, when I throw some perfectly running hardware away, because it won

[Guest Nick527]

Hi JanThanks for your help and advice. Believe you me if my pc would run v9xx it would've been on my christmas list, from what I've seen it certainly looks fantastic.Where v7.63 suits me is that it's always been functional and the only deficit has been lesser graphics, but then if I'm passing Mt Rushmore I don't necessarily need to be able to zoom in on every wrinkle, as long as ground has green bits and sea has blue bits I'm happy. I'm not really fussed about airports not having buildings. So to me v9xx looks great althought its full of extra frills that while they're nice they're not really necessary.I have so far gotten on with the planes I've collected over the months, some good some bad, and I've gotten rid of a lot of those that were too identical, ie Airbus A320vA330, often no real difference from the inside in my opinion. So I'd gotten myself a core list of planes that are different, everything from Tristars to 727,747,767,777, Britannia/Viscount,BAe146(Avro 85/100). In the BAe146 example, the Avro 85 and 100 are identical from the seat so no real point keeping both. So for me having a small but different range is important, but it was real frustrating to have a plane like the 737-800 when it wouldn't work properly, correction; I couldn't work it properly because I was missing some of the information I needed.I understand what you mean about development costs, but it's frustrating when you see the amount of effort that went into writing the manual for this plane back in its v7.50 day, when the end result was wasted. The picture manual that now exists for the same plane as v9xx is brilliant, but unfortunately the panels have been completely redesigned for v9xx so much of it cannot be applied to the v7.50 one I have. It's just a shame when you have a great plane, but half of it is not available as a result. Especially when you look at some of the fs9 stuff that does what this one should.On the subject of the net, I did do a trawl for the startup procedure of the 737 and all I found was a video that's been done for the 737-500 on either fs9 or fsx. Unfortunately, as I say it looks like it's been made by a 17-year with ADHD - he zooms in and out at lightning speed, shifts from one switch to another before you can even establish what he's just pressed. It's enough to give you a headache. I cannot find anything else anywhere. Airliners.net is a good source of info, but that's all well and good if Strattmann has placed the switches in their correct positions as per the real item. Most of his switches' names are too small to read and I'd probably need a 42-inch tv screen to get them large enough to read, and that's if they're not still pixellated!And that's probably the crux of the whole problem, without the correct manual for the v7.50 737-800 (or someone who found out how to get it started back when they too had this issue), real articles/photos/checklists are likely going to be of little help if Strattmann has cut corners re the position of switches when he made the v7.50 version.Like I say, when I see the video I got of the plane in fs9 it kinda makes me wonder if it's really worth sticking with x-plane when I could go get fs9 and have it fully working instead of the compromise I've got now. It's just rather sad when you have to start up with engines running, do the fmcs and all else correctly except this.ThanksNick

[Janov 2,383]

Hi Nick,you are right, if you can

[Guest Nick527]

Hi JanThanks, appreciate your assistance. The startup sequence would be great, if only just to check/compare against what I've got. Maybe there's some way I can figure out what goes where.I'm going to try to put a screenshot of the 7.50 manual and the one from the v9xx into photo album and see if it may make sense to you. I think you'll see why it is so confusing.I wrote to Stratmann, but not hopeful of a response. I had hoped he might have replied if only because it looks like the issue was never resolved. Fuze & mechanic?Back in a bit after rummaging Control panel.ThxNick