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Dave-Pilot2ATC

SayIt Errors and Issues

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Use this pinned topic to report all issues with the SayIt function, including

  1. Missing Suggested Phrases
  2. Wrong Suggested Phrases
  3. Missing Selectable Phrases
  4. Phrases that are not recognized (No green text after pilot says them)
  5. Any other issues specific to the SayIt function

When reporting such errors, in addition to your explanation of the problem, please include the text of the Speech Text Window as an attachment.

 

To get the background color, you can use a text editor's highlight feature or page color.  Then paste into an image program like Paint and attach it to the post.  Don't forget to select the Attach This File after the upload.

1SayItError.png

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Dave, you and your team are doing a great job, and this is not to report an error, more a shortcoming due to lack if experience on my part.

 

My problem is for example, in mid flight, mid route, ATC tells me "to contact Center on XXX.X", I dial in the frequency and the sayit options come up, but I am not sure whether to say anything or wait until Center contacts me.

 

And if I do say something, what should it be, just to let them know I am there?

 

I am scared of doing the wrong thing and then being ignored and carrying on undirected into oblivion!

 

Thanks for all your hard work, it is much appreciated.

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Hi John,

 

When handed over to another controller use the report selection on the sayit feature, then select report altitude.  It took me a little while to discover that and it's seems to be the only logical response to give when handed over.

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Thanks Dean,

 

That is really helpful.

 

It is simple things like that, for those unfamiliar with the software or even ATC protocol, that can get very troubling especially when things don't quite work as they should and you don't know if it is something you have done wrong, or a glitch in the program.

 

John

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Hi  John

Hope you don't mind if I hi-jack your thread but I would like to ask Dave and Dean (Andayle) a question

as I have not been able to crack the problem I have.

 

 

I am climbing to initial height of 8000 feet and am using only the Sayit function for communication with ATC using an enabled joystick button.

I am advised to contact departure on 118.20 and this is where the confusion for me begins. I change to 118.20 and in speech assistant request

there is no selection for "report altitude" as Dean advised in his advice to John. The only option I have basically is "to altitude " and the only options available are

<call sign>request climb to <altitude> or <call sign> request descent to <altitude> and that means using Push to Talk setup function with eg keyboard button (k). I was hoping to avoid that with this program or am I missing the obvious.

 

Any input/advice would be appreciated.

 

Noel Southam

noels7

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I have noticed that too Noel, you are told "you can say xxxxx", but you can not use the sayit function, which seems strange.

An option with the "~" does not appear, so you can't just press the sayit button to communicate.

 

I am using the sayit method at the moment to get the hang of how it all works before I move on to try to use voice, so I am stumped when I can't use sayit, albeit temporarily.

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Hi Noel and John,

When you first contact a controller, you are "Reporting In", so you want to look at the Report phrases.  There, if you're climbing, use the ToAltitude phrase type to get something like <CallSign> climbing to FL 230;  If you are level, use the CurrentAltitude phrase type for a <CallSign> level at FL 230.

 

The automatic readbacks are generated for you.  Probably 80-90% of them only require pushing the SayIt button.  Some, however, require you to report back some information or make a decision before answering, like when you are asked for the desired approach type.  In  these cases, there is no "~" and therefore you either need to speak yourself, or select the proper phrase from the dropdowns, like you would for requests or information.

 

Hope this helps,

Dave

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Thanks Dave, it all helps to make things clearer! As you say it is a steep learning curve.

 

You mentioned being asked for a desired approach type....as far as I can recall from my few flights I have been approaching the destination airport but have not been asked for a preferred type, in fact I have had to open the drop down to access the approach options and choose one without any request to do so from "approach" first.

 

Is that correct?

 

thanks again,

John

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Yes, that is correct.  It would be rare to be asked, but there is at least one circumstance, I think, where that would happen. 

If you don't have the ATC Assigns STARs and Approaches option checked, then you will have to request the approach.  If you do have it checked and you're on an IFR flight plan to an airport with approaches, you should get the assignment automatically.

