I encountered this issue when flying FSX but it applies to the real world so I'm posting it here. I may misunderstand the boundaries of airspace, but the situation confounds me.My flight starts at KTDF and ends at KFAY (both in NC). Eventually I request transition of Pope AFB's (KPOB) Class C airspace, which I receive. I am to notify the controller when I'm clear. While still in KPOB's Class C, I enter Simmons AAF's (KFBG) Class D airspace. While still in KPOB's and KFBG's airspace, I enter KFAY's Class C airspace. I'm now within three airspaces simultaneously.As I get closer to KFAY I leave KFBG's airspace and shortly after that I leave KPOB's airspace (notifying both when I'm clear).With this sequence of airspace entries and exits, what sequence of communication (both for entry, and to notify when I'm clear) should I anticipate? MH

Check the charts at skyvector.com and lookup KPOB.The airspaces have altitude boundaries.The inner class C boundaries around KPOB and KFAY go from 0 to 4200 ft.The outer class C boundaries around KPOB and KFAY go from 1400 to 4200 ft.The class D around KFBG goes from 0 to 1400 ft.It does not overlap the inner class C spaces and is below the high class C spaces.Not sure where to put the boundary between KPOB's and KFAY's high class C spaces.In FS2004 the high class C space of KFAY is a full circle taking a 'bite' out of KPOB's high class C space.

Thanks jeroen79,I noticed the class C ceilings earlier, but they slipped my mind. I'll be at or above 4200 when I cross above KFAY's C space boundary at 10 miles out (I think that's the distance to the outer ring).So I'll have to descend quickly to reach pattern altitude of 1190. I suppose I could ease that a bit by dropping into what would be both KPOB's and KFAY's C spaces earlier but I think that wouldrequire ATC clearances from both, and I'm still not sure how to handle that. I may ruffle someone's feathers but they'll get medown safely and I'll find out what I should have done.A similar issue was discussed at: http://www.studentpilot.com/interact/forum/archive/index.php/t-22249.html so after gettingKFAY clearance to transition, I can either descend quickly or take a scenic route, flying a big circle as I descend more slowlyto pattern. Thanks for your reply.

You just need to get permission before entering the class C space of either airport.I see no reason why you cannot request and have permission for both class C spaces at the same time.If you don't want to deal with KPOB then you can just fly above it's class C and then enter KFAY's class C from above.How fast will you be flying?

You don't need clearance to enter Class C or D airspace. You need two-way comms. You have that when ATC responds with your tail no. If ATC just says "aircraft" you do not have two-way comms and must remain clear of the Class D or C. You need mode C transponder to enter Class C.

jeroen79 - I think I'd opt to bypass KPOB. I'd be cruising at about 100 kias, slowing to 90 as I near the pattern, then 78 to land. Note: I am only a simmer doing what FSX has suggested. It may not be what a real pilot would do for this.scott967 - I'm not questioning you, but I'm persistent for a reason. I realize that two-way comm and mode C xponder are required, and I have both. However, everywhere I've looked I've seen Class C and D Airspace Requirements and Limitations similar to:"Establish and maintain two-way communication," which is what you said is the only requirement. I have understood (incorrectly, I'm now thinking) that I establish comm by requesting Class C transition clearance just before I enter it. That's because if I don't contact the airport on my own, FSX prompts me, just before entering the Class C, to request transition clearance. Only after I'm cleared and inside the airspace, have I been requesting landing clearance.However, if my reason for entering the Class C is to land, should my first action be to contact the Tower (not Approach) before I enter the Class C and request landing clearance? For example, suppose I'm VFR, intending to make a full stop landing at KRDU. Shortly before I enter their Class C, is the following exchange the right way to do this?Raleigh Tower, Cessna N191KI is 14 miles northeast with Mike, to land. Cessna N191KI, Raleigh Tower. Make left traffic, runway 5L. Altimeter 2992.Fly left traffic runway 5L, Cessna 1KI. (and communications proceed as I would expect after that)This is concise. Is it the right way? If I request transition before requesting landing clearance, a considerably longer exchange takes place, keeping the freq and the controller tied up longer.What's the right thing to do?MH

If you're approaching class C airspace to land, you should call approach. Maybe you don't technically HAVE to, but it's the right thing to do. It doesn't cost anything extra and it gets you on their radar sooner.You don't have to request an airspace transition. It's redundant. A "transition" is what you use when you want to go through the airspace without landing.So you're on the right track, but I would strongly recommend calling approach. It'd go something like this:"Raleigh Approach, Cessna 191KI." (This is called a "courtesy call." You're about to give him a lot of information, but he might not have his pencil yet.)"Cessna 191KI, Raleigh Approach, go ahead." (Now he's telling you he's ready.)"Approach, Cessna 191KI is 25 south, 4,500, with Raleigh-Durham information Mike, to land Raleigh-Durham.""Cessna 191KI, squawk 0301. Raleigh altimeter 2985.""Squawk 0301, altimeter 2985, Cessna 191KI." (Always read back an altimeter setting, and don't shorten your callsign unless he does it first.)As soon as the controller (approach or tower) acknowledges your tail number, you're legal to enter the class C, so don't worry about that. Just keep going until he tells you otherwise, but expect to be vectored once you're in radar contact. When you're about 5 miles out, the approach controller will hand you off to tower, who will give you instructions about pattern entry and landing order.Talking to approach will also alleviate any confusion with complicated airspace like in your original situation. You won't have to worry about when to call what tower, because you're in contact and approach will tell you whom to call and when.Don't be afraid to talk to approach. Those guys are there for a reason. There are lots of other airplanes in and around Class C, and approach will help you find them. Sometimes when you ARE in radar contact, approach will say something like "Traffic is on your two o'clock, three miles, VFR, type unknown, indicating 2,500 feet." That means there's somebody out there who isn't talking to him, but is close to you, and nobody has any idea who he is or where he's going. Don't be "that guy." :crazy:DaveCFI

