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Guest SteveFrost

LOD Radius

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Guest SteveFrost
LOD = Level Of Detail. Put your aircraft in the very center of a large imaginary cylinder. The radius is measured from your aircraft to the edge of the cylinder. Any scenery within this radius gets full graphical detail. Anything outside, well, doesn't. What I think would be cool would be a dynamically variable LOD radius. Instead of a cylinder, say a cone or a sphere. That way, the radius would change in relation to altitude. You generally don't need a huge radius on the ground or at high altitude. Those would be great places to save on frame rates. It's an idea that had been thrown around for a possible FS-Next, but I don't know if it's possible for FSX. Jeff ShylukSenior Staff ReviewerAVSIM
Well explained :( I like your idea about the cone/sphere idea. It could really help framerates for those high fliers but I don't think it's possible with FSX. I'm guessing the LOD Radius model was built into the sim engine and therefore can't be changed.
What I would like to see is the plane NOT being in the very center of the circle, but a bit more to the back. Usually you look forward or to the sides: I hardly look (completely) to the back. (But I always fly in the VC and never outside of the plane.) This would mean you can see more crispy textures in front of you without any loss in fps or loading times.
Also a good idea but I guess it seems logical to have an even spread of detail.

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Steve,I may have had a misperception about exactly what your Texture Max Load application does. And I'm curious as to how the LOD Radius one will work now.I assumed the Texture Max Load editor PREVENTED FSX from changing say a 4096 setting BACK to the default 1024 if I used any of the sliders in FSX WHILE flying in FSX. But it appears the "mouse over" explanations in the application interface say it only RELOADS a setting of 4096 when FSX starts, if it has been reset to the default.Can you clarify? 1. If I have Texture Max Load Editor running, with it set to 4096, and I use any of the sliders in FSX, will it PREVENT FSX from resetting back to 1024 WHILE I am flying in FSX?2. Same question for the proposed LOD Editor: If I have my LOD set to 8.5, then use any of the sliders WHILE FLYING in FSX, will it PREVENT FSX from resetting the LOD back to 4.5?Thanks for clarifying.Rick


Rick Ryan

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Guest SteveFrost
Steve,I may have had a misperception about exactly what your Texture Max Load application does. And I'm curious as to how the LOD Radius one will work now.I assumed the Texture Max Load editor PREVENTED FSX from changing say a 4096 setting BACK to the default 1024 if I used any of the sliders in FSX WHILE flying in FSX. But it appears the "mouse over" explanations in the application interface say it only RELOADS a setting of 4096 when FSX starts, if it has been reset to the default.Can you clarify? 1. If I have Texture Max Load Editor running, with it set to 4096, and I use any of the sliders in FSX, will it PREVENT FSX from resetting back to 1024 WHILE I am flying in FSX?2. Same question for the proposed LOD Editor: If I have my LOD set to 8.5, then use any of the sliders WHILE FLYING in FSX, will it PREVENT FSX from resetting the LOD back to 4.5?Thanks for clarifying.Rick
Hi Rick,I think FSX uses the fsx.cfg file by loading all of the values into an array (or similar methods of storing data) when you are loading your flight and therefore, any changes made while flying or after flying will not be loaded into the array. For example, If I start a flight with a TML value of 1024 then decide that I want a value of 4096 in the middle of my flight, this will not be possible. The changes must be made before the flight.Unfortunately, the same applies to the LOD Radius value which is also in the fsx.cfg file. The only way to actually change the values while flying is to force FSX to re-cache the fsx.cfg file and then re-draw the screen which is neither practical nor efficient and is probably not even possible (or beyond my ability of programming).When the TMLE starts, the value in the drop down box (the one in the main form, not the options window) displays the current value in the fsx.cfg file. I might issue an update to have the fsx.exe version information replaced with the current TML value and some of the rollover boxes made clearer. I will add some information to the downloads page about the limitations with changing the TML value while flying.Steve

