MSFlight-VOR ILS - Introductory for beginners

[dims 0]

Nice video, thanks for making the effort creating it. I also did like the music but music is a matter of taste and impossible to please a whole audience.

Voiceover, instead of text, together with the ingame sound would have been ace.

[n4gix 4,954]

2. What about airports without ILS? What the pilot can use to find runway direction?

 

The pilot would need to use the venerable Mark II Eyeball system... :Peace:

[desberardo 0]

So to my understanding, say I'm in the middle of the Pacifc (no island visible yet) and want to find a VOR assuming I have the frequency already, I'd just tune my nav1 to that freq and then turn my OBS until centered and go from there or am I missing a step?

 

Secondly, I'm also confused when people say the reciprocal of the 090 radial. Does that mean if I'm flying with a heading of 090 I'm on the right track heading to the VOR or am I flying away? I know that the the opposite direction of 090 is 270 so do I need to turn my plane around to 270? Im a beginner to all that is flying and would love to learn all that I can.

[Guest]

So to my understanding, say I'm in the middle of the Pacifc (no island visible yet) and want to find a VOR assuming I have the frequency already, I'd just tune my nav1 to that freq and then turn my OBS until centered and go from there or am I missing a step?

 

Secondly, I'm also confused when people say the reciprocal of the 090 radial. Does that mean if I'm flying with a heading of 090 I'm on the right track heading to the VOR or am I flying away? I know that the the opposite direction of 090 is 270 so do I need to turn my plane around to 270? Im a beginner to all that is flying and would love to learn all that I can.

 

This topic is about ILS: you might read this topic about using VOR

 

http://forum.avsim.n...-big-vor-topic/

 

and post your questions there.

 

You know what, I'll quote your post in that topic and answer it there!

[staib 1]

You know what, I'll quote your post in that topic and answer it there!

 

This sort of constructive help is exactly why Jeroen is now a member of the Avsim mod team :)

 

Quick question on the video... I have always thought it better to descend sufficiently in advance that you can then intercept the ILS glideslope from 'underneath' it - rather than needing to descend steeply down into it from above...

 

Can any one comment on what is considered best practice? Or are both methods used?

 

Cheers,

Nick

[LuisFelizTirado 33]

If you check the chart, you'll see a profile for all approaches with the optimal altitude. You don't want to descend haphazardly and crash into the... hazards! But, you definitely don't want to be diving to intercept the GS either.

 

Generally, though, before you start practicing the ILS landings, it is always a good idea to master a purely visual approach and landing using Bill's Mark II Eyeball System (I use the Mark II Enhanced - it comes with prescription glasses! :LMAO: )

 

Best regards.

Luis

[LHookins 3,109]

Much better, and easier, to intercept the glide slope from below. At least you'll be going slower if you do it that way.

 

Hook

[Propane 16]

On the other hand, why were you fiddling with the trim anyway? Proper procedure is to use only the elevator (via the joystick or yoke) and power during approach.

A bit offtopic, but out of curiosity, do you mean this in general or mainly for the RV in Flight? Because I really wouldn't like to use your method on the plane I'm currently flying. While going from flaps 20 to 35 (full flaps for that plane) you literally need to turn the trim wheel about half it's circumference to stay on the glideslope (where normal adjustments during flight are fractions of that amount of trim). Reducing power won't really help, because the flaps create so much drag that you usually need to add power to keep the proper approach speed.

[n4gix 4,954]

A bit offtopic, but out of curiosity, do you mean this in general or mainly for the RV in Flight?

 

I mean in general. In every case trim is used for one -and only one- purpose: to relieve the pressure on the stick/yoke. In practical terms, think of using trim to relieve pressure for your current speed and wind conditions.

 

In good weather with zero/zero winds, you can trim out the controls such that you can fly "hands off" for extended periods of time, with only needing to make occasional and very minor trim adjustments to maintain a stable flightpath.

 

During a proper approach, after dropping flaps and/or gear, you would quickly re-trim the elevator to relieve stick/yoke pressure. Once done, you are in a "stabilized approach" and can then use the throttle to control your vertical speed (glidepath), and the stick/yoke to control your airspeed (by raising or lowering the nose).

[Great Ozzie 101]

While going from flaps 20 to 35 (full flaps for that plane)

 

Interesting... what plane btw?

 

Normally for light single engine GA aircraft like a Cessna or Piper... typically set up 10° Flaps & 90kts well before the FAF (sometime after IAF)... gear down (if retract) at one dot above.

 

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My experience generally for ILS was to intercept from below... but never discount ATC to keep you up a bit higher than longer. SOP for U.S. ATC (my understanding) is to keep you between the G/S and the minimum intercept altitude.

 

Other parts of the world... here again my understanding (having flown some with BAV) in the UK e.g. it is not out of the ordinary to intercept the G/S from above.

[mgh 89]

Interesting... what plane btw?

 

Normally for light single engine GA aircraft like a Cessna or Piper... typically set up 10° Flaps & 90kts well before the FAF (sometime after IAF)... gear down (if retract) at one dot above.

 

-------------------

 

My experience generally for ILS was to intercept from below... but never discount ATC to keep you up a bit higher than longer. SOP for U.S. ATC (my understanding) is to keep you between the G/S and the minimum intercept altitude.

 

Other parts of the world... here again my understanding (having flown some with BAV) in the UK e.g. it is not out of the ordinary to intercept the G/S from above.

 

I'm not aware of any published procedures that require the glide slope to be intercepted from above?

[Great Ozzie 101]

I'm not aware of any published procedures that require the glide slope to be intercepted from above?

 

Neither am I.

[Propane 16]

Interesting... what plane btw?

 

Normally for light single engine GA aircraft like a Cessna or Piper... typically set up 10° Flaps & 90kts well before the FAF (sometime after IAF)... gear down (if retract) at one dot above.

 

The plane is a BAe Jetstream 32. And although not trimming during the approach works if you have the time and space to get completetly set up before descending on the approach, this is not always possible. If you don't mind me going slightly offtopic a bit longer...

 

The JS32 can roughly match speeds with the jets inside a TMA. Come blasting in from the descent near Vmo of 250 kts, reduce to about 220-230, base will be around 180 and approach 160. This is quite nice for everyone, since we almost never get speed controlled by ATC and we're also not causing larger aircraft to get speed controlled just because we're in front of them. But the max speed for flaps 35 (full) is 150 kts, so at some point during the approach we will have to slow down to get into full landing configuration. This is usually around 4 miles out. Reduce speed by basically pulling the power levers fully back, set flaps 35, add power to maintain the glideslope, pitch for speed and then trim. So you might have been on the approach for 4-6 miles already before you're actually stabilized. If you don't trim for that last config change, you're going to have a tiring 4 miles until you land.

 

Besides those situations, you might be making approaches harder on yourself by not trimming. Since a trim is only valid for the conditions at the time of trimming, changing conditions during an approach might require input reversed from your current trim, thus requiring more force. Of course you should not be flying the plane by trim or keep while you're at 50ft over the threshold, but for instance use a limit of 500ft AGL or something. I hope I'm not coming across as a random know-it-all, it's just that I don't see much pro's for not trimming during the approach. I'm just checking to see if I'm missing some point here.