 

Thanks,

Dave

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I've been having several "unhandled exceptions" with and without the Sayit function. The last one I was simply sending text, nothing out of the ordinary. Exception noted below. I simply clicked passed the exception this time and it continue to work:

 

 

Latest version of P3D
 
Occurred while using Sayit feature accessing taxi request
 
 
 
 
 
 
See the end of this message for details on invoking 
just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.
 
************** Exception Text **************
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
   at Pilot2ATC_200.frmP2AMain.e(Object A_0, EventArgs A_1)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ListBox.OnSelectedIndexChanged(EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ListBox.WmReflectCommand(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ListBox.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)
 
 
************** Loaded Assemblies **************
mscorlib
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1073.0 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
Pilot2ATC_200
    Assembly Version: 2.0.0.1
    Win32 Version: 2.0.0.1
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Drawing
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1068.2 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
Microsoft.VisualBasic
    Assembly Version: 10.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 14.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Core
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
P2A_Globals
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
P2AData
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
P2A_Controls
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
System.Xml
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1064.2 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
P2AFly
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
System.Management
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Deployment
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Configuration
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
EntityFramework
    Assembly Version: 6.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 6.0.20911.0
----------------------------------------
GMap.NET.Core
    Assembly Version: 1.7.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.7
----------------------------------------
System.Data
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.ServiceModel
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
EntityFramework.SqlServer
    Assembly Version: 6.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 6.0.20911.0
----------------------------------------
Anonymously Hosted DynamicMethods Assembly
    Assembly Version: 0.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1073.0 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
System.Transactions
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Numerics
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Data.OracleClient
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Web
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1073.0 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
P2ASim
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
SlimDX
    Assembly Version: 4.0.13.43
    Win32 Version: 
----------------------------------------
System.Speech
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
GMap.NET.WindowsForms
    Assembly Version: 1.7.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.7
----------------------------------------
P2ASpeech
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
P2AWeather
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.0.0
----------------------------------------
FSUIPCClient
    Assembly Version: 2.4.0.0
    Win32 Version: 2.4.0.0
----------------------------------------
System.Xml.Linq
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.EnterpriseServices
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
EntityFrameworkDynamicProxies-P2AData
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 6.0.20911.0
----------------------------------------
System.Runtime.Serialization
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Web.Extensions
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1073.0
----------------------------------------
Microsoft.GeneratedCode
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1064.2 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
Accessibility
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
Microsoft.GeneratedCode
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1064.2 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
System.Data.SQLite
    Assembly Version: 1.0.84.0
    Win32 Version: 1.0.84.0
----------------------------------------
Microsoft.GeneratedCode
    Assembly Version: 1.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1064.2 built by: NETFXREL3STAGE
----------------------------------------
NAudio
    Assembly Version: 1.6.0.0
    Win32 Version: 1.6.0.0
----------------------------------------
SMDiagnostics
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.ServiceModel.Internals
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.ServiceModel.Channels
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.ServiceModel.Web
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
System.Net.Http
    Assembly Version: 4.0.0.0
    Win32 Version: 4.6.1038.0 built by: NETFXREL2
----------------------------------------
 
************** JIT Debugging **************
To enable just-in-time (JIT) debugging, the .config file for this
application or computer (machine.config) must have the
jitDebugging value set in the system.windows.forms section.
The application must also be compiled with debugging
enabled.
 
For example:
 
<configuration>
    <system.windows.forms jitDebugging="true" />
</configuration>
 
When JIT debugging is enabled, any unhandled exception
will be sent to the JIT debugger registered on the computer
rather than be handled by this dialog box.

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Thanks very much for 20012, seems much more stable and I have not had an "exception" so far while using it.

 

Now I am completing flights more successfully regularly, I notice that I am finding it hard to deal with all the ATC instructions that sometimes get spoken in very quick succession.

 

There is no time sometimes to choose and acknowledge the instruction, dial in whatever is required, action it, before being hit with another one or two instructions, sometimes almost simultaneously.