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Hi Rick,I think FSX uses the fsx.cfg file by loading all of the values into an array (or similar methods of storing data) when you are loading your flight and therefore, any changes made while flying or after flying will not be loaded into the array. For example, If I start a flight with a TML value of 1024 then decide that I want a value of 4096 in the middle of my flight, this will not be possible. The changes must be made before the flight.Unfortunately, the same applies to the LOD Radius value which is also in the fsx.cfg file. The only way to actually change the values while flying is to force FSX to re-cache the fsx.cfg file and then re-draw the screen which is neither practical nor efficient and is probably not even possible (or beyond my ability of programming).
Maybe I don't really understand what you are saying ;) but AFAIK and IMHO any new settings in the cfg will be applied when you change settings that force FSX te reload things. When I change for instance the autogen setting in FSX this will 1. cause FSX to reload a lot of things and 2. to also reload the cfg settings. I usually have a LOD of 6.5 but I do remember that after changing some settings in midflight (don't know exactly which ones), I got the load screen and after that my LOD was reset to default (4.5). So if you find a way to change the LOD in flight (and also a TML setting) and make FSX reload things again, you CAN change those settings in mid-flight. Okay, this takes time (reloading) but at least it's not necessary to completely restart FSX or anything.And btw when you change a setting in mid-flight that resets the LOD and TML, you can save those settings in a cfg file, then go to the load menu, right-click the setting (before you load it), edit it (LOD and TML (don't know if the latter is saved in such a cfg: the LOD is) and THEN load it. So it IS possible to change these setting while flying, altough it always requires a few steps and loading time.

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JvanE,Yeah, I've used those saved .cfg files that you can load using the "Save" and "Load" capabilities in FSX. They cause a reload of the scenery, and take as much time (normally) as a fresh "start" of FSX. But it DOES allow you to reset things like TML and LOD Radius to higher settings after they have been reset to the max defaults, without having to completely restart FSX.So it seems that the real problem that still exists in FSX is that if you use ANY of the slider settings to change something like autogen, AI traffic percentages (air or ground), any setting that you manually made higher than a maximum default slider setting will STILL get reset back to it's maximum default slider setting. In the case of TML, that is 1024. In the case of LOD Radius, that is 4.5.What we REALLY need is an application that allows us to change the value of ONE slider (or more) in FSX without it causing all the REST of the values in the .cfg file to get reset. That probably isn't possible, as it looks like whenever you change any slider, the whole darn fsx.cfg file gets re-written, and can use settings no higher than the maximum values assigned to the sliders. So we really don't have a solution yet. The editors now only reset the TML to something higher than 1024 BEFORE you load FSX. And it appears the LOD one will only do the same. The only viable option right now WHILE FLYING appears to be still using saved fsx.cfg files to load using the "Load" option in FSX. And as you said, that causes a complete reload of all the scenery, etc, and can take a lot of time.


Rick Ryan

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JvanE,Yeah, I've used those saved .cfg files that you can load using the "Save" and "Load" capabilities in FSX. They cause a reload of the scenery, and take as much time (normally) as a fresh "start" of FSX. But it DOES allow you to reset things like TML and LOD Radius to higher settings after they have been reset to the max defaults, without having to completely restart FSX.So it seems that the real problem that still exists in FSX is that if you use ANY of the slider settings to change something like autogen, AI traffic percentages (air or ground), any setting that you manually made higher than a maximum default slider setting will STILL get reset back to it's maximum default slider setting. In the case of TML, that is 1024. In the case of LOD Radius, that is 4.5.What we REALLY need is an application that allows us to change the value of ONE slider (or more) in FSX without it causing all the REST of the values in the .cfg file to get reset. That probably isn't possible, as it looks like whenever you change any slider, the whole darn fsx.cfg file gets re-written, and can use settings no higher than the maximum values assigned to the sliders. So we really don't have a solution yet. The editors now only reset the TML to something higher than 1024 BEFORE you load FSX. And it appears the LOD one will only do the same. The only viable option right now WHILE FLYING appears to be still using saved fsx.cfg files to load using the "Load" option in FSX. And as you said, that causes a complete reload of all the scenery, etc, and can take a lot of time.
In Texture Max Load Editor make sure you check "Run Service" and "Run Application when Windows starts" if you set these two, the TML will ALWAYS be at 4096 or whatever value you set it too, also make sure to select the texture resolution you want in the main app, and settings!

