>I have been on a boeing 737-800 many times and each time, I>do not recognise PMDG's sounds. However, I'm sure PMDG>recorded the real sound quite accurately and perhaps, it's so>accurate that it sounds different. What I think is strange>though, is that all PMDG 737's sound similar. I can imagine a>737-600 to sound different than a 737-900.>>DirkDirk,How do you manage to allow them to let you sit in the cockpit during flight? Just curious.

>Listen up guys I have been on the 738 many times and I know>for a fact that the pmdg sounds are not what they should be,>and I can prove it. Dont get me wrong though, I love PMDG for>what they are doing to bring the closest thing to the real>thing to our desktops and I think their panel recreation is>extraordinary, in fact since I got it a few weeks ago I havent>touched my a330s from pss. AND IM NOT BASHING THEM AT ALL, MY>SIMPLE ARGUMENT IS THAT THE SOUNDS ARE NOT TOTALLY ACCURATE. > How I know:>videos from flightlevel350.com. U guys should check it out if>u havent allready especially the ata landing at LGA( which is>across the street from my school) also the alaska 739 takeoff.>Both would give u two perspectives of the engine sounds. I>know for a fact that all tubofan engine have a low pitched>growl and high pitched whine at full power( all of which are>absent from the sound file at question.) Of course each whine>and growl differs in sound due to the size and number of>blades. And Im fully aware that the sounds change not only>with seat position but with speed and angle of attack.(check>out a340.net, the a320 delivery flight to tampa.) >>Secondly, I purchased the 777 digital soundset from aaron>swindle a few years ago and Im quite surprised to see the>MAJORITY of the sounds he said he recorded from a triple 7 in>the pmdg soundset. Thats how I know. The startup, shutdown>sounds are all his. The Idle groan sounds where in that same>sound file that I purchased from him. In fact, any of u guys>who have the 777 soundset can back me up on this, he even>named some of the files in a similar manner, 7771, 7772, 7773,>7774 etc. And I could keep on goin guys.>>My thing is im tryin to get the MAXIMUM realism as possible. I>want to have the feeling of actually being there in the 737>cocpit, and by far, I have this absolutely wonderful 737 panel>to start off with. But as a pilot in training Im never>satisfied with almost.>All im simply sayin is that i wish that the sounds were a>little MORE closer to the real thing. >> I am going to ask you also, How do you get to ride in the cockpit of a 737 so you can tell exactly what it sounds like and compare it to PMDG. I would really be interested in this information.

Im not going to run and hide from that question, because Its only in my wildest dreams that I ever get to set foot in a cocpit of a turbofan driven aircraft, HOWEVER. Any simpleton who has studied the way how an aircraft engine works would have a basic idea of what the engine should sound like. Proven fact: turbofans make a low pitched growl coupled with a high pitched whine at full power. The growl is coming from the fan at the front much similar to the sound one's house fan would make on full speed. Now using this basic knowledge coupled with the times I sat (as passenger) in front of the engine, my own two ears) backs this up. From the cocpit now, im dead certain that u dont hear the idle sounds, but if u kick it up to bout 60%n1 your going to get that high pitched whine, somewhere about 80%n1 u start getting an audible roar and a faint growling sound similar to what pmdg has on the exterior but just a little muffled. How do I know u ask, the cocpit videos. Im just dont know If I can ignore my ears like that, im sure if u were to see the videos u would say the same thing. a340.net, 737 takeoff video made from the cocpit. If u were also to go to the ge website and search properly, u would also find an article talking about the extensive research they are doing to get rid of the growling and whine sounds that come from modern day turbofan jets such as the 737.Also, as I said Lagaurdia airport is literally across the street from my school, like I said. Scores upon scores of 734, 735, 736, 738s takeoff there every day. Anytime they are taking off from runway 4 u hear these characteristists clearly. Some of them u even hear the low idle hum, followed by a phoooooooo, then athe whine eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrr and simultaneous roar as they throttle up to takeoff power. And like Isaid what u get on the outside, u get on the inside but muffled, and even more muffled in the cocpit as it is father away upfront and drowned out by the cocpit fans.(thanks in part to the videos) I just dont know if I can disregard what my ears and brain are telling me. One sound developer even these same videos, (with permission) to recreate the a320 and a330 sounds on the avsim website. Both of which have the characteristic turbofan growl and whine at full power.GW

Maybe you missed my point, it is this, everyone has their own set of ears and eyes and sees and hears things according to, well, the way they experience them. What "gauge" or rulebook do we use for an engine whine? What has more roar? Is that rumble louder or more quite? Who makes these choices? Maybe your hearing is better than mine maybe I pick up lower tones than you. The issue here is everyone's world is unique to him alone. Maybe John's newly painted Jumbo jet's red paint could be darker red while another says it should be lighter red. There are no absolutes in these opininated subjects. Maybe one person thinks a louder rumble creates a sense to him that simulates reality as he imagines it or a certain clicking noise that stands out. If we look past personal opinion we see that many sounds are really there. The stby atimeter's *ticking* or the rise in rpm as one advances the throttle or the click sound when one sets the flaps. Are these sounds realitically recorded? Sure, what about the recorded level for each item? Now we move into the world of subectivness and all it's wonderous facets.. Best Wishes,[h4]Randy J. Smith[/h4]http://www.rawbw.com/~bdoolin/shinault/Animation1.gifCaution! Not a real pilot, but do play one on TV ;-)AMD 64 3200+ | NEC LCD 1980SXi 19" | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro |

