I'll be stunned if they have actually achieved this. Atmospheric ion propulsion usually involves miniscule thrust.

I suspect there's still a small fan present.

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/drone-powered-by-ion-propulsion-promises-noise-levels-below-70-db-uses-no-propellers-187806.html

 

Looks and sounds like ducted fan propulsion, which is not new.

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by stans

46 minutes ago, stans said:

Looks and sounds like ducted fan propulsion, which is not new.

 

Well I doubt they are telling blatant lies, so there must be some ionic propulsion involved. But if its a decent percentage of the available thrust, it would be revolutionary.

Not sure if there's a ducted fan, the bit in the middle could be the power supply and electronics.

 

"Since Thomas Townsend Brown discovered propulsion generated by asymmetrical electrodes in 1921 there had not been a significant break-thru that allow generation ion propulsion to levels that made it possible to develop VTOL crafts in atmospheric conditions. Our all-electric drone powered by ion propulsion, with minimum noise signature and zero carbon emissions, uses innovative physics principles to generate noise levels below 70 dB."

 

 

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by martin-w

I've read that they're working on more powerful ion engines.

The key is having enough power to accelerate the ions to high enough velocities to provide useful thrust.  They use them now on some satellites but the thrust is very small and only used for minor position adjustments.

Nuclear reactors could be used to generate the necessary electrical power.

Dave

1 hour ago, dave2013 said:

I've read that they're working on more powerful ion engines.

 

Yes, for satellites not in an atmosphere, where minimal thrust is required, and of course they use fuel. 

 

1 hour ago, dave2013 said:

The key is having enough power to accelerate the ions to high enough velocities to provide useful thrust.  T adjustments.

 

Precisely. And generating enough power to enable ion propulsion, in an atmosphere requires an extremely light craft and very high power. Previously this has been done with a gossamer thin ultra light model. 

 

Quote

Nuclear reactors could be used to generate the necessary electrical power.

 

Nope, way, way too heavy. 

If they manage this with a reasonable sized drone, other than with a super light, paper thin drone, it would be quite revolutionary. Unfortunately the company are releasing zero details. It seems to me that so far all they've managed is a few seconds of flight. 

 

 

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by martin-w

16 minutes ago, martin-w said:

Nope, way, way too heavy. 

I'm not talking about using this type of propulsion in the atmosphere.

You seem to know a lot about science and engineering, at least I presume that based on your posts.  Are you a scientist or engineer?  What's your background?  Just curious.

Dave

I just came across some posts by engineers who seems to know their stuff:  https://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=104814

They're discussing what the weight of a fission reactor would need to be in order to produce 1MW of power.  By way of comparison, the little drone in that video produces 8KW of power, so we're talking about 125 times the power.

They came up with about 200kg of core mass, and one guy calculated about 500kg for the entire reactor. 

I could see something like this being used to power much larger and more powerful ion engines for manned craft going to other planets.  A sufficient acceleration could be sustained for long periods resulting in very high velocities and making long trips practical.

Dave

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by dave2013

2 hours ago, dave2013 said:

I'm not talking about using this type of propulsion in the atmosphere.

You seem to know a lot about science and engineering, at least I presume that based on your posts.  Are you a scientist or engineer?  What's your background?  Just curious.

Dave

 

That's what the video is about, atmospheric ion propulsion for a drone. 

Not a scientist or engineer. Trained as a professional photographer. Have been interested in science and technology from a very your age. Used to write science fiction, until I got divorced that is, it was so traumatic I stopped writing and haven't started again. Silly but that's the way it is. Divorce is a horribly stressful thing, as you may or may not know.

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by martin-w

1 hour ago, dave2013 said:

I just came across some posts by engineers who seems to know their stuff:  https://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=104814

They're discussing what the weight of a fission reactor would need to be in order to produce 1MW of power.  By way of comparison, the little drone in that video produces 8KW of power, so we're talking about 125 times the power.

They came up with about 200kg of core mass, and one guy calculated about 500kg for the entire reactor. 

I could see something like this being used to power much larger and more powerful ion engines for manned craft going to other planets.  A sufficient acceleration could be sustained for long periods resulting in very high velocities and making long trips practical.

Dave

 

Oh yes, we know ion propulsion is a viable technology for non-atmospheric craft. We're doing it now. The debate here though is in regard to the video, namely if its feasible in an atmosphere. 

I think what you are referring to is a Nuclear Electric Rocket. A nuclear reactor generating heat, which is then converted into electrical energy to power an ion thruster. Feasible, nothing debatable about that.

A concept I've always liked is the VASIMIR process. A plasma rocket basically. Radio waves heat and ionize a propellent forming a plasma. Then a magnetic field is used to confine and accelerate the plasma out of the nozzle. 

NASA are taking Nuclear Thermal seriously of course.

 

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-announces-nuclear-thermal-propulsion-reactor-concept-awards

 

 

Quote

 

Battelle Energy Alliance, the managing and operating contractor for INL, led the request for proposals, evaluation, and procurement sponsored by NASA using fiscal year 2021 appropriations. INL will award 12-month contracts to the following companies to each produce a conceptual reactor design that could support future mission needs:

 

• BWX Technologies, Inc. of Lynchburg, Virginia – The company will partner with Lockheed Martin.

 

• General Atomics Electromagnetic Systems of San Diego – The company will partner with X-energy LLC and Aerojet Rocketdyne.

 

• Ultra Safe Nuclear Technologies of Seattle – The company will partner with Ultra Safe Nuclear Corporation, Blue Origin, General Electric Hitachi Nuclear Energy, General Electric Research, Framatome, and Materion.

 

•  

 

 

Edited May 7, 20224 yr by martin-w

6 hours ago, martin-w said:

Used to write science fiction, until I got divorced that is, it was so traumatic I stopped writing and haven't started again. Silly but that's the way it is. Divorce is a horribly stressful thing, as you may or may not know.

Sorry to hear that.

Do you think you'll write sci-fi stories again?

Dave

6 hours ago, martin-w said:

A concept I've always liked is the VASIMIR process. A plasma rocket basically.

Yep, the plasma rockets can provide a lot of thrust and use a lot less fuel than chemical rockets.

Maybe Elon Musk will work on this or something like it down the road.  I like NASA, but they take forever.

Dave

11 hours ago, dave2013 said:

Sorry to hear that.

Do you think you'll write sci-fi stories again?

Dave

 

I have a novel 3/4 finished, haven't touched it since the dreaded divorce. Not sure for the future, I also have OCD to deal with so that another factor. 

 

 

Edited May 8, 20224 yr by martin-w

11 hours ago, dave2013 said:

Yep, the plasma rockets can provide a lot of thrust and use a lot less fuel than chemical rockets.

Maybe Elon Musk will work on this or something like it down the road.  I like NASA, but they take forever.

Dave

 

NASA have been researching pulsed plasma rockets and other versions for some time. Yes, you are right, NASA are slow whereas private companies cant afford to be. 

Who knows what Musk is up to behind the scenes. You cant always pay too much attention to his words, particularly in regard to his claim that he has an electric vertical take-off supersonic aircraft concept in mind. Yeah right. 🙄 He may have of course, but it will require batteries with a far more impressive capability than we have now. Ducted fans wouldn't work, it would need to be a true electric jet, and that takes power, lots of power, power we currently don't have. 

Edited May 8, 20224 yr by martin-w