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In Texture Max Load Editor make sure you check "Run Service" and "Run Application when Windows starts" if you set these two, the TML will ALWAYS be at 4096 or whatever value you set it too, also make sure to select the texture resolution you want in the main app, and settings!
OK, pardon me for being a little dense here, but...1. I don't WANT it to run every time I start Windows. Why should I? If I'm not running FSX, then I don't need an extra application "running in the background" on my computer. So I shouldn't need to check "Run Application When Windows Starts".2. In the "Options" menu, under "General Options", there is a check box for "Run application when FS starts". Seems to me that is the one I would want to check...and the ONLY one I would NEED to check. It implies that whenever I start FSX, then TMLE will also start, and I could use any slider I wanted in the FSX Scenery Settings, and TML would not let FSX change my TML from 4096 back to 1024. 3. I can see no reason to check the "Run Service" box on the main TMLE screen. IF TMLE loads and runs when I start FSX when I have the box checked from #2 above, I should never have to manually start TMLE. As long as the resolution setting chosen in TMLE is 4096, I should NEVER have to have TMLE start with Windows, nor have to manually execute it myself. It would start, and run, ONLY when I started FSX...and that's when I NEED it to be running. No other time.So...is that how it works, or not?Rick

Rick Ryan

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If TMLE is set to 4096 prior to starting FSX the textures will be HD 4096. The second you change a scenery slider in FSX (I don't think weather sliders effect TML) the value will be RESET to 1024So as long as you don't change the scenery sliders, you'll never have to run TMLE.


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OK, pardon me for being a little dense here, but...1. I don't WANT it to run every time I start Windows. Why should I? If I'm not running FSX, then I don't need an extra application "running in the background" on my computer. So I shouldn't need to check "Run Application When Windows Starts".2. In the "Options" menu, under "General Options", there is a check box for "Run application when FS starts". Seems to me that is the one I would want to check...and the ONLY one I would NEED to check. It implies that whenever I start FSX, then TMLE will also start, and I could use any slider I wanted in the FSX Scenery Settings, and TML would not let FSX change my TML from 4096 back to 1024. 3. I can see no reason to check the "Run Service" box on the main TMLE screen. IF TMLE loads and runs when I start FSX when I have the box checked from #2 above, I should never have to manually start TMLE. As long as the resolution setting chosen in TMLE is 4096, I should NEVER have to have TMLE start with Windows, nor have to manually execute it myself. It would start, and run, ONLY when I started FSX...and that's when I NEED it to be running. No other time.So...is that how it works, or not?Rick
If you don't choose start with windows, and start with FSX, it might not get the TML line in time. You HAVE to chock run service or else it won't change automatically and you will have to set the res each time, its not like the program is some kind of virus...

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If you don't choose start with windows, and start with FSX, it might not get the TML line in time. You HAVE to chock run service or else it won't change automatically and you will have to set the res each time, its not like the program is some kind of virus...
gman,I appreciate your inputs, but you can stop with the sarcasm. I notice your signature block says you are 16-years old. I'm 55, with over 35 years IT experience. It doesn't matter if TMLE is not a virus...there is absolutely NO REASON to have an application load with Windows startup if you AREN'T going to be using the application. It only consumes CPU and Memory resources that don't need to be used for what you DO want to use the computer for at the time. And that is one of the major problems with a computer NOT running at it's peak performance capability. And a reason many FS users have to run things like "Game Booster", etc, to close down all the unnecesary "background apps" they have running on their computers just to get FS to run in the first place. If I were to follow your reasoning, I would leave FS Commander, Active Sky Advanced, REX, AI Smooth, Radar Contact, Multi Crew Experience, and a few other "FS Only" applications running while I was using Paint Shop Pro and not FSX.-----------------------------------------------Steve,Can you provide definite clarification on what needs to be done with TMLE? Specifically, if I start out with an fsx.cfg file that already has the TML=4096 setting:1. What is the correct way to get TMLE to "run" when I have FSX running? Will checking the "Run application when FS Starts" do it? Or do I need to have other things checked, or manually start TMLE first before starting FSX?2. If I start FSX with an fsx.cfg file that has TML=4096 already in it, will TMLE prevent FSX from resetting the TML to default 1024 if I use the sliders in FSX? That is what I thought TMLE does. But after this thread, I'm not so sure about that anymore. I don't care about being able to go FROM 1024 to 4096...I just want to know if TMLE STOPS FSX going FROM 4096 to 1024 if I use any sliders.Thanks for any clarification.Rick

