Now that each are over their intro pains and both are avsim gold star receipents, can the two be compared? Both seem to be on the leading edge of innovations, but quite different aircraft. Any of you serious fsx simmers have both? Any recommendations?I really do not wish to buy both and have to spend the considerable time learning both at the same time. ThanksRayM

Both are great, these are so far two the best military jests you can buy for FSX. Hard to say which is better, depends on whether you prefer lighter planes with simplier avionics (L-39) or full blown glass cockpit in the Hornet. Superbug has more features to offer, but this comes at a price of fps drop. For simple sightseeing I actually prefer L-39, while Hornet is for flying with nose in the cockpit looking at those all gauges and pressing all the buttons.You can buy both, start with the trainer and then switch to the powerful combat plane - just like real pilots do during their career :)

I like both, much for the same reasons some1 said. Especially if you've got the RXP GNS430 package from before, the L39 is awesome, but in a very different way from the VRS. I use the L-39 for fast VFR and aerobatics, and the VRS for carrier ops and longer flights. I do use the VRS for some high AOA extremely slow low passes now and again though, but I've ended up using the L-39 more. I don't feel competent with the VRS to take it online yet, don't know if I ever will it's so complicated. :(

Ray, I have both and have to agree with everything said so far. Both are top notch so just go with the one that suits your "style" of flying. Your hardware might be a deciding factor as the VRS is harder on FPS but not terrible by any means. I run it at 25fps locked on a 2.6Ghz Quad core with a nVidia GTX 260 and unless I'm in heavy weather or around major airports it's no problem to stay close to 25.Steve

Get the L-39. You won't be disappointed. ;)

Thanks all for the responses. Does anyone miss not having an A/P in the L-39? I just watched the Jaggyroad film promo for the fsx Superbug - lots of amazing stuff there.RayM

Both planes are as good as it gets in FSX. The VRS Superbug is far more complex and appeals to those who want more than just jump in and fly. You can do a lot more in the Superbug as well - not just fly your flight plan but carrier ops, air-to-air and air-to-ground combat as well. The depth of the systems simulation is simply astonishing and the flight model hugely challenging. If you are up for a 350 page manual and weeks of study, then go for the Superbug. If you just want a fantastically realistic jet trainer you can fly immediately, the L-39 is better.Cheers,Noel.

Now that each are over their intro pains and both are avsim gold star receipents, can the two be compared? Both seem to be on the leading edge of innovations, but quite different aircraft. Any of you serious fsx simmers have both? Any recommendations?I really do not wish to buy both and have to spend the considerable time learning both at the same time. ThanksRayM

I would suggest you go for L-39 ....it is more framerate friendly than superbug , easier to learn and fun to fly ..superbug is too advanced and hits your framerate. I am not against VRS , but i personally prefer L-39 over F-18.You can see Manual Vidoes for L-39 at youtube on "LotusSimulations" channel. One think that is hard to carry in L-39 is that while taxing you have to use differential brakes to turn , your nose wheel doesnt move.

Both are excellent. Do you like learning complex systems? - Go for the Superbug. Would you like to keep reading to a minimum? - Get the L-39.The lack of an autopilot in the L-39 is not an issue - after all, it is not like a business jet where you get yourself up to cruise altitude as quick as possible, then remain there for hours. (It does trim nicely for level flight, so you don't have to pause for short trips to get coffee).

I only have the L39, my PC is older so I doubt the F18 would work well if at all...L39 = fps friendly, fairly quick (I usually cruise FL210 avg 420 kts ground speed), dual cockpit, excellent lighting effects, multiplayer compatibility, superb systems modeling/startup procedures, lots of paint schemes included and around the net.I have nothing bad to say about it :)RE: a/p - you can easily put the default one in. I use it for longer vatsim flights - it will hold altitude and heading.

I only have the L39, my PC is older so I doubt the F18 would work well if at all...L39 = fps friendly, fairly quick (I usually cruise FL210 avg 420 kts ground speed), dual cockpit, excellent lighting effects, multiplayer compatibility, superb systems modeling/startup procedures, lots of paint schemes included and around the net.I have nothing bad to say about it :)RE: a/p - you can easily put the default one in. I use it for longer vatsim flights - it will hold altitude and heading.

