Over the last several months of browsing these forums, I've read lots of references to mainstream gamers using terms such as "kiddies" and "xbox idiots". It's gotten worse in the last few days.I am a 46 year-old gamer. My first console was the Atari 2600. I own all of the current generation consoles. I also own a fairly beefy gaming PC, on which resides my ridiculously bloated install of FSX, FS9 and tons of other sims and games. I love playing combat sims, civilian flight sims, strategy games, action games--all sorts, really. I love the challenge of navigating via VOR's in bad weather in FSX, but I also have fun occasionally stabbing a guy in Assassin's Creed. I also play games with my wife and with my kids, none of whom are idiots.I don't understand the choices made by Microsoft with Flight. As a gamer, I don't think it will be engaging enough or fun enough. As a simmer, it won't offer the real-world challenges that make FSX so interesting. It is frustrating to see them taking this path. However, these decisions are not the fault of mainstream gamers.I realize that many folks in the FS community don't play games other than sims such as FSX. That's awesome. However, too many times we end up sounding like old men yelling "you kids get off my lawn" from our porch. If the community is to survive, it should be inclusive and open to potential crossover from mainstream gamers. Unfortunately, I don't think Flight will serve both audiences (and perhaps neither), but It'd be great if we could express our frustrations without insulting and alienating potential new simmers.

I would welcome any newcomer to our community. They would soon learn to leave 'Flight' and get FSX/XP10...

I do apologize if you feel insulted, that was not my and others' intention of course.You have anyway to know that these days are not regular ones. We have been waiting this game since two years and then all of a sudden MS pulled out the mask showing the real truth, so, even if it was largely predicted since years it always hurts.We are not frustrated, we are angry instead and you have to understand that beside M$ we have to blame someone and the most guilty one is the typical conzole kid grabbing money from parents pocket to play an arcade toy.This is not clearly your case and just for this reason you shouldn't feel offended.Wihtin 2-3 weeks Flight will be a forgot nightmare and the politness will come back.

Edited January 5, 201214 yr by Mark II

My criticism has nothing to do with gaming in general. I myself play other games with my PCs and I own hundreds of titles of games alone, nearly hundred of them in Steam. I own two PS3 consoles and an OpenPandora console. I play games with all of these from retro legacy stuff, to FPS games, to point and click to strategy and simulators (both space and real world). I must admit that most of my gaming nowadays goes to simulation, mainly FSX and RoF.But casual gaming can be fun. I spent couple of days during christmas holidays to play through Heavy Rain. Enjoyed every minute.

Hi Jimmy,I'm a whole whopping year younger than you :Party:And aside from FSX/X-Plane my HDD includes:Gary Grigsbys "War In the East"John Tiller's "Campaign Series"Forge Of FreedomIL-2Silent Hunter IIISteel BeastsMedieval II GoldCrysisEvochron MercenaryOblivionMount&Blade WarbandDeus Ex:Human RevolutionYou are not alone mate. 'Cause sometime a fella just wants to hammer the Russians, chop fantasy critters into little bits, chop other people into little bits, blast spaceships and shoot laz0rs, or drive a tank, or shoot torpedoes.....whatever floats your boat.You ain't alone! While my favorite activity is (beyond a doubt) flying the virtual skies variety is the spice of life even when it comes to home entertainment!**edit**No offense towards Russians.....lol...that War In The East game is continually kicking my butt!

Over the last several months of browsing these forums, I've read lots of references to mainstream gamers using terms such as "kiddies" and "xbox idiots". It's gotten worse in the last few days.I am a 46 year-old gamer. My first console was the Atari 2600. I own all of the current generation consoles. I also own a fairly beefy gaming PC, on which resides my ridiculously bloated install of FSX, FS9 and tons of other sims and games. I love playing combat sims, civilian flight sims, strategy games, action games--all sorts, really. I love the challenge of navigating via VOR's in bad weather in FSX, but I also have fun occasionally stabbing a guy in Assassin's Creed. I also play games with my wife and with my kids, none of whom are idiots.I don't understand the choices made by Microsoft with Flight. As a gamer, I don't think it will be engaging enough or fun enough. As a simmer, it won't offer the real-world challenges that make FSX so interesting. It is frustrating to see them taking this path. However, these decisions are not the fault of mainstream gamers.I realize that many folks in the FS community don't play games other than sims such as FSX. That's awesome. However, too many times we end up sounding like old men yelling "you kids get off my lawn" from our porch. If the community is to survive, it should be inclusive and open to potential crossover from mainstream gamers. Unfortunately, I don't think Flight will serve both audiences (and perhaps neither), but It'd be great if we could express our frustrations without insulting and alienating potential new simmers.

I completely agree with you. And trivializing game design the way we do here, hides the fact that it is extremely challenging to make great gameplay; to make a successful new commercial game. Most games, even angry birds, are built on long standing successful gameplay structures. There isn’t anything apparent in the material so far that Flight has the legs to actually be a good game. It is puzzling.

Jimmy, Thanks of sharing your thoughts. Big sales in previous MS Flight Simulator came from all the people who wanted to have a flight simulator (this is not my idea, I have read about this in this site and elsewhere), no matter to what 'group' someone, could 'assign' them, depending on level flying enjoyment, sophistication, depth, etc, things that are of personal taste.If MSFS wasn't intented to the 'Gamer' group, MSFS would not be what is (until) today.