Interesting, but tweaking archaic technology doesn't light my candle much. 🙂

3 hours ago, martin-w said:

... archaic technology...

These are diesel engines on very large trucks.  Something that cannot be converted to electricity any time soon.  These trucks are run 20 hours per day on average so forget about stopping to charge.  These trucks produce "maybe $25,000 per hour so when it's not in the dirt working, it's not making the money."

These trucks had a 69 liter Caterpillar engine with an oil change every 250 hours with 89 *gallons* of oil per change.  The technology extended this to 500 hours, and could have gone longer but the company had a 500 hour mandatory limit. (They changed oil based on condition of the oil.)  The operator said it saved $180,000 over the life of the engine in oil changes alone.

This "archaic technology" is the only technology there is to do the job.

Hook

1 hour ago, LHookins said:

These are diesel engines on very large trucks.  Something that cannot be converted to electricity any time soon. 

 

I wasn't saying that internal combustion engines won't be around for a while yet, they will... I said archaic. And it is indeed archaic technology that's been around for 150 years. Hence why it doenst excite me much when somebody makes a new piston design. 

 

In terms of "cannot be converted to electricity any time soon"... how about now?

This big boy below, doesn't usually require much charging as the regenerative braking is huge when it carries a massive load down a quarry. 

 

https://auto.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/this-is-worlds-largest-electric-vehicle-that-needs-no-charging/70751419

 

 

Or what about this massive guy below...

https://spectrum.ieee.org/worlds-biggest-dump-truck-goes-electric

 

 

 

Edited May 8, 20242 yr by martin-w

5 hours ago, martin-w said:

Or what about this massive guy below...

Heh!  "The AC electric drive is powered by two 16-cylindar-diesel engines that each have an output of about 1,700 kW."

 

5 hours ago, martin-w said:

This big boy below, doesn't usually require much charging as the regenerative braking is huge when it carries a massive load down a quarry.

"Media reports suggest that the vehicle produces more energy than it consumes during its daily work, which consists of transporting rocks to a cement factory, from the top of a hill to its base."

I may be totally wrong here, and I've certainly been mistaken a time or two in the past, but I suspect most quarry work consists of transporting heavy loads uphill and returning downhill empty.  Not quite the kind of work they describe.

Edit to add:  I gotta admit this is a cool application for an electric truck.  I'm just not sure how well it will scale.  

You really ought to watch the initial video.  They even talk about using the modified pistons in an aircraft.  Start about 20 minutes in and watch to the end.  I personally find this technology exciting.

Hook

Edited May 8, 20242 yr by LHookins

2 hours ago, LHookins said:

Heh!  "The AC electric drive is powered by two 16-cylindar-diesel engines that each have an output of about 1,700 kW."

Hook

The AC electric drive is powered by two 16-cylindar-diesel engines that each have an output of about 1,700 kW. The truck is more than 20 meters long and nearly 10 meters wide.  I read that and say what!

Those 16-cylindar-diesel engines could use that tech and locomotives operate the same way diesel power running electric motors!

 

Fully Charged did a video on electric Big boys.

 

 

9 hours ago, LHookins said:

I personally find this technology exciting.

 

I find it interesting, hence my appreciation the video was posted, but not exciting. The engines that power the Bugatti super cars I find interesting too, and the Koenigsegg and Zonda... but not exciting. 

Edited May 9, 20242 yr by martin-w

9 hours ago, TuFun said:

Those 16-cylindar-diesel engines could use that tech and locomotives operate the same way diesel power running electric motors!

I was thinking that too.  If the improved pistons also deliver the specified 20% better fuel economy they'd pay for themselves in that environment as well.  The cleaner burning diesel fuel is also a major plus.  They were talking about passing emission requirements without additional scrubbing tech.

The combination of NASA level tech ceramics and the bernoulli effect have major improvements on both gasoline and diesel engines.  The downside is the cost to design the dimple pattern and manufacture the pistons, but they're talking about the pistons paying for themselves fairly quickly.  One upside is that they can deploy the new pistons right now, as soon as they can be designed for each engine and need no additional infrastructure.

Hook

 

3 hours ago, martin-w said:

Fully Charged did a video on electric Big boys.

