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Richard Sennett

Landing at a specific runway please help

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Hi guys: Quick question when you are doing your flight plan ahead of time especially like fsbuild quick build, what I don’t understand is how are you know which runway you are going to land at, you do not know that until you get near the airport from the atc right ? so could someone explain how you would compensate for the runway change, doesn’t that make the original fsbuild files useless in the fmc at that point? thanks so much appreciate the help. Regards, Rich

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It's mostly the same concept as on depature. A general rule of thumb is that you want to take off and land in the direction the wind is coming from. You can check the weather at your destination to make a good guess which runway is open for landing and plan your flight accordingly. So for example, if the wind is coming from 230 degrees it's likely you will be landing on runway 23 or a runway that is facing in a similar direction.

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The first things you need to know is if your terminal procedures (SIDs and STARs) are runway specific. If they are look for transition points common to all runways.Depending on your ATC product in use, you can elect to just contain the common points of your direction chosen SID and STAR in your plan. On your Smith's type (Boeing and some others) FMC you can change your arrival by using the DEP/ARR page and selecting the runway in use or a full procedure. You then edit your legs as necessary by closing up discontinuities and/or moving up you first different procedure waypoint on your legs page if required. To move up a waypoint in the legs page just LSK the name of the waypoint you wish to move up. That puts it in the scratch pad. Then LSK the position where you want it (or one before, don't recall) and that and following waypoints will be moved up on the legs page. You also do a similar action to accomplish a 'direct-to' to skip waypoints or redirect the flight path if you are getting vectors and need to go from your present position to your next waypoint.If your top waypoint is correct but you are off the flight path (as in taking vectors) to go direct to it from your present position LSK it twice and EXE the change. To skip a waypoint LSK the next waypoint you want and then LSK the top waypoint on page 1 and EXE it. For these changes you may want to revert to your MCP setting it for present heading (I keep my MCP up to date as I am flying along with VNAV and LNAV) to avoid sudden changes when I EXE or ACT a LEGS change involving the next waypoint at the top of the list.)Regarding FSBuild it will expand SIDs and STARS into individual waypoints in the route grid for export. It has a build option that is not sticky between sessions called Build from Grid Table. You can delete specific waypoints in this after your Autoroute build and then rebuild for export if this suits your needs to keep just common waypoints of procedures. Also if you are using FSBuild prior to 2.4 male sure the SR button is 'up' as in not highlighted as that will force stored older contributed flight plans with older data.Here's a lengthy tip document I made up for FSBuild 2.3 which is almost the same for FSBuild 2.4, a free upgrade for FSB 2 users:----------------------FSB tips:1. Include this line in FSbuild.cfg:NAVCHKDUPDIST=100This decreases the chance of using the wrong duplicate named local (to the airport) waypiont from a nearby airport. Local waypoint names are not exclusive. It decreases the database search when it is named in the route to within a 100 nm radius of your airport. You will find these in terminal procedures such as "D" number something within a SID or STAR to define a merge or turning point.2. When doing a Auto Generate (Route) be sure the SR (Stored Route) button next to it is "up" that is not highlighted. Auto Generate will use a stored route if found by default and most are out of date with old waypoints and terminal procedures. Having Stored Routes off forces it to search a path with fresh data. (Now off by default in version 2.4.)**REVISED 12/31/10** 3. Starting soon in 2011 FS Build database updates will be exclusively released through navigraph.com. It should be part of the FMC data line. For those not familiar with Navigraph each subscription term (cycle) includes multiple format downloads at no additional cost. This is very convenient for aligning FMC/navigation equipment databases with the flightplanner so among other things ATC data and your nav equipment data should match as you send a plan to ATC and then load it including terminal procedures into your FMC. The 2.4 upgrade includes the thirteenth cycle of 2010.4. Where an airport uses specific runways for different terminal procedures select the runway using an estimate based on weather and if the runway fits your aircraft requirements before doing the Auto Generate. This helps select the correct SID and STAR for the runway and direction of departure and arrival.5. After the Auto Generate and/or first build look at the map created to spot any obvious errors. In the route grid look for any sudden non-sensible changes in direction or extremely long legs not in the correct direction creating a zig-zag in the map. (See item 6 following to correct).6. Be aware there is an option you can set for each session titled "Build Route from Grid Table". It does not stick between sessions. This lets you build from an edited route grid that you may have modified without recreating the table with the same error on your next build/export. For example you might wish to drop an errant waypoint when proofing the map and rebuilding.7. Sometimes the name of a procedure (SID/STAR) does not match the name exactly in a published route and the procedure will not expand into its plan waypoints in the grid table. You can click on the arrow in the SID/STAR box to see what close name is in the FSB database. (Another reason to keep up with AIRACS.) For example KMSP has a current real such as this one:http://flightaware.com/resources/airport/KMSP/DP/WAUKON+TWObut the FSB database only has UKN2. (It does have UKN3 now with the latest available AIRAC update). If so in the route line just change UKN3 to UKN2 so it will expand. Here's a real route from flightaware.com for KMSP to KMDW:KMSP UKN3 DBQ CVA MOTIF3 KMDWthat can be pasted into the FSB route line. If UKN3 or MOTIF3 does not expand in the route grid to individual way points look in the upper part of FSB in the airport section dropping down the SID or STAR box to get the available version and substitute that label in the route line and rebuild. Note that the SID and STAR dropdowns may follow the chosen runway in certain areas.8. Sometimes it takes a second build to get the map to move and/or magnify. The mouse scroll wheel lets you magnify. Just click on the portion of the map you want to center on and scroll to magnify.9. If you click on a line in the route grid table to highlight it, the waypoint on the map will turn red. This is useful for finding errant waypoints that cause an error in the path. That line can then be edited or deleted and a rebuild accomplished with the build option to build from the route grid table.10. If you are running a weather program such as active sky, first build the route in FSB exporting to FS9 using an anticipated cruise altitude and specify the nearest aircraft profile. In AS get the weather you wish to use. (I always get the weather for the zulu time of the departure in FS since time of day affects weather characteristics). Import the plan into AS via the new route button, check the altitude and choose an appropriate true airspeed in knots (this is your no wind ground speed). Process the route. When it is finished click the button to print a hard copy of all. Use this AS navlog for METAR data at both ends and winds aloft and temperature aloft that can be used for FMC data. (You'll also get your estimated average wind at your specified altitude - handy for FMC data.) Leave AS running. Now go back to FSB and your chosen aircraft profile. Enter the surface temperature from your departure METAR, then estimated total taxi time, hold time, and extra time (sometimes called discretionary fuel). Now turn on again your FS9 export along with any FMC export you might use. Rebuild and you'll see the messages regarding the export completion. On the route selection on the left which brings up your route window select the navlog tab and click the .pdf to save the navlog in a file or the print button to get a hard copy so you can easily reference the estimated fuel and other data. This estimated fuel has now taken into account your winds aloft data - no need to enter it in FSB. Now that you have the hard copy and exported your route, you can first optionally save the plan by selecting flightplan window, then clicking the category tab, then select user category. Now click file, save from the menu bar. The name you might want to embellish. Click Save Route To User Flight Plans. For another session, you can recall this working plan and just build.11. If you are using an aircraft with nav equipment that has its own terminal data procedures in its nav equipment (think FMC) you might wish to use step 6 above to take out the waypoints of the terminal procedures keeping just the transition points and build and export with just them. This easily in most cases lets you select the SID and STAR assigned by ATC on your nav equipment by providing a clean legs list in your nav equipment. If you need ATC to monitor the waypoints of the terminal procedure than just export all. To keep ATC and you nav equipment in sync, you might consider importing the full plan into your nav equipment and not using your nav equipment procedure database.This is kind of long but through experience I've described some tricks I've used watching out for any pitfalls.Be sure to check the FSBuild forum for updates.