 

Is it possible to perhaps have a reasonable time gap between ATC instructions, in order to get things organised before getting another?

 

Matbe I am just too slow off the mark!

 

John

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John,

Unfortunately the ATC commands are event driven and can happen at any time.  In real life, of course, the Controller can easily put together several unrelated commands into one phrase and then you can read them back at one time.  I am continuing to try and improve on this, so for example, you will often get a climb or descent instruction combined with a frequency change so that the altitude instruction doesn't get lost while you're changing frequencies.  So eventually, this should improve over time, but it will likely never be perfect.

 

In the mean time, for the sake of enjoying the flight, just forget about reading back those instructions that come at you too fast.  A good example is successive heading changes during vectoring.  It won't affect the flight as long as you heard them and comply.  This often happens in the real world during the first part of a vector you might get a heading correction before you have a chance to read back the first heading.  Just read back the last one.

 

There are very few read backs that are required by the program to stay on track, and none of them are in the air, so you can relax.

 

Hope this helps,

Dave

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Once again thanks, Dave.

 

I'll try not to get into a panic trying to keep up with all the instructions!

 

John

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Hi Dave,

Sorry to add to your burden but I have come across this 'confusion?' which might well be me not understanding the procedure but anyway.....

Below is the speech of part of a VFR flight where I contact Approach and ask for a visual straight-in which is approved. ATC then says I don't have approach clearance though I thought I already had it?

After a long time muddling through I realize that ATC wants to know what 'pattern' of approach I want.

Would it be clearer if ATC asked "What sort of approach pattern would you like?"

I have probably misunderstood something and if so I offer my most profuse apology.

Thank you for a wonderful program

Dave Simmons

 

    Oscar Victor Bravo Request Visual Straight In Runway Two Two;
State Change to: ClearedForApproach
Oscar Victor Bravo Visual Straight In approved.  Call 5 mile final for Runway Two Two
     Cleared for Visual Straight In Runway Two Two Gulf Oscar Victor Bravo;
Gulf Oscar Victor Bravo You don't have an approach clearance yet.  What sort of approach would you like?
                          (???????)
    Oscar Victor Bravo Request Left Base Runway Two Two;
Oscar Victor Bravo Pattern direction is LEFT  Expect to  overfly the airport at , Two Thousand , One Hundred feet  then enter on LEFT downwind  for Runway Two Two at ROCHESTER GREATER INT
    Will expect to  overfly the airport at , Two Thousand , One Hundred feet  then enter on

    LEFT downwind  for Runway Two Two Gulf Oscar Victor Bravo

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Hi Dave.

I think the problem is that when you repeated the clearance, some background or stray sound turned your "Oscar Victor Bravo" call sign into "Gulf Oscar Victor Bravo", so P2A told Gulf Oscar Victor Bravo that they didn't have an approach clearance yet.

 

Then, when you requested Left Base, P2A interpreted that as a request for a standard VFR pattern, and gave directions for how to enter the pattern.  If you were calling Left Base, you should say "Oscar Victor Bravo Left Base, Runway Two Two".  If using SayIt, this would be under Reports-Pattern Position.

 

 

Hope that helps.

Dave

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Hi Dave,

I have a problem with loading and speech assistant missing grammar text.

 

Pilot2ACT 2016 v 2.0.1.3 - 

Win 10 64bit ugraded to latest ver..-

Xplane,FSX,P3D 

 

Using any sim, started first.

 

On loading P2A map is missing 2nd 3rd load it appears, other items appear normal IE. load waypoints open config etc: connects to sim ok showing connected, recognition , grammar loaded blue. Flight plan loads validates and filed, first waypoint red.   Then bring up speech assistant white boxes req,info,report shows relivent item in 2nd box but no yellow grammar appears on selection of any item.  Spoken requests not recognized either! Grammar helper has given up as well now, before I could get some response from voice recognition but no text prashes appeared.

