As John King would say in his "King" instruction videos....

 

"If you don't have enough rudder to align the nose with the runway, then go somewhere else."

 

And, that's the bottom line. If the nose isn't straight with the runway on touchdown, you'll get side loads on the landing gear. If the nose isn't aligned with the runway on a taildragger, it can be worse, as the back end will want to swing around to the front position. Nose wheel airplanes inherently try to re-align themselves with the runway. That's the crosswind/nose wheel advantage. Nose wheels just don't usually do as well in rough runway conditions, as they're also good at tucking under, and causing a prop strike.

 

Or a broken firewall.

Wrong, wrong, wrong... but if you wish to assume this... of course it is up to you.

 

I'll quote you from another thread: "Not even close."

 

If that placard says 12 knots demonstrated, and you attempt to take off with a 16 knot crosswind component and end up bending the plane, can you be cited for Careless and Reckless with that as cause? If you CAN be cited, then the number is a maximum. If you CANNOT be cited for that cause, then the number is not a maximum.

 

Hook

I'll quote you from another thread: "Not even close."

 

If that placard says 12 knots demonstrated, and you attempt to take off with a 16 knot crosswind component and end up bending the plane, can you be cited for Careless and Reckless with that as cause? If you CAN be cited, then the number is a maximum. If you CANNOT be cited for that cause, then the number is not a maximum.

 

Hook

 

My instructor told me many years ago, if you bend the aircraft for any reason, the NTSB report will say " Pilot Failed to maintain directional control of aircraft" i.e. Pilot screwed up.

Btw, remember to get those controls coordinated and establish a crab after takeoff. You do not want to try climbing with crossed controls because you are giving up lots of performance.

But anything placarded in the cockpit is a good starting point for identifying limits.

 

And as a low-time pilot who knows not to push his own limits too far, that's all I have to say about that.

 

That's a good thing Forrest, quite possibly a wise thing to use... but the pilot's limitation maybe be well below this figure. I was just trying to point out that here's a placard which is "not like the rest"...

 

"If you don't have enough rudder to align the nose with the runway, then go somewhere else."

 

And this is an excellent indicator when you are at the plane's limit... hitting the rudder stops. Probably not too smart to attempt beyond this. It is weird when it happens tho...

 

"Not even close."

 

:LMAO: I use that line as it came from Star Wars Robot Chicken (what was more important... the kid being born and having a new grandson or the Grandad meeting George Lucas... something like that anyway).

 

If that placard says 12 knots demonstrated, and you attempt to take off with a 16 knot crosswind component and end up bending the plane, can you be cited for Careless and Reckless with that as cause?

 

The FAA can hammer you with Careless & Reckless anytime there's a FAR violation or accident...

 

Something like this will probably depend on the circumstances. Say a student with a 7kt x-wind limitation in his logbook pulls that stunt (and it is a stunt as he has a logged limitation). Or maybe a private pilot who rarely flies and when he does it is solely during periods of calms winds (less than 5kts). I could see that happening.

 

For a pilot that routinely flies... logs things like, "winds 15G25 - direct x-wind". They're a professional pilot... maybe working for some Part 135 outfit... Or a CFI similar to the above... No... I do not think the FAA would cite for that. It is not a "legal limitation".

 

If you CANNOT be cited for that cause, then the number is not a maximum.

 

Well... it is not going to matter whether you can be cited for it or not... it is going to be based on what is the definition.

 

Here's something (as an example) I pulled from the Grand Caravan POH. http://textron.vo.ll...caravan_pim.pdf

 

"Demonstrated Crosswind Velocity is the velocity of the crosswind component for which adequate control of the airplane during takeoff and landing was actually demonstrated during certification tests. The value shown is not (emphasis mine) considered to be limiting."

 

Again... I derive my limitations from the FARs, the AFM/POH, whatever the Plane Rental place dictates, Insurance requirements, Common Sense, Experience... mnemonics like the IMSAFE (Illness, Medication, Stress... etc) What the weather is doing... a whole host of factors... because I have no desire to bend or break anything... and I certainly do not want on my conscience something like, "well Rob did a steep turn at 200' AGL... so I can too"... and then they go ball it up somewhere.

 

It was just to point out a "technicallity" - you are not violating the aircraft's limitations in this case.

 

C'mon guys... don't be so hard on me... :cray: This was merely one of those "fun facts"... or something you might impress a CFI / DPE having knowledge of this ("wow... dude / dude-ette knew that this was not a limitation, strictly speaking... ").

 

OK, I just did that on paper with stick drawings and it's making sense now. Now to go home and feel it working in the game!

 

I forgot to mention Matt... remember it is the horizontal component of lift that turns a plane... you bank the plane you need to increase back pressure and possibly add power to maintain level flight (part of the vertical now in the horizontal). For a slip, you have arrested the turn with rudder... it's that horizontal component of lift causing you track, left or right, of center.

 

Btw, remember to get those controls coordinated and establish a crab after takeoff.

 

Oh yeah for sure, for sure.... in fact the wind will typically set you up for a nice crab if you let it wx-vane you into it after liftoff.

 

Now here is a test pilot......

 

Let me ignore the discussions above, and let me comment on the video Bob posted:

WOW

 

Thats true skill! It seems he doenst totally align the plane on touchdown, but corrects his heading before the frontwheel touches the ground. It's an amazing sight.

There are more video's on youtube with crosswind landings. Some are real scary but amazing to watch. These big planes almost hovering in severe crosswinds.

Let me ignore the discussions above, and let me comment on the video Bob posted:

WOW

 

Thats true skill! It seems he doenst totally align the plane on touchdown, but corrects his heading before the frontwheel touches the ground. It's an amazing sight.

There are more video's on youtube with crosswind landings. Some are real scary but amazing to watch. These big planes almost hovering in severe crosswinds.

 

That is the typical way a large jet lands, The main gear touches down while they are still in a crab , and as soon as the main gear touches, the rudder is pushed to swing the nose wheel to align with the runway. The gear has to withstand alot of side loading.