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gman,I appreciate your inputs, but you can stop with the sarcasm. I notice your signature block says you are 16-years old. I'm 55, with over 35 years IT experience. It doesn't matter if TMLE is not a virus...there is absolutely NO REASON to have an application load with Windows startup if you AREN'T going to be using the application. It only consumes CPU and Memory resources that don't need to be used for what you DO want to use the computer for at the time. And that is one of the major problems with a computer NOT running at it's peak performance capability. And a reason many FS users have to run things like "Game Booster", etc, to close down all the unnecesary "background apps" they have running on their computers just to get FS to run in the first place. If I were to follow your reasoning, I would leave FS Commander, Active Sky Advanced, REX, AI Smooth, Radar Contact, Multi Crew Experience, and a few other "FS Only" applications running while I was using Paint Shop Pro and not FSX.-----------------------------------------------Steve,Can you provide definite clarification on what needs to be done with TMLE? Specifically, if I start out with an fsx.cfg file that already has the TML=4096 setting:1. What is the correct way to get TMLE to "run" when I have FSX running? Will checking the "Run application when FS Starts" do it? Or do I need to have other things checked, or manually start TMLE first before starting FSX?2. If I start FSX with an fsx.cfg file that has TML=4096 already in it, will TMLE prevent FSX from resetting the TML to default 1024 if I use the sliders in FSX? That is what I thought TMLE does. But after this thread, I'm not so sure about that anymore. I don't care about being able to go FROM 1024 to 4096...I just want to know if TMLE STOPS FSX going FROM 4096 to 1024 if I use any sliders.Thanks for any clarification.Rick
I was trying to help you but it seems like you obviously may not have read my message correctly, and I wasn't being sarcastic, just running one extra program is not going to hurt your fps, and its not a bad program. You were acting like its a virus or something saying that you should "NEVER" have to do this and never have to do that. Relax... unless you run a Pentium 3 or something. I never said that you should leave all programs on as well, your taking my message for more than it should be... I also said TMLE does NOT protect your FSX from changing to 1024 if you chnage the sliders UNLESS you check "Run Service" only then will it automatically check if there have been changes the the TML line... I also am good with computers you know... don't forget, and I am learning programming. I have FSX running at over 50 FPS over, ultra high tileproxy or no tileproxy. I do not need any unuseful programs to shut down services which could just cause more problems and errors, and I also have firefox in the background for flight planning and weather, winamp for music, and various other apps while I run FSX. Maybe you need to optimize your PC a bit...

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Fine. You run your computer whatever way you want to. I'll run mine the way it should be run. Good luck on your programing course. I guess you haven't had the class yet on writing code and implementing applications that don't use unnecessary system resources...and the reasons not to. Whatever....Oh...just curious. When you use that TileProxy, do you disable your firewall and turn off your anti-virus protection? Like the documentation says? Uh huh.....---------------------------------Steve,If you read this thread anymore, PM me. You were looking for feedback and inputs for the LOD version. I'll give you some good advice on what to include in the user interface so you don't mess with people's computers...especially "newbie" users who will run whatever is included in an application without knowing any better.Rick


Rick Ryan

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Guest SteveFrost

Hi Guys,Let me clear a few things up here.1. The Texture Max Load Editor has an option to start the application when windows starts. This option is for people who have a system dedicated to Flight Simulator and want to run it as soon as they fire up the system. I personally don't use this option because I have other uses for my computer.2. The option to run the TMLE when FS starts is for people who want the application to start with FSX if they are planning to change their settings or want to make sure that they are running the 4096 textures at the resolution they want to view them.3. The service is used to keep an eye on the fsx.cfg TEXTURE_MAX_LOAD entry. Basically, the service looks for a change on the time/date stamp of the file. If it is different from the last check, it will re-write the TML value. The service will write to the file at a maximum of five seconds after the cfg entry has been changed. The service works in the same way as you clicking the "Apply settings" button works only the service is working off a timer.