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Hi Alexander:Thanks for the reply, so how is the wind determined in the sim, do I have to download real weather first get out of the sim and go to fsbuild for the fmc file, thank you.Regards, Rich

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Yowser now thats an explanation, have to go thru all that and thanks for the inside tips appreciate all the work :)Regards, Rich

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Real weather can be set to download at 15 minute intervals (i believe its even default to do so). Therefore you don't need to exit the sim to redownload it. You can check weather at any given airport using this website, I use it all the time and its really quite good. All you need to do is enter the ICAO code for your destination airport.

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What has been described above are quite good but what you also can do(that's what i do) instead of checking the metar check the TAF(Terminal Area Forecast) it shows you a detailed report of the expected weather for that particular airfield with Z times you can check that in your fmc what you arrival time is then make a selection wich runways is used to land or depart from

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Ah some more great info, all right time to go home and try some of this :) nice link :)Regrads, Rich

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Hi Alexander:Thanks for the reply, so how is the wind determined in the sim, do I have to download real weather first get out of the sim and go to fsbuild for the fmc file, thank you.Regards, Rich
Ron's post covered it mostly. Have a look at a third-party software called Active Sky. The "AS" in Ron's post is a reference to that program. It is much more flexible than the vanilla FSX weather engine and features a much more accurate weather depiction. Plus, it's possible to import Active Sky weather data into FSBuild. I don't think FSX offers forecast data, but I haven't used the build-in weather option for ages.The best way to estimate the correct runway is to have a look at the approach charts for your destination and the METAR/TAF data. As has been mentioned before, many STARs have a common arrival fix before they branch out to the indiviual runways. By the time you get to that fix, ATC should have assigned you a runway and you can select the correct procedure to fly.

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Ah I do have REX good idea must try that to, you guys are great for helping me by the way mdg 747 is an incredible piece of work, thnaks PMDG. :)Regards, Rich

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