Excellent news on the a/p addon. Thanks everyone for the responses. I am going with the Lotus L-39. I can always add the Superbug to my Amazon wish list for Christmas.RayM

I have purchased both aircraft as well and I must admit that the Lotussim package is the most fun and realistic of the two. The L-39 sim has 3d rendered gauges (Read: no frame rate hit whatsoever) and such an excellent virtual cockpit. Together with such superb flight dynamics, unmatched night lighting, and all-around 'feel', the L-39 is pretty hard to beat IMHO. Something to be considered in regards to the VRS Superbug is that the current version for FSX does not feature a working inertial navigation system, as well as shortcomings in how flight plans are utilized (the Superbug still relies on the default FSX flight planner). This is a significant shortcoming I think, as VRS goes to great lengths to laud the systems modeling of their Superbug. Supposedly, VRS is going to release a "PRO" version of the Superbug at a later date that will be more fully-featured and have more systems functionality. I personally don't like having to purchase a product, then have to spend more money later to upgrade for more functionality. I think VRS is being a little bit deceptive in this regard as they fail to mention any of this before you purchase the Superbug. The Lotussim L-39 package is a fully polished, all-inclusive release by contrast that provides endless hours of fun and learning. I love the darn thing. :)

Sorry mate, but I need to set a few things straight here. Before I start, let me say that I not only have a personal investement in this package, I know Jon Blum personally. I also own the L39, and enjoy it is it's own right and enjoy it thoroughly. I do think however that Jon doesn't get credit for the work that was accomplished with his Superbug.To be clear, the VRS plane ALSO has 3d gauges, where applicable. On my system, the FPS drop is also negligible, and you can adjust many features of the package to improve FPS. On my i7 however, I see very little if any FPS drop at all.About the night lighting. The VRS plane has multiple night lighting effects, and it is also the only Flight Simulator addon to feature night vision. The HUD features NFLIR, which is a night vision implementation that works correctly in the simulation.About the INS.... The switch does move correctly, but yes the system does not work. Primarily because for the correct implementation of a "moving carrier" based INS, it really comes down to programming "errors" into the simulation, something that takes a long time in a project that has already moved beyond 5 years of developing. Most INS simulations in FS are nothing more than a wait time, which accomplish little. Since this was not imperative to create an engrossing simulation, and because all this element does is induce "errors" into the navigation system (as in the digital world everything is perfect), it was felt early on that the feature should only be left for those who are high end operators. This very small omission does NOT change the fidelity of the simulation, and procedurally you can still go through the paces.This leads me to the next point, the navigation system. In the real world the Superbug mission data is often loaded prior to the plane taking off. With that said, the system utilized for navigation still mimics in intracity how the system works in the real world, including "mission" and "target" waypoints, which induce working enemy SAM sites if wanted. To keep the process simple, the default flight planner does indeed work. This is not to say however that the system works incorrectly, which is a false statement. This incorrect statement, or the way people may necessarily read it also leaves people to think that the system is "limited" by the default flight planner, which is also far from the truth. For the creation of flight plans however, you "can" if you desire utilize the default flight planner, and you can further modify the flight plan based upon your flying needs. You must remember that the Super Hornet was made to bring a pilot and his ordnance to it's target. This simulation accomplishes this accurately, and based on NATOPS and specific systems manuals after years of research. If you believe this is incorrect, then please specify and provide evidence otherwise where the simulation works incorrectly, and I assure you that VRS will correct the issue.The "PRO" version of the VRS requires many MANY more hours of intricate coding, and is a ways off as the additional system implementation does not necessarily add to the complexity of the simulation, but is more based on a commercial style platform aimed at those who "need" an exacting experience. With that said, the current implementation is indeed the most detailed simulation of a Hornet ever developed, and the developer himself has been involved with simulations (such as the Hornet) for many years. His basis for the creation of his plane is solid, and in the consumer simulation world I would take the approach that he and his team knows more about the systems on that plane than anyone else. The simple explanation is that the PRO version is not made for 98% of simmers, INCLUDING high end simulator fanatics such as those like myself, and the hundreds and thousands of customers who think the same as me and own the product.About the aerodynamics of this aircraft, this airplane has to my knowledge one of the (if not the most) accurate simulation of a Fly-By-Wire implementation ever developed for Flight Simulator. An aerodynamics engineer along with Jon developed a program which takes all user inputs and runs them through complex algorithms which then re-injects the output back into the simulator. I say this is the most accurate system because the program that does all of this "IS" a fly by wire program. Most simulations mimic FBW by using gauges that manipulate the trim system. This acts as system that runs between the user and the simulator to provide the most accurate simulation possible.To say Jon and his product are being "deceptive" bothers me considerably. Everything described about the product works exactly as advertised, and Jon has been perfectly honest and clear with customers on his forum about the product and what it does. Do I take it personal? Absolutely. Everyone involved in this product has put everything on the line to make it successful, and the most accurate simulation ever produced in Microsoft Flight Simulator of a high performance jet.... which it does. I would easily place my company, and the good word of my company on that statement.This aircraft has broken so much new ground in the FS world that I find it disingenuous to say this aircraft is anything but at the highest end of simulation technology. People for years will be trying to accomplish what Jon and his team have done, and to date nobody has come close as far as a high performance simulation of a modern combat jet.For the record as mentioned earlier I do have an investment in the product and the team behind it because this is more than a client, but a close friend. This is a product that my company and I fully endorse. I also personally "believe" in this product full heartedly, and that is something you will not often hear me say. This product is no less than a PMDG simulation of a modern combat aircraft.I hope that my explanations help clarify some of the misconceptions that some people have about this product. I would say that a significant amount of owners of the product would concur with my statements and/or have little to no issues with the fidelity.Kind regards,-CodyOwner, Jaggyroad Films

