Has a VPN made a meaningful difference in...

[Noel 4,503]

Our friend David Mills mentioned this seemed to help him with an issue.  Now and again I'll have ample CPU main thread/GPU headroom, major headroom, yet have a stutter-fest typically upon arrival but sometimes over nothing burger scenery.  At that point I attribute the unpredicted degradation to server overload because bandwidth for my connection is typically around 400mbps.  If you started using a VPN have you noticed a SIGNIFICANT impact on the issue I described, these unpredicted major degradations in animation despite ample main thread and GPU headroom?  I read Xfinity will throttle down bandwidth so this is also why I'm looking at this.  I think able cable internet providers will do this perhaps.  I bought a subscription to NordVPN which has a 30d trial and these issues don't always happen thankfully so any input from others may help me avoid not cancelling.  Also, any downsides to a VPN in terms of general performance or bandwidth?  Addendum:  I did minimal research and learned the impact can be up to 70% downgrade in download speed!  Gee whiz, great!  Not!   I'll try it and see and if that's the case at all cancellation here we come!

Well, the first test shows a modest decrease in download speed so NBD so far...

Thanks in advance! 

Edited June 21, 2023 by Noel

[Farlis 2,287]

I don't use a VPN personally, but I can imagine that it can cause issues with bandwith.

But you wouldn't have it switched on the entire time anyway. The best use for them is being able to prevent getting geolocked on streaming services.

[Tuskin38 6,526]

Yeah I just use a VPN when updating the sim, I get way faster speeds most of the time.

[Noel 4,503]

Just now I was about 300mbps w/o the VPN, and 260mbps with.  But what matters is what is actually needed for MSFS, and of course the issue I'm trying to address has to do with degradation in performance despite excellent processing headroom, so presumably either the MSFS servers are culprits, or perhaps Xfinity throttling so that is what I am trying to rule out or in.

[bofhlusr 453]

1 hour ago, Noel said:

Also, any downsides to a VPN in terms of general performance or bandwidth?  Addendum:  I did minimal research and learned the impact can be up to 70% downgrade in download speed!  Gee whiz, great!  Not!   I'll try it and see and if that's the case at all cancellation here we come!

I've been using VPN for years and I can confirm that there is a degradation in bandwidth. However, VPN can be disabled very quickly any time (literally in seconds with a click of an icon in the system tray) and you can also manually cache scenery. My VPN provider has a mobile app, so I use that too when using my phone, tablet or laptop when connecting to free public access wifi (eg. work office, hospitals, coffee shops, airports, etc.).

[blueshark747 1,843]

Trying to play MSFS with a VPN on just sounds like issues...

Connection issues are bad enough with having the VPN off

[Biggles2010 343]

1 hour ago, Noel said:

Our friend David Mills mentioned this seemed to help him with an issue.

In terms of download speeds, the VPN will usually only help if your own service provider is throttling speeds in a selective way.  All ISPs make sure that the standard speed measurement websites are never throttled, because they want to advertise the highest speeds that you could achieve. The problem is that ISPs will throttle most other downloads, but they will not admit to it.

In some countries it would contravene regulations to throttle in this way, but it is very difficult for any individual to prove. There is plenty of anecdotal evidence that it happens, but ISPs just say that download speeds are not guaranteed, so get lost.  There is no large scale protest because most users just accept it or don't even notice. It needs a whistleblower to come up with proof, then there might be some action.

[Noel 4,503]

Again, what is let's say the MINIMUM bandwidth that if maintained is required to have MSFS function fully?  I'm at 300 with VPN off, 260 on, and it seems 260 is way way more than is required, yes?

[bofhlusr 453]

13 minutes ago, Noel said:

Again, what is let's say the MINIMUM bandwidth that if maintained is required to have MSFS function fully?  I'm at 300 with VPN off, 260 on, and it seems 260 is way way more than is required, yes?

It's 50 Mbps .

