Helicopter technical question

[roi1862 611]

Hi guys, as the Airbus helicopter addon getting better and better I gave it a try. I really like the advanced flight model for the added realism and at low speed I really enjoy maneuvering with the padels.

Now, I'm not really sure what supposed to happen during cruise. There is a trimmer for pitch cyclic but what happens with the anti torque? Does the pilot need constant pressure on the pedals to keep the nose heading where needed ? Does the real thing for a way to trim the anti torque forces ? 

[Will Fly For Cheese 1,710]

Constant pressure on the pedals. Yes.

[Paraffin 2,197]

Not the same pressure in cruise that you'd need for countering torque in a hover, due to the "windvane" effect of the tail that tends to keep the fuselage pointed in the direction of travel. Very little pressure at all in some types.

In a medium to large helicopter you'd probably be on 3-axis or 4-axis autopilot in cruise anyway.

[jimcarrel 688]

You constantly have 3 things to fiddle with, cyclic, pedals, collective. Move any one of those and you will have to adjust the other two. It's the old adage, "balancing on the head of a pin". Helicopters are like bumble bees. Mathmaticly they shouldn't fly. Thats what makes them so fun.

[Paraffin 2,197]

11 minutes ago, jimcarrel said:

You constantly have 3 things to fiddle with, cyclic, pedals, collective. Move any one of those and you will have to adjust the other two. It's the old adage, "balancing on the head of a pin". Helicopters are like bumble bees. Mathmaticly they shouldn't fly. Thats what makes them so fun.

It's true that in a hover you're balancing on a pin, or trying to balance on top of a big rubber ball, another description I've heard. And yes, it's fun!

However, that changes during translation to forward flight. At cruise speed and out of ground effect, you're basically flying the rotor almost like a solid disk airfoil (with some complications like retreating blade stall). There is much more stability, and the feel of the flight controls is more like flying a fixed wing aircraft. 

 

[martinboehme 506]

Keep in mind also that in a real helicopter, there is no centering force on the anti torque pedals against which you would need to maintain a constant pressure. Unlike a fixed wing aircraft, there is no particular "center position" for the pedals. So if you can remove the spring on your rudder pedals, that makes for a more realistic helicopter experience. 

[Bobsk8 12,836]

35 minutes ago, martinboehme said:

Keep in mind also that in a real helicopter, there is no centering force on the anti torque pedals against which you would need to maintain a constant pressure. Unlike a fixed wing aircraft, there is no particular "center position" for the pedals. So if you can remove the spring on your rudder pedals, that makes for a more realistic helicopter experience. 

I used to fly copters in P3D, and I had a joystick where I changed the springs so that very little force was used to move the cyclic. Made it much easier to hover. 

[lupedelupe 316]

8 hours ago, roi1862 said:

... I really like the advanced flight model for the added realism ...

I'd hate to break it to you, but it doesn't even remotely behave like a real helicopter.

* Not knocking the dev: he/she/they are doing the best they can with the hobbled system Asobo provided.

[Paraffin 2,197]

38 minutes ago, martinboehme said:

Keep in mind also that in a real helicopter, there is no centering force on the anti torque pedals against which you would need to maintain a constant pressure. Unlike a fixed wing aircraft, there is no particular "center position" for the pedals. So if you can remove the spring on your rudder pedals, that makes for a more realistic helicopter experience. 

Good point. I've reduced the centering force on my Saitek Pro Combat pedals as much as I can, but that little center detent is still annoying when flying helicopter sims. One of these days I'll upgrade to better pedals that don't have a center detent.
 

1 minute ago, Bobsk8 said:

I used to fly copters in P3D, and I had a joystick where I changed the springs so that very little force was used to move the cyclic. Made it much easier to hover. 

Another good point. I use a Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS system. A few years ago, I found a web page showing how easy it is to remove the big mainspring that causes a strong self-centering force. I left the much smaller springs that only cause a very light centering force. It's so light that the stick will stay flopped over to the side if I put it there. This makes the Warthog stick much more precise for flying helicopters, and it still works fine with that ultra-light centering for civilian or combat flight sims. 

For flying helicopters it would be even better with a long stick extension, which is available from some modders I think? It would be a little less twitchy. I haven't done that yet because I still want to use this stick for other sims and games, but I might one day. The reason many of us have trouble flying helicopters in a sim is because we're using these short-throw joysticks that aren't ideal for it. 

[Bobsk8 12,836]

8 minutes ago, Paraffin said:

Good point. I've reduced the centering force on my Saitek Pro Combat pedals as much as I can, but that little center detent is still annoying when flying helicopter sims. One of these days I'll upgrade to better pedals that don't have a center detent.
 

Another good point. I use a Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS system. A few years ago, I found a web page showing how easy it is to remove the big mainspring that causes a strong self-centering force. I left the much smaller springs that only cause a very light centering force. It's so light that the stick will stay flopped over to the side if I put it there. This makes the Warthog stick much more precise for flying helicopters, and it still works fine with that ultra-light centering for civilian or combat flight sims. 

For flying helicopters it would be even better with a long stick extension, which is available from some modders I think? It would be a little less twitchy. I haven't done that yet because I still want to use this stick for other sims and games, but I might one day. The reason many of us have trouble flying helicopters in a sim is because we're using these short-throw joysticks that aren't ideal for it. 

I found that you had to play with the stick tension if you were using it for both fixed wing  and copters. One mod involved using zip ties to put around a couple of spring coils to reduce the springs effect ( hope that is understandable). I found if the stick flopped over like you mentioned, it made it a bit difficult to fly fixed wing. ( for me anyway).