Is there any word on how long it will take for the new fleet of trucks to pay for themselves?  Don't forget the cost of the wind and solar setup in the remote locations where the mines are, and replacement costs for everything as it wears out.

The video did mention the need for additional trucks to replace ones being charged, even if they can get 30 minute charging.

Hook

25 minutes ago, LHookins said:

Is there any word on how long it will take for the new fleet of trucks to pay for themselves? 

 

Haven't watched the video in a while to be honest, or read about it, so no idea.

 

They've even got all electric tankers now. 😲

https://maritime-executive.com/article/world-s-first-all-electric-bunker-tanker-enters-service-in-japan

 

Asahi is the first all electric bunker vessel (Asahi Tankers)

PUBLISHED APR 27, 2022 6:51 PM BY THE MARITIME EXECUTIVE

 

 

Quote

The world’s first electric-powered bunker tanker went into service yesterday in Japan after several weeks of testing and demonstrations. The 492 ton vessel is powered entirely by large-capacity lithium-ion batteries making it carbon-free in its operations. The vessel, Asahi operated by Asahi Tankers, is in commercial service but also is viewed as a demonstration ship contributing to the development of battery-powered vessels.

 

And all electric autonomous cargo ships. Yikes!

https://www.sustainable-ships.org/stories/2021/worlds-first-electric-cargo

 

Quote

Dubbed ‘the Tesla of the seas’ this fully-electrified, fully-autonomous cargo ship is already making waves. The Yara Birkeland has a 7MWh battery, charged by Norwegian hydro power. She can carry a little over 100 containers. The ship cost about 25 million dollars, about three times a “conventional ship price”, but will nonetheless cut OPEX for Yara by 90%.

 

 

Edited May 9, 20242 yr by martin-w

2100 passenger ship. all electric. 😲

 

https://corvusenergy.com/corvus-awarded-battery-supply-for-the-worlds-largest-battery-electric-ship/

 

I'll care more about these commercial vehicles when they get past the one-off, prototype, proof of concept stage.  Once they're shown to be economically viable.  Electric cars are already there and we're testing them at scale and have found both upsides and downsides.

What is exciting to me is someone still finding ways to improve 150 year old technology, whether it's diesel engines or light bulbs.  Or computers;  that technology is almost 200 years old, starting with the Babbage Analytical Engine starting in 1837 which was the first "modern" general purpose computer that was Touring-complete.

Hook

50 minutes ago, LHookins said:

I'll care more about these commercial vehicles when they get past the one-off, prototype, proof of concept stage.  Once they're shown to be economically viable.  Electric cars are already there and we're testing them at scale and have found both upsides and downsides.

What is exciting to me is someone still finding ways to improve 150 year old technology, whether it's diesel engines or light bulbs.  Or computers;  that technology is almost 200 years old, starting with the Babbage Analytical Engine starting in 1837 which was the first "modern" general purpose computer that was Touring-complete.

Hook

You sound a lot like my thought, are you somehow in my head? haha

Manufactures like to put flashy stats on paper and their one-off prototype model, I'm the kind who doesn't belive until it's real and tested by the large public

1 hour ago, LHookins said:

Or computers;  that technology is almost 200 years old, starting with the Babbage Analytical Engine starting in 1837 which was the first "modern" general purpose computer that was Touring-complete.

 

True, but the difference is that the internal combustion engine has a limited time ahead in regard to just how far it's innovation can go, currently we are just tweaking the materials and design. Computers are a whole different ball game, with the long road ahead looking incredibly exotic - graphene based transistors, DNA storage, biological computers, neuromorphic technology, optical computing, distributed computing, nanocomputers. And of course, analogue quantum computers that are currently just in their infancy and offering miraculous capability far, far into the future. Computers aren't just about the hardware of course, they are a combination of hardware and software, and not only does the hardware have an exotic future, but in combination with the software is bringing us artificial intelligence, artificial general intelligence, and one day sentient machines. 

We won't be burning stuff in the future, but we will be using hyper advanced computers. 

 

Quote

Electric cars are already there and we're testing them at scale and have found both upsides and downsides.

 

Burning stuff in an internal combustion engine has upsides and downsides too.

Edited May 9, 20242 yr by martin-w