 

I am reluctant to delete and reinstall program ( lose reg key) or update to 2.0.1.4 until I get some advise on what maybe the cause IE: Win10 latest ver or something going on with my comp as while I type this note P2ATC opens up even though I have exited out :) very strange first time for that one. I have searched forum for any clues but this seems a problem at my end.

 

 

Regards,

John

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John,

The behavior you describe is indeed strange.

First, I would suggest you apply the 2.0.1.4 update as that will refresh the Grammar Help file used by SayIt and eliminate that as the possible problem.

Second, be sure you are on a valid frequency.  SayIt uses the frequency to select the phrases for that controller type.

 

Grammar helper does not interact with Pilot2ATC Controllers.  It is only for reference and practice. 

 

Check to be sure that something is not causing your CPU or memory to be at high utilization.  Open Windows Task Manager and see what the CPU and Memory percent utilizations are. 

 

Let us know what happens.

Dave

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Thank,s for the prompt response and advise Dave,

 

I did the upgrade to 2014 as suggested now after a few hiccups everything seems to work OK!

 

I started P2ATC but still no yellow phrases after restarting a few times with no result I found that the update had installed as a second folder IE: c:/Pilot2ATC_200/ Pilot2ATC_200/ which looked like having 2 instillation's the original 2013 with 2014 inside without the data file so all I have done to get it working was copy the data from 2013 to 2014 folder and it,s working not sure if that was how it should have been fixed but you can advise me on alternative. (hope you can follow my attempt at explaining)

 

 

I have deleted nothing just left the folder,s as they are just copied over the data file.

 

Not sure how or what file or attachment to send you for verification.

 

Regards,

John  

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John,

Assuming the original installation was to the C:/Pilot2ATC_200 folder, I would suggest you

1)make sure that the C:/Pilot2ATC_200/Data folder contains a copy of the database files

2)delete the C:/Pilot2ATC_200/Pilot2ATC_200 folder and all its contents. 

3)apply the 2.0.1.4 update to the C:/Pilot2ATC_200 folder. 

4)be sure the shortcut icon points to the correct folder/file

 

If that doesn't work, then uninstall the entire program and install the base program followed by the 2.0.1.4 update.  Send me an email so I can reset the registration server to allow a new installation.

 

Regards,

Dave

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Dave,

I have followed your suggestion,

 

Deleted the second folder

When applying  the update I noticed that it  made the C:/Pilot2ATC_200/Pilot2ATC_200 folder 

manually adjusted to C:/Pilot2ATC before activating the exec update so it would install to root folder .

 

Appears all is working well  :wink: 

 

My bad for not noticing this last time.

 

Thank you for your prompt service to all your customers, this is indeed a complex piece of software and helps to keep the 

gray matter alive..........

 

Cheers,

John

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I have a few problems with or without sayit. First with sayit I type in the text in the gold lettering and he says it but it is extremely fast. Do not know how to slow his speech down. Then when I say my phrase or use the sayit function it keeps saying aircraft repeat your phrase and call sign. I cant even get in the air to find out if anything else is malfunctioning.

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The speech speed can be set for each voice in the Voices tab of Config.  Enter a negative value to slow the speech down.

 

The SayIt feature works with pre-written phrases.  Typing into the text window is not how to use it.

 

You need to be sure and do the Windows Language training that is accessed through the Grammar Help screen.  That will improve recognition.

 

You then must say phrases that are in the grammar.  The best way to do that is to read the phrases that are in SayIt.  If a particular phrase is not understood, see if there is another phrase with the same meaning and try that.

 

Dave

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The "Say again" function is not working.  After receiving a P2A instruction to change frequencies, if I say "Say again for corporate 001", I get no response from P2A.    If I press the Sayit button, I also get no response frm P2A.

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TJ,

I just tried it on the released version and the SayIt feature seems to work fine.  The Say Again does not seem to work.

 

In the upcoming release under development, they both seem to work fine.

 

Thanks for the report.

Dave

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