Anyone here EVER been in a aircraft before? Doesn't sound like it. The loudest sound I here on take-off(in cabin) is the roar of the jet exhaust. Like a rocket I guess. As you climb that sound diminishes(seems too) and you get the wind noise increasing. I've been in the cockpit several times in the past for a short visit and its the same as the cabin. Perhaps less engine noise but over the noise of the airstream rushing past, you can't really tell.Watching the 737-300 cockpit video that came with the DF purchase, its sounds like on take-off that you here a roar from the cockpit. I don't here any whine. No humming noise of the fan. A loud roar at take-off power. Not as loud as in the cabin of course.Now OUTSIDE is a different thing. A low buzzing noise is about it. Damn good engines now!I still don't have the PMDG product, so I can't say how realistic they are. Either way, I turn my engine sounds down and the envirement noises up to hear the rushing wind. More realistic.Jonno.

Hearing sound is subjective indeed, but not so much as you think. High frequencies and low frequencies are consistently perceived by people, it does not differ much. For instance, a cello sounds different than a violin and everyone can hear the difference. Of course, people may have certain preferences to certain sounds, but the perception of sound frequenies does not differ much between people. An egine whine is a typical high frequency sound and everyone who is capable of hearing such frequeny sound, should perceive the whine in a similar way. In short, it should be acknowledged by all normal hearing people that the typical 737 engine whine is lacking in PMDG's soundset. I saw many 737 cockpit videos and have been in a 737 cockpit and each time, the whine could be clearly heard.I think that PMDG's 737 sound is unrealistic for the most part and I hope they will do a better job for the 747 (and when do we finally get to see any new screen shots!!!)Dirk

hey mr Smith, I HEAR u loud n clear, lol. Do me a favor if u will, take a peek at the video and tell me what U think. a340.net, multimedia, flight videos, other aircraft, boeing.(its freee) Sure its a video of a 735 but with the similar cfm56 series engine. Trust me mr smith, Im tryin my best to keep an open mind, and I read your statement over atleast three times, AND I listened to the sounds over and over before I made this reply. What your saying is sinking in slightly with me but will take some time for me to stomach At the same time a part of me has some aguements against what your saying but I cant formulate them for some reason. Theres just a few issues nagging at my soul though, firstly my issue is not so much the sound level, or maybe it is. Bcause when I did listen to the sounds individually, I did detect faint, what I descrebe to be , whistles. In my book a whine is not a whistel, that y im pointing u and anyone in eyeshot of my post to the a340.net website- so each person can get a gauge, rulebook, testbed for the type of whines im talking about. Its in your face, cant miss it when u hear it. check the video and tell me what YOU hear.Secondly and most importantly, someone is lying, because about a few years ago(not more than 2 years) i paid 8 dollars for a recording of the 777 that sounds EXACTLY like PMDG's bird snzs, startup, shutdown, gear sounds engine idle engine full power everything minus the external sounds. If these sounds where recorded by PMDG, then I wasted 8$. Ill wait patiently for your response.GW

a340.net, multimedia, videos, beoing aircraft, 737 take off(cocpit shot) from toulouse. 737-500. What u said bout the wind noise is true, cant refute that, but take a peak at the video. The fan growling internal noise im talking about is not as noticeable on the 73s. but VERY noticable on the airbus 343 witch operate the similar cfm56 engines. Also flightlevel350alaska airlines 739( nice to comprare with the 735.) check it out listen for yourself and compare.

It would have taken me a lifetime to explain it that way, Dirk.GW

Can't ever remember being on an Airbus- any type. Maybe an Ansett A320 once but that was a long time ago! I'm sure your right about the fan noise. Seems to be mostly drowned out by the wind/exhaust noise though.On the 737's at least.

