History Splitting the Topic - Perspective & History

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

So, there is no doubt that we are a strong voice and I hope we all agree on that.Now lets go to the point. I made a question earlier using as an example a boy called little Johnnie, but there is no answer on this. I repeat. What kind of model is this marketing when it has as a target group that little Johnnie and people in general that have no interest about aviation. You all think they will buy extra addons?

You are missing the point entirely.. Yes there will be a lot of "Johnnies" and they may or may not buy "Hawaii" and some other add-ons..There will be another group, and that is new aviation enthusiasts, who just like we once did will get into a flightsimcockpit for the first time. These are the customers that wil pay to get the add-ons and will ask for more and more stuffto be added and then purchase it from... Microsoft. As long as Flight offers an upgrade path, they will spend money foradd-ons, just like us! If they run out of things to add, they may want to upgrade to FSX or P3D, but not without havingspent more money with Microsoft than you and I combined. :smile:We may be vocal, but we have not spent any money with Microsoft for years! All our money has gone toIntel, Nvidia, PMDG, Flight1, RealAir, Carenado etc.. just look at your own flightsim purchases. Edited January 18, 2012 by Bert Pieke

[simmerhead 885]

We may be vocal, but we have not spent any money with Microsoft for years! All our money has gone toIntel, Nvidia, PMDG, Flight1, RealAir, Carenado etc.. just look at your own flightsim purchases.

I don't get your point. I have bought FSX, FSX DeLuxe, FSX Acceleration and FSX Gold Edition. THERE IS NOTHING MORE I CAN BUY FROM MICROSOFT! The only reason I've had to buy from others is that Microsoft hasn't offered me anything to buy. I would gladly have bought stuff from MIcrosoft.

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

In that case the "Flight" marketing concept may well work.

[simmerhead 885]

In that case the "Flight" marketing concept may well work.

If you think of the DLC model, yes. The main reason being that it's easier and more user friendly to get everything in one place. But DLC doesn't solve the problem of Microsoft having to deliver quality content that gamers will desire.While the diversity of FSX is great, it is also a pain. If you are lazy like me you get tired of all the work that goes into collecting addons from all sorts of places. The lack of a common market and a standarized buying/installing process is one of the biggest reasons most of my FSX friends never bought any addons or downloaded freeware. Edited January 18, 2012 by simmerhead

[Guest jahman]

we have not spent any money with Microsoft for years!

That's entirely MS doing:

1. FS10 - 2006
2. FS11 - 2008 (Released Acceleration instead, but reduced sales by releasing FSX SP2 for free)
3. FS12 - 2010
4. FS13 - 2012

In red are the three FS editions MS could have developped but didn't, that the great majority of us would of course have bought.Cheers,- jahman.

Edited January 18, 2012 by jahman

[Attila 2]

That's entirely MS doing:

1. FS10 - 2006
2. FS11 - 2008 (Released Acceleration instead, but reduced sales by releasing FSX SP2 for free)
3. FS12 - 2010
4. FS13 - 2012

In red are the three FS editions MS could have developped but didn't, that the great majority of us would of course have bought.

Exactly...and with each of these versions they could have made gradual improvements to everything. We would have bought that 172 five times by now since FS9. I expect Flight to have a longer life than 2 years and I don't expect to buy the 172 ever again.

[simmerhead 885]

Exactly...and with each of these versions they could have made gradual improvements to everything. We would have bought that 172 five times by now since FS9. I expect Flight to have a longer life than 2 years and I don't expect to buy the 172 ever again.

Could get it for free if you collect enough aerochaces... ;)

[VOR_Active 4]

There will be another group, and that is new aviation enthusiasts, who just like we once did will get into a flightsimcockpit for the first time. These are the customers that wil pay to get the add-ons and will ask for more and more stuffto be added and then purchase it from... Microsoft. As long as Flight offers an upgrade path, they will spend money foradd-ons, just like us! If they run out of things to add, they may want to upgrade to FSX or P3D, but not without havingspent more money with Microsoft than you and I combined

So you are telling me that FLIGHT was created as a main gate, apart from Johnnies, for these aviation enthusiasts that later might upgrade, as you said, to FSX or P3D. Why? FSX already exists with all the whistles and bells and it can be used as a training tool too because of the lessons out from the box. So what special FLIGHT has to offer if it's game? the beauty of flying? there is that in FSX also. Unless! FLIGHT is offering: Better graphics (I strongly believe that), better weather model, better flying physics, dynamic AI world, enhanced ATC. If all these are included, then we are talking for a new simulator so there is no reason for these aviation enthusiasts to move to FSX. On the contrary, we have to move to that new platform.

