AVSIM Is Very Supressive When People Complain About FSX

[boshar 6]

>Hey Dick!>>Seems YOU still did not quit get the point! It IS NOT>NEGATIVITY that is the problem BUT rudeness!I think you miss the point. A negative poster has to be very carefull with his post because it might be percieved as rude. Do keep in mind we have a lot of people posting here that aren't native english speakers. When you learn english by watching Hollywood action movies your english does get a little more colorfull and rude.Even if you do manage to get a post out that is well balanced and brings the negative point across you still have the risk that another negative post is made by someone that croses the rudeness line and 'eh presto' the thread gest locked.Posting even ridicilously positive comments never gives you that problem. (those posters also have less bloodpressure problems and are generaly happier in life it seems ;-) ). The uber optimistic posts are left untouched while uber negative posts are actively policed (using the Rude criterium) so we get an inbalance in this forum.As is clearly stated in the tems of use this forum does not equal free speech and the owner is free to set the rules (after all he pays all the bills). But lets not pretend that the FS-X forum has a balanced 2 sided view on the state of FS-X the uber positive posts that are left untouched see to that.

[Guest grapesh]

Are you aware of any other flight simulation forums where discussion is more productive in sorting out technical issues with the product and expressing your concerns, desires and problems? Although Avsim is dominated by FSX-happy fellas, there are some good posts floating around in these forums once in a while, both in practical and conceptual realms. I gave up on a practical side as FSX is simply NOT flyable on my not-so-bad machine :(, so the only reason I'm here is to learn that there's a hope for my beloved hobby to finally catch up with technology and become better, faster and more realistic. Most major issues discussed here are met with "oh, that's too complex to implement!" or "that's impossible to model!", or "let ACES focus on something else!" And this is not even ACES speaking but end-users speaking for them! I don't think this is why ACES are frequent here. I'm certain they care about flight sim future as much as we do, so we should make a difference together. Not by blaming Microsoft and not by crusading against any critique towards FSX. The key of most threads here is the aggressive protection of FSX, which I find is counter-productive, and in the long run, this attitude may help kill the hobby. I don't want to blame anyone, I'm just curious if more balanced discussions exist? Cheers,=S.V.=eMachines T5026/P4/3.07GHz/1Gb RAM/160Gb S-ATA HDD/Windows XP Home SP2/ATI RADEON 9250 PCI 256Mb/ViewSonic VX910 19' 1280x1024/Microsoft SideWinder Force Feedback 2

[AWACS 12]

Well Boshar I think you're right we should lock threads where people have posted positive experiences with FS. Like this one: http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...id=29268&page=5Seaquashtoo has been on a roll posting his positive experiences with FS, it was just so unconstructive.... not! I rather enjoyed reading his posts, but geez, AVSIM should supress his joy.Or did I miss your point because from what I've seen, you feel that since negative posts are sometimes locked, positive posts should be too?Jeff

[EngineRoom 205]

Interesting thread!What strikes me is here we are one year after the release of FSX and it is still generating a lot of controversy!If there is anybody here who is familiar here with Oleg Maddox's Il-2 series of WW2 flight simulations you might grin a little because this sort of discussion is very similar to the old "Luftwhiner" threads of a few years ago. A lot of people believed that the Russian developers had deliberately made the Soviet aircraft overpowered and more capable than they really were in respect to the German aircraft. This often generated a very heated discussion, and then of course an American would usually chime in with a statement along the lines of "The P-51 in the sim sucks, but it should be the best fighter!".It's all down to the individuals expectations!I have a sneaking suspicion that ACES were leaned upon to get FSX out the door in time for Vista. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were told "Make a sim that does pretty screenshots we can use in the Vista/DX10 marketing." Cynical? Yes of course, but totally plausible. MS needed something to prise people away from XP, and the new DX10 API would do that, and of course we know FSX featured pretty heavily in the "Games For Vista" marketing.Some people were very happy with FSX, some (like myself) were disappointed, and saw a missed opportunity to make some really great improvements. What certainly happened was we got a sim that was not optimised for contemporary hardware. I'm no software programmer, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out the engine in FSX is creaking under its own weight. I really do hope we will get a totally new engine in the next version of FS!However, I can and do enjoy FSX... it's not what I hoped for, but it can be a fun. However, my main sim remains FS9 which will reside on my HDD for a looooong time to come. I think FS9 was an unprecedented success, and will be remembered very fondly by us for years to come. I also think that FSX will go down in FS history as one of the less auspicious versions of the series.

