Real Taxiways USA & Europe

[Jazz 1,047]

Some feedback from users on this product would be welcome. The more honest the better.

Let's face it, default airports are a mess and will remain that way until we get that way for users to update and submit them. I'm tired of having taxiway signs in the middle of taxiways along with lights in stupid places but my biggest annoyance is missing signs, signs with nonsense gibberish on them and taxiway and gate designations that have no resemblance to the charts and reality at all. Now that I have just bought the PMDG 737 so I can get back to my bread and butter heavy metal flying and having dumped P3D for good this inaccuracy is going to be my single largest annoyance in this sim so I am seriously looking at this product to see what improvements it really does make.

I have looked at a few video reviews of this product but according to them, it is by no means a total fix. It still gets things wrong and from what I can tell the taxiway names etc are still not accurate to what the charts say on Navigraph. However, those videos are from the time when the product was first brought to market.

What's it like now? Is it worth the money? Pros and cons please ladies and gentlemen.

 

[fppilot 4,397]

4 minutes ago, Jazz said:

Some feedback from users on this product would be welcome. The more honest the better.

Let's face it, default airports are a mess and will remain that way until we get that way for users to update and submit them. I'm tired of having taxiway signs in the middle of taxiways along with lights in stupid places but my biggest annoyance is missing signs, signs with nonsense gibberish on them and taxiway and gate designations that have no resemblance to the charts and reality at all. Now that I have just bought the PMDG 737 so I can get back to my bread and butter heavy metal flying and having dumped P3D for good this inaccuracy is going to be my single largest annoyance in this sim so I am seriously looking at this product to see what improvements it really does make.

I have looked at a few video reviews of this product but according to them, it is by no means a total fix. It still gets things wrong and from what I can tell the taxiway names etc are still not accurate to what the charts say on Navigraph. However, those videos are from the time when the product was first brought to market.

What's it like now? Is it worth the money? Pros and cons please ladies and gentlemen.

 

Good question, and to add an additional question that may have common interest: what is the extent of coverage?  does it affect addon airports?  Or just default airports?

Edited December 23, 2022 by fppilot

[F737MAX 5,738]

18 minutes ago, Jazz said:

What's it like now? Is it worth the money? Pros and cons

IMO, best review is this one:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s9bSAVWwYOY

 

15 minutes ago, fppilot said:

Good question, and to add an additional question that may have common interest: what is the extent of coverage?  does it affect addon airports?  Or just default airports?

Default and at least some early handcrafted airports only, like EGLL and KLAX, IIRC. You can check the product manuals to see which airports are covered.

 

Great for VATSIM flyers or people who, like me, enjoy having up-to-date taxiway signs at the few default/handcrafted airports I use.

Not all signs are present and there a few problems issues with incorrectly labelled taxiways and a weird appearance of 'MMMM' or 'OOOO' on the back of some signs.

Overall, good, but not 'life-changing' like other add-ons are. Best value was the joint USA & Europe package that I got on sale at JustFlight.

[Johan217 49]

I don't think there have been many updates since release, so what you see in the videos is what you'll get. Be aware that you'll have to remove the taxiway bgl manually for addon airports and this includes the handcrafted MSFS airports. Also there is a known issue with the hold short sign that requires manual replacing of some files every time after a sim update.

That said, I'd still say it is a reasonable improvement over default: taxiway signs look better and they are more accurate. If you don't use many addon airports and you're ok with the hassle of managing your files it could be worth it. If you're mostly flying between addon or modded airports, probably not.

To be clear, these are NOT AFCAD files. They only affect the placement of signs and will not fix a bad aiport layout.

 

[Jazz 1,047]

2 minutes ago, F737MAX said:

IMO, best review is this one:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s9bSAVWwYOY

Yes, that was the one I found most helpful.

2 minutes ago, F737MAX said:

there a few problems issues with incorrectly labelled taxiways and a weird appearance of 'MMMM' or 'OOOO' on the back of some signs.

Has this still not been fixed?