You are missing the point entirely.. Yes there will be a lot of "Johnnies" and they may or may not buy "Hawaii" and some other add-ons

I think it's better to read my previous post more carefully

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

Look at this from Microsoft's point of view.... What would you rather have a new user buy?FSX for $39, minus retail markup = $19orFlight ($0) + Hawaii ($19) + Maule aircraft ($19) + + etc + maybe FSX one day ($19).(made up prices, since I do not know what Microsoft might charge)

Edited January 19, 2012 by Bert Pieke

[VOR_Active 4]

Bert,we don't disagree, simply I see it as a risk marketing model exactly because for Johnnies might be enough the free part of it. About the more serious aviation enthusiasts they might get on deeper into that, by buying more extras. But this is where the point comes. Why MS chose this model of marketing if FLIGHT is a game? Why the new enthusiasts should go through that path? FSX exists around 6 years with many, actually too many addons, unless FLIGHT has something that FSX has not.

[boshar 6]

here will be another group, and that is new aviation enthusiasts, who just like we once did will get into a flightsimcockpit for the first time. These are the customers that wil pay to get the add-ons and will ask for more and more stuffto be added and then purchase it from... Microsoft. As long as Flight offers an upgrade path, they will spend money foradd-ons, just like us! If they run out of things to add, they may want to upgrade to FSX or P3D, but not without havingspent more money with Microsoft than you and I combined. :(

Problem is there are already lots of flight games in the market and they fail to be big money makers. The consoles have the Ace Combat series and that franchise struggles to make money its audience is shrinking. Nintendo's Pilot Wings (now there is a title that has a lot of idea's borrowed by Microsoft!) only has a modest market share.Probably the best current example of a flight game finding new customers is the X-Plane apps for iOS and Android. Relatively cheap, Small gamy flightsims that act as advertising for a larger Desktop flightsim. I think that the free/cheap online game model like Flight wants to be is quickly superseded by this game on mobile / tablet model.

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

Lets wait and see what they actually deliver... hopefully it is both a game and a sim... :(

Edited January 19, 2012 by Bert Pieke

[towerman 0]

The analysis we make here goes well but I think we start making a loop with some questions staying unanswered. First it must be clarified that we are NOT the minority and that is because of the success of the MSFS franchise. We made it successfull. But the story goes on. We expand the hobby by buying additional software (addons) with our hard earned money, we don't have the problem to pay some more euros or bucks to fly over our beloved scenery or airplane, and when the time comes when MS is about to release a new version, then the forums look like a stock market. That is known and MS knows too so nothing new here. So, there is no doubt that we are a strong voice and I hope we all agree on that.Now lets go to the point. I made a question earlier using as an example a boy called little Johnnie, but there is no answer on this. I repeat. What kind of model is this marketing when it has as a target group that little Johnnie and people in general that have no interest about aviation. You all think they will buy extra addons? I doubt. Perhaps one region or two and then what? Nothing. He/she will be satisfied flying around with the freeware. Where is now the profit that MS want to make with this model of marketing? On the other hand, you might ask "ok, are we the clever and the experts and the others are the stupid?" certainly not! I, personaly believe that FLIGHT is not an arcade game. For sure it has simulation elements but up to what extend i don't know. We are at the Beta testing period and we no nothing. Only some videos and photos. What happened at CES? Some short of reviews with no more than 10 lines of text but nothing official. That doesn't make you wonder why? I don't know either. To summit up, there are two questions remaining unanswered. Why MS selected (IF) that risky marketing model, and why the secrecy during Beta testing period. Perhaps we are in for some or big surprises.

there won't be any regions, I bet flight will focus on small prop planes bounded to small highly detailed scenery, no jets, no atc, no real ifr operations, no virtual tower, no nothing, it my opinion this is going to be a real royal failure.did you see the web showcase, nothing different was shown and with a spring release forthcoming there won't be any major changes in content ....

[GHD 21]

there won't be any regions

So, that's it then?Since when have you been privy to Microsoft deliberations?

[towerman 0]

It's my idea that being a game there's no need for large area , I don't see the point of doing very long navigation flights, the focus is more on quick action, I also think that being the scenery so much more detailed and distributed through download there won't be entire nations or continents...