Hello All -Looking for some clarification.On take off roll, if you reject the take off, should the spoilers auto deploy?I ask as auto brakes come on (well they are set to RTO), but the spoilers never deploy when I reject the take off. My method for rejecting the take off is to: pull back on throttles whilst turning off the auto throttle, then depending on speed I deploy the reverers.Thank you, Iain

Spoilers deploy automatically when you use reverse thrust (or touchdown if armed), so no, when you select RTO, they won't deploy.

Spoilers deploy automatically when you use reverse thrust (or touchdown if armed), so no, when you select RTO, they won't deploy.

Thanks Santiago... I didn't know that! Cheers, Iain

Thanks Santiago... I didn't know that! Cheers, Iain

You didn't know because that's not true.RTO at speeds more than 60KTS (wheel speed) will deploy all spoilers to remove the produced lift giving full wheel braking functionality.So, try to do an RTO with a ground speed greater than 60kts.

You didn't know because that's not true.RTO at speeds more than 60KTS (wheel speed) will deploy all spoilers to remove the produced lift giving full wheel braking functionality.So, try to do an RTO with a ground speed greater than 60kts.

Im not aware if this happens in real life or not, but it doesn't in PMDG 737NGX. Also its above 90 knots, not 60.

Edited March 5, 201214 yr by Santi871

Im not aware if this happens in real life or not, but it doesn't in PMDG 737NGX. Also its above 85 knots, not 60.

LOL i read somewhere that it's 80 knots, BTW RTO takeoff is really rear, and pilot's wants to avoid it, because there's a very strong pressure on the brakes and sometime you'll need to change the tires, (at real world).

From the FCOM:

RTO – automatically applies maximum brake pressure when thrust levers are retarded to idle at or above 90 knots.

And about the speedbrakes:

If the SPEED BRAKE lever is in the DOWN position during landing or rejected takeoff, the auto speed brake system operates when these conditions occur:•main landing gear wheels spin up (more than 60 kts)•both thrust levers are retarded to IDLE•reverse thrust levers are positioned for reverse thrust.

You can use speed brake RTO also if you use manual braking (RTO selector is not needed to be in RTO position to extend spoilers)The logic is airplane on ground, wheel speed greater than 60kts, thrust levers on reverse thrustPS: please consider that speed brakes are different from brakes.One is for lift, the other is for braking.One will not always affect or works in conjunction with the other.

Just tested post sp1c, but pretty sure it was already correctly working:On the NGX it is all working good:The autospeed brake becomes working above 60ktsThe autobrake RTO function above 88ktsSo, from 0 to 60 you have only REVs,between 60 and "90"kts you have only spoilers and reverse operation,Above the 90s you have all.Manual braking is still avaiable from 0kts...The speed brake lever can be always be moved manually.

Edited March 5, 201214 yr by davierosoft

Just tested post sp1c, but pretty sure it was already correctly working:On the NGX it is all working good:The autospeed brake becomes working above 60ktsThe autobrake RTO function above 88ktsSo, from 0 to 60 you have only REVs,between 60 and "90"kts you have only spoilers and reverse operation,Above the 90s you have all.Manual braking is still avaiable from 0kts...The speed brake lever can be always be moved manually.

Thats what i said, reverse over 60kts will deploy speedbrakes, regardless of autobrake selector position.If you dont use reverse thrust while on a rejected takeoff, speedbrakes won't deploy.

Thats what i said, reverse over 60kts will deploy speedbrakes, regardless of autobrake selector position.If you dont use reverse thrust while on a rejected takeoff, speedbrakes won't deploy.

Probably I misunderstood your post ;)

Hey Andrea I got a question for ya. As described above speed brakes will correctly deploy above 60 knots. However you say the lever can always be moved manually. On the NGX this is not the case here. Try to accelerate above 60 knots, then pull back into reverse. Speed brakes will deploy but cannot be stowed manually. You'll have to stow the revs first, then the speed brake lever can be moved. Is this correct behavior?

One of the first posts I made here was regarding a wrong logic on speed brake lever actuator and its overriding.The real one has an electric linear actuator wich moves a shoe cluch, this cluch will TRY to move the lever starting from the actual lever position.The cluch is calibrated so if you move or stop the lever manually, the lever actuator will still deploy/retract, but the lever itself will remain in the position where the pilot is holding it. After the actuator reached either deployed or stowed position (not the spoiler lever) it will stop working until the next movement.In the NGX this is not true.To let the actuator works some conditions must be met.Landing:The actuator must be down (and will be in that position when you advance thrust, the first opportunity is on the previous take off or taxi, so at landing this condition is always trueIt will extend either if lever is armed or with reversersThe extension time is of about one second, if the lever will be manually moved/held in a position, the actuator will still work in the touchdown for that 1 second, it will work again only one time to restow the actuator (and eventually the lever) when thrust are advanced again.In the meantime, the pilots have full manual control of the lever, the actuator will never override their command.In the NGX each time you put the lever up, advancing the throttles will result in a spoiler restow, this for how many times you want.This is not possible as the actuator will not follows the lever, the actuator will move only in the above conditions.I don't know how much it is an NGX issue or a FSX limit, I'm not aware of other planes with the possibility to hold the lever while the actuator is working, neither of a FSX aircraft that is able to do that.I will post this to the support team, I think that I talked about it only in the forum and in a pm to the team.However is not a great issue as normally you would not override them, neither using them at the parking.

One of the first posts I made here was regarding a wrong logic on speed brake lever actuator and its overriding.

Yes, and I remember that one very well, which was why I directed my question directly to you. :( Yet I think my concern was about something a little different. I am aware of the issue you describe regarding the actuator.However what I observe is a different phenomenon (I believe): The speed brake lever is "locked" for manual operation under said conditions: Reject a takeoff above 60 knots and apply reverse thrust. As long as the reverse levers are up, the speed brake lever cannot be moved to the DOWN detent manually. I was wondering if the actuator inside could actually "lock" the lever for manual operation under these circumstances or if this behavior is not correct in the first place. If you say the lever could be moved manually at all times (regardless of what the actuator does) then this behavior would seem to be erroneous to me.

I understood you, and answered about what I think of it when I talked about a possible FSX limit as I'm not aware of other add ons able to do better.However, as I forgot this issue, I will refresh it to the team, if it is something that could be fixed, I'm sure pmdg will fix it.The fix could be simple.It seems that what is missing is a logic that let the (let me say) "virtual actuator" to move only one time at cycle (t/o and landing) so that could be possible only one retraction after the extension. In this way, if the actuator is already up, it disengages until it goes back to down, this giving full manual control in that event.Could be made? I don't know, I'll speak with Ryan sending a ticket in these days.