Steve,Can you provide definite clarification on what needs to be done with TMLE? Specifically, if I start out with an fsx.cfg file that already has the TML=4096 setting:1. What is the correct way to get TMLE to "run" when I have FSX running? Will checking the "Run application when FS Starts" do it? Or do I need to have other things checked, or manually start TMLE first before starting FSX?2. If I start FSX with an fsx.cfg file that has TML=4096 already in it, will TMLE prevent FSX from resetting the TML to default 1024 if I use the sliders in FSX? That is what I thought TMLE does. But after this thread, I'm not so sure about that anymore. I don't care about being able to go FROM 1024 to 4096...I just want to know if TMLE STOPS FSX going FROM 4096 to 1024 if I use any sliders.Thanks for any clarification.Rick
1. If you want to get the application to change your TML value automatically, run the application when FS starts, enable the auto-change option and set your resolution in the options window. If you want, you can get the application to close after it has changed the resolution.2. The TMLE service will keep on checking the time/date stamp on the fsx.cfg file as long as you keep it running. Therefore, if you change any sliders in fsx, the service will see the change in date and re-write the value to the one you last chose when you ran the service.I will do more research into under what circumstances the TMLE service works in flight and report back soon.I hope I have cleared up a few things that have been going around in this thread. I may issue an update to the TMLE at a later date to improve the clarity of what the application does and how it does it.Now, back to the LOD Radius :(

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Fine. You run your computer whatever way you want to. I'll run mine the way it should be run. Good luck on your programing course. I guess you haven't had the class yet on writing code and implementing applications that don't use unnecessary system resources...and the reasons not to. Whatever....Oh...just curious. When you use that TileProxy, do you disable your firewall and turn off your anti-virus protection? Like the documentation says? Uh huh.....---------------------------------Steve,If you read this thread anymore, PM me. You were looking for feedback and inputs for the LOD version. I'll give you some good advice on what to include in the user interface so you don't mess with people's computers...especially "newbie" users who will run whatever is included in an application without knowing any better.Rick
Sorry to hijack your thread...Well I don't and usually people say that running AV and Firewall will hinder performance and I have tried both ways, still get the same results AV/Firewall, in the firewall I made it so that it accepts all requests from tileproxy so don't see how that can hinder performance, and in both my AV programs (Avast and AVG) the tileproxy and FSX directories are selected to not be scanned automatically, unless there is a manual scan. BTW How can he "mess with people's computers" when the user chose to install the programs, read the EULA, and also should have read how the application works on the website... and can also choose the options of the program.

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Steve,OK, thanks for the clarification. FWIW, it appears TMLE is working the way you intended it to work. When I have it set to run when FSX starts, I can change other settings in FSX using the sliders and my TML stays at 4096. So far, so good.But there is something that is still confusing. Does TMLE "run in the background" when I do the above? In other words, should I be seeing it listed in the "Processes" tab of Task Manager when I have it "Run application when FS starts"?Here's why I ask.....1. If I manually start TMLE all by itself (by clicking on a desktop shortcut I created for it), it DOES add a "tml.exe" process to the Processes tab list in Task Manager. On my computer, it shows TMLE using about 17,660K memory, and the description is "Texture Max Load Editor". That makes sense.2. If I don't manually start it, but use the "Run application when FS starts" checkbox in TMLE, when I start FSX, there is no indication in Task Manager that TMLE ever started or is running. There is no "tml.exe" entry in the "Processes" tab list in Task Manager. Yet, it appears "something" must be "doing it's thing", because I can change slider settings in FSX all day long and my "Texture_Max_Load=4096" stays at 4096.So, what is the difference between starting it "manually" vs having it start when FSX starts? Is the "tml.exe" process even necessary to have running in Task Manager for TMLE to prevent FSX from changing my TML=4096 back to 1024 if I use any FSX sliders?What exactly does the "Run Service" checkbox do? I don't have it checked, yet when I start FSX with the "Run application when FS starts" box checked, it APPEARS TMLE is doing what it is designed to do, even though there is no Process entry for it in Task Manager. Is the "tml.exe" something completely different than "something else" in TMLE that keeps FSX from resetting the TML value? With any other "background application" that "monitors" FSX, there is always a listing for it in the Processes tab of Task Manager (like when running AISmooth to monitor\redirect AI traffic, etc). What I can't figure out is why there is no Process tab entry for TMLE when I start it by using the "Run application when FS starts" checkbox instead of starting it manually.I also got your PM, and will reply back to that.ThanksRick


Rick Ryan

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