Just what I'm looking for! Thank you!I'm still not quite clear however, how to handle the overlapping KPOB and KFAY space. When I entered KPOB's the controller asked me tonotify when clear. Before I can do that I'm in KFAY's space preparing to land. How would I notify KPOB that he doesn't need to keep trackof me anymore? This wouldn't be the first time he/she has handled people like me so maybe they're satisfied if I just notify where I am andthat I'm landing at KFAY. What do you think?

I'll have a look at the charts tomorrow. There's no such thing as overlapping airspace, though. You're in one or the other. If you're talking to approach, they can clear you through any of it and you'll remain on their frequency until they hand you off to tower at your destination. If the other airspace is very close, like a military field right next to the one you're going to, they will advise you how to remain clear or that airspace on your way to the destination. If you're worried, though, you can monitor the other tower's frequency on your other radio, if you've gOops... I was saying you can monitor the other tower's frequency on your second radio, if you have one. FS ATC is kind of it's own thing, and I don't know much about it as I don't use it. But in the real world, that's how it works: call approach, and follow instructions. They'll tell you who to call next. And if you're ever confused, just ask. Getting you questions answered beyond any shadow of ambiguity is the mark of a professional and never looks nearly as dumb as busting airspace. Hope this helps,Dave

Haven't heard from you in a week. Maybe the answer to my issue is too obvious to bother with. Let me continue withthe flight that started all this. If you were flying from KTDF into KFAY, how would you handle the KPOB/KFAY airspace? The easiest way would seem to be to stay above all Class C until you're above KFAY's, then start to descend. Butwouldn't you have to descend pretty quickly? Or would you prefer to descend earlier into KPOB's (at which point you'dalso be descending into KFAY's) and make your descent more comfortable for your passengers (they might not like theice cubes flying out of their glasses).On the other hand, if the ceiling were low and you had to fly through all the Class C, what would you expect the commexchange to be with all the controllers that might be involved?MH

You don't have to force a steep dive when descending into the airspace.If you fly at 4500 ft and descend at 500 ft/min then it will take 7 minutes to get down to 1000 ft. If your groundspeed is 100 kts then you will travel 12 nm horizontally in this time.At 1000 ft/min it will take 3.5 minutes and 6 nm.You can also fly around a bit if you need to fly a longer distance while descending before going to the pattern.If you have two radios then you can tune them to both airfields.

Thanks. I thought about the radio thing. I can listen on both comm radios at the same time, but I can onlytransmit on one at a time. So I could dial the freqs for both controllers into COMM1 then toggle back andforth. I'd hear both and can reply to one or the other as needed.However, listening to two freqs could be hard to understand with traffic speaking on both at the same time.I guess that's the best way to do this.

Your audiopanel should let you select which radio is used to transmit.

You're overthinking this way too much. For som reason people treat airspace like lava they can't touch. Call up the controller 20 miles before and transit through.

Sorry I didn't get back to you.Like Chris said, though, it's really not too complicated. I just looked at the charts on SkyVector. Here's how I would do that flight VFR:I would file for KTDF BILLA RDU KFAY with an initial cruising altitude of 5,500 to go right over the top of KRDU. As soon as I hit BILLA, I'd call Raleigh Approach on 125.3 (see the white box northeast of RDU) and request flight following to Fayetteville. I'd expect him to assign me a squawk and an altitude.I might get handed off to another RDU approach controller on the south side, or they might just hand me off to Fayetteville Approach on 125.175. Once I was past KRDU, I'd ask for a lower altitude (2,500 or so) to start down into KFAY. Since I'm talking to approach, I don't need to worry about "busting" Pope's airspace, or Ft. Bragg. At the appropriate time, approach will hand me off to Fayetteville tower. Easy day.You can go direct, too, and the comm flow remains the same. But with a busy airport like RDU, it's actually better to fly right over the top, since that's the one place you know you'll be out of the flow of landing and departing traffic.There seems to be a fear of airspace and controllers when you're just starting out. I had it, too. Best thing to do is just push through it and get some experience talking on the radio as soon as you've got "aviate" and "navigate" under control. Being in radar contact is much less stressful than wondering if you're going to bust airspace or mess up traffic. It actually makes your life as a pilot easier, not harder, when you're just flying point to point. So learn it, use it, love it.Again, sorry for the delayed response, and hope everything's cleared up.Dave