[boshar 6]

>Or did I miss your point because from what I've seen, you feel>that since negative posts are sometimes locked, positive posts>should be too?Nope my point is we should not lock any posts be they positive or negative unless there are clear personal attacks on real living persons.That way you weed out any personal bias and get the view from both sides.We could even make an opinions / personal experiences forum thats a free for all discussion place. That way the FS9, FS-X etc can go back to talking about tips, tweaks, new add-ons, etc. Even as an advocacy forum the FS-X forum ultimately fails because you are preaching to the converted here.

[Geofa 108]

"my point is we should not lock any posts be they positive or negative unless there are clear personal attacks on real living persons"I guess we are in agreement then after all. And now that most have had their due, we am locking this thread so we can get back to simming. By the way, since every new release seems to bring out a heightened "clear personal attacks on real living persons" which started happening last night,the avsim staff has concurred that we will during this time actively be following the one strike and you are out policy. Brian and I have of recently been at fault for not doing so, however this place had been a polite place for quite a while and it didn't seem necessary. Geof and Brianhttp://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpgForum Moderatorhttp://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

[DadJokeCinema 145]

>"my point is we should not lock any posts be they positive or>negative unless there are clear personal attacks on real>living persons">>I guess we are in agreement then after all.> >And now that most have had their due, we am locking this>thread so we can get back to simming.> >By the way, since every new release seems to bring out a>heightened "clear personal attacks on real living persons">which started happening last night,the avsim staff has>concurred that we will during this time actively be following>the one strike and you are out policy. Brian and I have of>recently been at fault for not doing so, however this place >had been a polite place for quite a while and it didn't seem>necessary. >>Geof and Brian>>http://mywebpages.comcast.net/geofa/pages/rxp-pilot.jpg>Forum Moderator>http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/I wanted to quote this so everyone knows that this is the whole team here in agreement.This place is getting out of hand again.

[nudata 10]

Yet another poster was unfortunate enough to openly say that he was very angered by the performance of FSX. AVSIM locked his post. The only answers to-date were from people who wanted to say that they did not have any trouble. So the reason for the lock was not obvious. Perhaps AVSIM is taking a position that there is a risk that the employees of Microsoft who brought us FSX may become offended thus removing their interaction. While a very good commercial reason it is questionable journalism. No one agreed with the poor soul so he went away more frustrated than ever.The respondents who support FSX could be a community of thousands. But, each person has a different system, different settings, and different objectives. It makes for an almost infinite, and unusable, set of endorsements.Before I spent the obligatory several hundred dollars I was tempted to vent my frustration here. However, seeing the rejection of those that did was discouraging. Now FSX runs "reasonably" well meeting my dumbed down objectives. I have complaints but would never risk voicing them here only to be told that "it runs well on my system" thus blaming the messenger. So let's try an experiment:Microsoft made a significant error with two products Vista and FSX. While in different categories they share some unfortunate similarities. One is that they were sold before they were complete. Two they lacked sufficient differentiation to move many customers to the new program. I have no intention of buying Vista and while I use FSX I am not satisfied with the design that did not take into account the customers who did not have very fast PCs. With Vista it was a marketing decision and with FSX the technologists held to much sway.Now, let us see what happens.Regards,Dick BoleyA PC, an LCD, speakers, CH yoke