ASK Developers

[aceridgey 330]

Hi guys,For the flight development, one would hope that the development team will ask the industry leaders how to make this the best simulation ever, scenery developers and aircraft developers alike.Boeing successfully did this when designing the 777. I would really expect for microsoft to approach pmdg, uk2000 aerosoft orbx etc to ask what does fsx limit and what you make better etc.CheerssAlex

[mmann 72]

The Microsoft Flight development team members could also check out the Aerosoft Forum for AEROSOFT FLIGHT SIMULATOR 2012 and read page after page of suggested improvements.Regards, Mike Mann

[rightseater 0]

Not being someone particularly knowlageable about computers, I wonder how many new or improved features can be implemented in Flight before we are brought right back to the criticism of performance issues that followed FSX? There are so many things I would love to see implemented in Flight, I just don't know how far they can go before you need a super computer powered by plutonium in order to run it. I've got my fingers crossed for sloped runways and better ATC, at least.

[Highmike 68]

I've got my fingers crossed for sloped runways and better ATC, at least.

I've been looking at approach videos on Youtube and I think I've yet to see a runway that didn't have some kink in it somewhere along its length. Here's my favourite sloped runway at the moment at Talcha in Nepal:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhZhfNAgGC8Flat runways lack realism but implementing them in Flight will probably depend on the terain mesh resolution.

[N2056 33]

Let's think about this in terms of the big picture. If I were working on a product to sell to the broadest possible market would they actually know there was such a thing as sloped runways, and more importantly...would they care?

[Highmike 68]

Another aspect of the debate about sloped runways is the inertial effects you see on a lot of flight deck videos. I know from being a passenger on a commercial flight that a lot of aircraft touch down with a solid jolt and bounce along on a pretty bumpy runway. I’d love to see this implemented in Flight.I’ve seen pretty good inertial effects implemented in NFS Shift with their physics modelling so maybe we could hope for something similar in Flight.

[rightseater 0]

Let's think about this in terms of the big picture. If I were working on a product to sell to the broadest possible market would they actually know there was such a thing as sloped runways, and more importantly...would they care?

I don't know Robert. I'll be the first to admit that marketing and economics are far from my expertise. However, I did get the impression that the folks working on Flight are sincere about remaining dedicated to the core group of enthusiasts who have, in my opinion, been essential to the franchises existance. I guess we'll see if that's true or not when Flight hits the shelves. Regardless, I'm equally convinced that Austin is very serious about making X-Plane more competative with the MS franchise than ever before, and I always keep that in the back of my mind as a fallback should Flight dissapoint.I also don't know what anyone elses experience is re: sloped runways. But to me it seems like making a racecar game and forgetting the steering wheel, or making a golf game and leaving out the putter. It's such an essential component of immersion that has been lacking since day one. Would they care? I don't know, I just hope. They (ACES) certainly cared about a lot of things, but were unable for whatever reason to implement them at the time. We heard about their desire to have cloud shadows, in fact, you can still find images on the web from an early beta release FSX interface where it was an option, though I don't know if it ever worked, or for that matter, what sort of performance impact it might have had. There's even a thread or two still laying around where beta testers (including developers) noted a desire by ACES to have sloped runways, but once again, for some reason it just didn't happen. I hope the new team is as concerned about authenticity as the old one, but this time will make it happen. If not, I've still got hopes for XP10. If that fails me, I've still got the Baron parked in St. Augustine, and that's as real as it gets.

[dmaher 0]

Rightseater, I think you’re absolutely right.IMO MS is well aware of all the features that could improve the experience – most often before we are.Because each employee working on a component is always thinking about how to improve it.And they advocate for their ideas too – I hope ;)A feature like sloped runways clearly has some technical roadblocks.I think the person that mentioned the complications for AI has the right thinking.As far as I can tell FS has a very efficient but rudimentary collision system.I’m sure we could come up with a dozen other complications this would introduce too.But they’re in the problem solving business. So, I’m hopeful they’ll solve sloped runways soon.In the past the Dev conferences allowed for good two way feedback between MS and 3PD’s.Of course there’s never absolute two-way transparency, but the conferences really severed well.I hope these continue.The OP’s point is a good one.The roadblocks 3PD’s encounter can be very obscure.

[HughesMDflyer4 470]

The reason sloped runways have not been a feature of MSFS is probably that it would require extremely high resolution terrain data to give the correct slope and not have it be a rough (pointy) slope. It also might be a challenge to make the AI traffic and other variables work out correctly with something like this.

[rightseater 0]

The reason sloped runways have not been a feature of MSFS is probably that it would require extremely high resolution terrain data to give the correct slope and not have it be a rough (pointy) slope. It also might be a challenge to make the AI traffic and other variables work out correctly with something like this.

If it were done as it currently is in X-Plane9, then I would definitely see a problem. I have encountered numerous airports in XP that are simply unuseable because the runways simply follow the terrain, even a few major airports that are so unrealistic that I avoided them like the plague. However, one suggestion I heard prior to the release of FS9 was to not worry about each runway being particularly true to life right now, but just get the ball rolling by having them sloped, not necessarily with the same exact slope you'd find in the real world for each runway. I think the popular theory at the time was that it would have to be done for each airport individually since following terrain contour would indeed require extraordinarily accurate data. But I don't know what can be done, I just keep my fingers crossed. Along with a MAJOR improvement in ATC, I think sloped runways would be an enormous improvement in immersion. I'd also like to see rain that isn't in a cone around my aircraft, or be able to squelch in ATIS, as well as multiple other improvements, but sloped runways and improved ATC have been at the top of my list since I first picked up this hobby.dmaher, I also remember a few of the ACES folks chatting on messenger after FS9 was released. I sat in on a couple chats, and was amazed as to how committed they were to improving MSFS. I know they took a lot of flak after FSX hit the stores, but those folks were serious about the franchise, and very much dedicated to the core enthusiasts. The most common response I remember hearing is that they just didn't have time, and that limitations were very difficult to overcome without creating more problems. I bet technology has come along way since then, and I fully expect to be surprised by Flight.

[dmaher 0]

The reason sloped runways have not been a feature of MSFS is probably that it would require extremely high resolution terrain data to give the correct slope and not have it be a rough (pointy) slope. It also might be a challenge to make the AI traffic and other variables work out correctly with something like this.

It’s true, but it would be sort of misleading to limit the problem to mesh resolution.I can imagine there are very many systems that take advantage of a fixed airfield height.They’d all need new methods...and take up more processing power...plus new content.I don’t understand airport design, but my impression is they use a lot of top down 2D data.There are over 24000 airports to work on - most must be entirely procedurally built.But, if they built say 8 airports with sloped runways the add-on developers could build the others ;)

[MatthewS 761]

The Flight devs must speak to at least PMDG, ORBX and REX!