Sorry mate, but I need to set a few things straight here. Before I start, let me say that I not only have a personal investement in this package, I know Jon Blum personally. I also own the L39, and enjoy it is it's own right and enjoy it thoroughly. I do think however that Jon doesn't get credit for the work that was accomplished with his Superbug.. . . . . . . . . This aircraft has broken so much new ground in the FS world that I find it disingenuous to say this aircraft is anything but at the highest end of simulation technology. People for years will be trying to accomplish what Jon and his team have done, and to date nobody has come close as far as a high performance simulation of a modern combat jet.For the record as mentioned earlier I do have an investment in the product and the team behind it because this is more than a client, but a close friend. This is a product that my company and I fully endorse. I also personally "believe" in this product full heartedly, and that is something you will not often hear me say. This product is no less than a PMDG simulation of a modern combat aircraft.I hope that my explanations help clarify some of the misconceptions that some people have about this product. I would say that a significant amount of owners of the product would concur with my statements and/or have little to no issues with the fidelity.Kind regards,-CodyOwner, Jaggyroad Films

Thanks Cody for your quite detailed, well written and structured response. As the original poster, I find it interesting that I have learned practically all the points you made from reading the several reviews and visiting the VRS website. I certainly knew the Pro edition was never intended as an upgrade as such, but more as a super high end product for those special folks and also that Jon stated he intended to give current owners that did decide to purchase the Pro version a generous price break. I also do not consider using the default flight planner a negative as I use it for my Captsim 757 and 767 and also for the PMDG 747-400 flight planning.As stated earlier in the thread, your promo film of the VRS F-18E Superbug is just terrific. I must have watched it a dozen times now and each viewing reveals more that I had not seen previously.RayM

Thank you Raymar for your response. I hope I did not come off as offensive or cross. I hope you enjoy the L-39 as much as I have, and that also if you decide to purchase the Superbug you will also enjoy it. In reality, I think these two products offer very different experiences. The old and often applied "apples versus oranges" applies here as well.Cheers and beers mate,-Cody

Thank you Raymar for your response. I hope I did not come off as offensive or cross. I hope you enjoy the L-39 as much as I have, and that also if you decide to purchase the Superbug you will also enjoy it. In reality, I think these two products offer very different experiences. The old and often applied "apples versus oranges" applies here as well.Cheers and beers mate,-Cody

Actually, I have not purchased either just yet. I am away from my pc for another 2 or 3 weeks and will delay the actual purchase until I am home and can download the addon properly. As an old Navy guy (subs), I tend to lean toward anything Navy. I leafed thru a magazine yesterday at a bookstore that was about 100+ pages of real life photos of various F-18 wings or Sq. around the world. One caption caught my eye - the CAG was making his 1,000 carrier landing. Wow!RayM