Minimum, Recommended, and Ideal PC requirements for Microsoft Flight Simulator – Microsoft Flight Simulator Support (zendesk.com)

How much network bandwidth is needed for MSFS 2020? - General Discussion & Community Support / General Discussion - Microsoft Flight Simulator Forums

Actual bandwidth may vary depending on where you fly in MSFS, your server location, your physical location, when you fly (eg. weekdays vs weekends), if the scenery has already been cached, etc.
 

[Noel 4,503]

12 minutes ago, bofhlusr said:

Actual bandwidth may vary depending on where you fly in MSFS, your server location, your physical location, when you fly (eg. weekdays vs weekends), if the scenery has already been cached, etc.

Are you saying actual bandwidth REQUIRED for full functioning, varies?  Or that one's actual bandwidth varies which of course is true.  IOW, does solid 50mbps cover any potential demands by MSFS?

Edited June 21, 2023 by Noel

[Noel 4,503]

42 minutes ago, Biggles2010 said:

In terms of download speeds, the VPN will usually only help if your own service provider is throttling speeds in a selective way

Yes, this indeed was my only reason to trial a good VPN.

[The Moose 1,177]

40 minutes ago, Noel said:

Again, what is let's say the MINIMUM bandwidth that if maintained is required to have MSFS function fully?  I'm at 300 with VPN off, 260 on, and it seems 260 is way way more than is required, yes?

I haven't checked recently, so I don't know if anything's changed, but last time I tested usage was generally in the 20 to 50Mb range with occasional very brief spikes up to around 130Mb as it was loading in the PG area for the first time This was with a heli at around 400ft flying a large circular pattern around Madrid, so a fairly large airport and a decent sized PG city.

For reference i'm on a 300Mb connection and never get any degradation in scenery or low bandwidth notifications. I know for certain my ISP doesn't throttle any traffic as that's part of the rather expensive package.

It seems to me your ISP is throttling you.

Edited June 21, 2023 by The Moose

[Noel 4,503]

1 minute ago, The Moose said:

I know for certain my ISP doesn't throttle any traffic as that's part of the rather expensive package.

It seems to me your ISP is throttling you.

That is the point of this evaluation for sure.  I wonder if Xfinity offers a throttling-free option?  Though this VPN is very cheap it if solves the throttling issue, though I understand throttling can be based not only on what one user is doing but all users connected to the node.

[bofhlusr 453]

6 minutes ago, Noel said:

Are you saying actual bandwidth REQUIRED for full functioning, varies?  Or that one's actual bandwidth varies which of course is true.  IOW, does solid 50mbps cover any potential demands by MSFS?

Yes. That's how I interpret the table from Zendesk from the link provided above. I guess it depends on how you define 'full functioning'.  The definition would vary depending on computer specs. But I would think it's a moot point given that the 50 Mbps recommendation is for a high-end PC, and presumably you meet the requirements. On the other hand, the link with the recommended specs is dated April 2020 and likely needs an update since MSFS has been updated several times since then.

[BrianW 124]

14 minutes ago, Noel said:

That is the point of this evaluation for sure.  I wonder if Xfinity offers a throttling-free option?  Though this VPN is very cheap it if solves the throttling issue, though I understand throttling can be based not only on what one user is doing but all users connected to the node.

As someone who used to work on the networking team for an ISP, I can say that there's a very small chance they would throttle just the MSFS servers.  Usually when there's a user that uses a lot of data it's their whole account that gets throttled. MSFS is peanuts compared with other streaming services, and it makes little sense to advertise high speed streaming only to throttle them by default. 

The only situation where a VPN may help is in situations where there's an issue between your internet IP and the MSFS servers.  A VPN changes your source IP the MSFS servers sees and results in a different path through the internet.  However not you've introduced a new potential issue in that you'll rely on not only how busy the MSFS servers are, but also how busy the VPN server you're on is.  Also your CPU will be busier because it has to decrypt and extra layer of encryption.