>a340.net, multimedia, videos, beoing aircraft, 737 take>off(cocpit shot) from toulouse. 737-500. What u said bout the>wind noise is true, cant refute that, but take a peak at the>video. The fan growling internal noise im talking about is>not as noticeable on the 73s. but VERY noticable on the airbus>343 witch operate the similar cfm56 engines. Also>flightlevel350>alaska airlines 739( nice to comprare with the 735.) check it>out listen for yourself and compare. You realize that videos do not capture a "standard" 737 sound right? Facts are that many factors change a perspective on its sound! 1. Position of the bird.[Above you, below, In front, behind]2. Position in the plane [in the cockpit, in front/behind engines]3. Weather [clear day vs. cloudy day, precip, also temperature!]4. Aircraft's status in flight [ TO, CLIMB, CRUISE, DECENT, APP, L] 5. Also, humans have different abilities to pick up on distinct soundThere is no possible way to capture a truly accurate 737 sound or any plane for that matter. The reasons are that there are so many factors that change the sound. PMDG captured a good reasonable facsimile of it, but you can't expect them or anyone to fully get it perfect.Even 737 pilots will tell you each sound different.Randy Oldfield

>Anyone here EVER been in a aircraft before? Doesn't sound>like it. The loudest sound I here on take-off(in cabin) is the>roar of the jet exhaust. Like a rocket I guess. As you climb>that sound diminishes(seems too) and you get the wind noise>increasing. >>I've been in the cockpit several times in the past for a short>visit and its the same as the cabin. Perhaps less engine noise>but over the noise of the airstream rushing past, you can't>really tell.>>Watching the 737-300 cockpit video that came with the DF>purchase, its sounds like on take-off that you here a roar>from the cockpit. I don't here any whine. No humming noise of>the fan. A loud roar at take-off power. Not as loud as in the>cabin of course.>>>>Now OUTSIDE is a different thing. A low buzzing noise is about>it. Damn good engines now!>>>I still don't have the PMDG product, so I can't say how>realistic they are. Either way, I turn my engine sounds down>and the envirement noises up to hear the rushing wind. More>realistic.>>>>Jonno.If you want to hear some very realistic wind noise sounds especially when you lower the landing gear and flaps, get the program FSHotFSX. Also makes your AI Traffic sound like you are really at an airport.

"PMDG captured a good reasonable facsimile of it, but you can't expect them or anyone to fully get it perfect."while that is true, my point doesnt change. That high pitch whine already confirmed to be heard from the cocpit is not on the Pmdg sound. As already mentioned in previous posts, one type of sound that cannot be confused by the human ear are high frequency pitched sounds. While videos dont TOTALLY capture the sounds they atleast give u an idea of What sounds are at work at a particular throttle setting. If you record the sounds from a video or the airplane itself, shouldn't it sound exactly like the thing you recorded?I wish someone would explain to me also y the sounds are the exact copy of a 777 soundset I purchased from aaron swindle a few years ago. Which is my main point above ne thing else. Which one out of the two are lying to me?

>hey mr Smith, I HEAR u loud n clear, lol. Do me a favor if u>will, take a peek at the video and tell me what U think.>a340.net, multimedia, flight videos, other aircraft,>boeing.(its freee) Sure its a video of a 735 but with the>similar cfm56 series engine. >I've been on Southwest's 733 and 73G and I can say for sure the sound between the two vary quite a bit. The 733 seems to have more of a growl to it. So in turn, the 735 WOULDNT sound the same.

while that is true, my point doesnt change.Well, you don't have a point, so I suppose that's true.That high pitch whine already confirmed to be heard from the cocpit is not on the Pmdg sound. As already mentioned in previous posts, one type of sound that cannot be confused by the human ear are high frequency pitched sounds. While videos dont TOTALLY capture the sounds they atleast give u an idea of What sounds are at work at a particular throttle setting. If you record the sounds from a video or the airplane itself, shouldn't it sound exactly like the thing you recorded?OK, I'll say this in caps to see if you understand it (and to add emphasis): NOT ALL ENGINES OF THE SAME TYPE SOUND THE SAME. I'll provide a real-life example:I am a fan of the 757-200. I go to the airport on a regular basis and sit there seeing planes take off and land. I've been chasing one specific registration AA has on a 757, N620AA. The aircraft sounded the same as always, very nice and deep (gotta love RB211's). But then it got maintenance, and it came back having a loud whine when it spooled up. Some AA757's do it, some don't. I've been in 738's a lot, some whine. But some don't. Please, understand this. Just because it's the same engine type it does not mean it'll sound the same. Does your car engine sound the same as every other engine of the same type of car? No. Take it to the mechanic, make some fixes... The sound might change. The same happens to aircraft.I wish someone would explain to me also y the sounds are the exact copy of a 777 soundset I purchased from aaron swindle a few years ago. Which is my main point above ne thing else. Which one out of the two are lying to me?Neither, because Aaron Swindle did the sounds from this aircraft. In any case, I doubt it's identical... Now, to the guy who's using an A343 engine and a 735 soundclip to prove this:That's laughable. The 777's engine is a RR, as is the 757's. Should I compare them? Are they the same engine? Please. Hell, do the old RB's for the 757 sound the same as the new ones?Please guys, stop making an issue out of this. The soundset is accurate within the large margin of error there is when making a soundset for an entire aircraft range.Daniel P.http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/ng_driver.jpgMember of SJU Photography. [A HREF=http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=9004]Click Here[/A] to view my aircraft photos at JetPhotos.Net!The official psychotic AA painter. :)