 

[Johan217 49]

There is a workaround, but no actual fix as far as I am aware.

https://support.justflight.com/support/solutions/articles/17000121895-certain-taxiway-signs-may-show-as-hijk-mmmm-oooo

[heavy1216 35]

I can't imagine not using it now. I love it 

[Jazz 1,047]

6 minutes ago, Johan217 said:

There is a workaround, but no actual fix as far as I am aware.

https://support.justflight.com/support/solutions/articles/17000121895-certain-taxiway-signs-may-show-as-hijk-mmmm-oooo

Hmmmm......And this is the problem. If I'm paying 30 quid I want it to just work. I don't want to do work-arounds. No matter how easy they may be. When you start installing things that need "work-arounds" and if you keep installing such things that do then keeping the sim running starts to become a full time tweaking and fiddling job which is one of the things, after 30-odd years of it, I have really been enjoying not having to to in MSFS.

This is beginning to look like a 30 quid PITA. I'd have to work around a problem that shouldn't be there in regard to getting the signs to not display nonsense gibberish ('MMMM' or 'OOOO') which is exactly one of the reasons I was looking at it as option to begin with. Then I would have to delete bgl's of any airports I have added and given that I would tend not to have any airports installed that I was not going to fly to in that session it sounds as though I would have to keep deleting them every time I was going to them because I would be installing them again. How many times will I start the sim forgetting to do this before realising I'm an aging word not allowed and having to back out and do it again? I can already tell you that it will be too many🤣

So far, it feels like there are mostly negatives. Come on and convince me😆

 

[kerosene31 349]

I bought them on sale some time ago (basically half off).  Honestly let's say I don't even have them installed now. 

There's issues with signs, and they have a workaround posted on their forums which isn't too complicated, but this has been out for a long time now with no official patch.  Every time the sim updates, the fix has to be reapplied.  This workaround was posted months ago and there seems to be no follow up support on it.  I have patience with issues, but at some point people need to fix their products, especially at this price.  Plus you're changing a default file and who knows what else that impacts. 

Also you have to manually exclude every non-default airport you have, which the instructions explains fine but gets really time consuming to manage.  You have to find every airport code and rename the .bgl file.  No big deal, but it takes time. 

I liked the product, as a GA flyer who hits lots of small airports that are often poorly represented.  Getting this thing working and keeping it working was just too much.  The other issue is ATC has no idea about these accurate taxiway designations, so the directions they give you will be flat out wrong.  It is nice not seeing taxiway signs in the middle of taxiways and such. 

I hate to just not recommend something, because you can get it working.  Honestly, with so many great freeware airports, I just stick with those.  I liked the idea of the product, but the work and hassle to keep it going was too much. 

[Noel 4,563]

31 minutes ago, kerosene31 said:

Honestly, with so many great freeware airports, I just stick with those.

Craig, is it your experience that 3rd party airports are uniformly much better in this regard, the OP's concerns?  I'm fortunate that I'm too busy with other components of airliner flying/management I ignore taxiway signs and mis placed lights etc it just does not come into my consciousness fortunately.  I use the wonderful subtle taxi ribbon mod which is just visible enough to get me to the apron or gate.

[lehbird 55]

Does this correct taxiway lighting being in the middle of taxiways?

[Jazz 1,047]

15 minutes ago, lehbird said:

Does this correct taxiway lighting being in the middle of taxiways?

Yes, it's meant to. But only at the airports included in the package. Which is quite a lot.

[lehbird 55]

26 minutes ago, Jazz said:

Yes, it's meant to. But only at the airports included in the package. Which is quite a lot.

Thanks. When you say "In the package", you mean the default airports? 

[Jazz 1,047]

24 minutes ago, lehbird said:

Thanks. When you say "In the package", you mean the default airports? 

This product does not cover every single default airport in USA and Europe. Those that it covers within its package, which are many regardless, it will fix. Or it's meant to anyway.

That's as I understand it.

[kerosene31 349]

2 hours ago, Noel said:

Craig, is it your experience that 3rd party airports are uniformly much better in this regard, the OP's concerns?  I'm fortunate that I'm too busy with other components of airliner flying/management I ignore taxiway signs and mis placed lights etc it just does not come into my consciousness fortunately.  I use the wonderful subtle taxi ribbon mod which is just visible enough to get me to the apron or gate.

I really didn't do a deep dive, but at a glance and based on what Youtube videos showed, the product did do what it advertised fairly well (for the airports it covered).  I'm usually pretty patient with products, but this one pushed my limits.  I would reinstall if they patched it. 

All I would say is check out their support forum and see for yourself.  People just bought it and are told to submit a ticket.