>Try flying the cessna upside down-its' engine doesn't quit>like it would in real life either.>> Once you get outside of what is the expected reasonable>normal flight envelope you can do all kinds of screwy>things-but then one could argue that one isn't simulating>anymore. I'd prefer ms to get it more correct in the normal>flight parameters than ones that would be never done in the>real world anyway.>>I haven't met a pilot yet who flew a cessna upside down (did>hear of one who rolled a 172 so smoothly the engine didn't>have time to quit)-also haven't met a pilot (at least alive)>that tried to land by pointing the nose down at 1100 fpm and>letting go.>>Probably why many haven't noted this-it frankly wouldn't have>occured to me to fly a plane in this fashion. :-)A little curious why you think the default Cessna would quit flying upside down? The SP engine is fuel injected, so in theory it shouldn't quit, since fuel should be forced into the injectors. (Not that you would want to fly a C172 upside down in the first place!) I thought that was one of the benefits of Fuel injection in aircraft engines?

The fuel is gravity fed on the high wing. On a low wing you have a fuel pump and a backup fuel pump. Once the fuel gets to the injectors it is delivered in a better and more precise fashion than a carburetor-but you still either need gravity or a pump to get the fuel there. But I could be wrong-I haven't flown any new Cessna's -only old ones :-) http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

>The fuel is gravity fed-I don't think fuel injection would change that-but I could be wrong.

Suggest you google "gravity fed cessna".Edit-I went to the cessna site. What they mention is the difference between older models and the new is "Auxiliary electric fuel pump (backup to the engine driven fuel pump)".So it could be because of the engine driven fuel pump that they could fly invereted without quiting-but the fuel injection would not have to do with it-otherwise why would they need a engine driven/backup fuel pump? The older Cessna's for sure no.http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

The SP does have a fuel pump and is modeled in FS, however, I just tested it, and the 172 doesn't stall even if the fuel pump is off!!

If it is like my plane-the pump should be left off except for starting and in case the engine driven pump fails in flight (and possibly low position for high density altitudes).Turning on the pump could cause trouble though-I am sure none of this is modelled.http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

Have you watched the AI land a Maule yet? Yikes!!!!It bounces the thing 10 feet in the air a couple of times. I wonder what it's descent rate is under AI control???Thomas[a href=http://www.flyingscool.com] http://www.flyingscool.com/images/Signature.jpg [/a]I like using VC's :-)N15802 KASH '73 Piper Cherokee Challenger 180

Hmm, Geof, you know lots more than me, but it was my understanding that the pump was useful in emergencies, and that, as you note, leave it off except at takeoff. But I was told to leave it off not because it can cause trouble, but, the more you use it, the closer you will bring it to failure due to life expectancy.Thomas[a href=http://www.flyingscool.com] http://www.flyingscool.com/images/Signature.jpg [/a]I like using VC's :-)N15802 KASH '73 Piper Cherokee Challenger 180

Intersting-makes sense! It really depends on the plane and not having flown a new 172 I have no idea what they recommend. An archer or arrow you turn it on at takeoff and before landing-a one position switch on or off-I assume your cherokee is the same?. A Bonanza you leave it off except for starting and if the engine driven pump fails.The Baron gets a little more complicated-from my Baron manual:"During normal operation each engine uses its own fuel pumps to draw fuel from its respective wing fuel system. An individual two-speed electric auxiliary fuel pump is provided for each engine. HIGH pressure, OFF or LOW pressure is selected with each auxiliary fuel pump switch. High pressure is used for providing fuel pressure before starting, and provides near maximum engine performance, should the engine-driven pump fail. Low pressure may be used in any operating mode to eliminate pressure fluctuations resulting from high ambient teperatures and/or high altitudes. The high pressure position should NOT be selected while the engine is operating except in the event of engine-driven pump failure since the high pressure mode supplies a greater pressure than can be accepted by the injection system during normal operation.My ex Debonair also had the similar precaution though was only a 1 postition pump.http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

Other requirements for pro-longed inverted flight.Inverted oil system, as most oil systems are gravity to the oil sump; and fuel tank "flop" tube. The flop tube is flexible, so that it will lay on the bottom of the tank; whichever is the bottom.L.Adamson

Thanks Larry-good info for those of us who don't go upside down often! Only time I ever did it was in a friends rv6-but you know all about that! :-)http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg

My RealAir FSX 260 suffered a collapsing nose strut and stopped prop. Real life scenario would have been strut damage, possible firewall damage, and bent prop; as well as engine tear down to inspect the crank.FSX Cessna --- no bounceFS9 Cessna --- one bounceReality --- since I haven't suffered a real life nose first landing, I guess I tend to keep the nose up in simulated flight too! :D I like the way the models that I fly in FSX........land. I like the way my RealAir Spitfire in FS9 lands...L.Adamson