Flight's demise makes me wonder about combat sims

[tripecac 1]

The other day I was flying to the cruise ship aerocache in Juneau, and when I saw those big ships, I was thinking, "it would be neat if I could bomb them!"

 

I'm not normally into [virtually] shooting things, but perhaps the frustrating demise of Flight inspired the urge to try some combat sims.

 

The last combat air sim I really played was the sopwith mode in Flight Simulator back in the 1980s. So, I'm a bit out of the loop.

 

My question is this:

 

What air combat sim would you recommend for someone who enjoys the missions and casual sightseeing aspects of Flight and FSX?

 

I'd rather have interesting scenery and objectives than uber-realistic flight modeling, weapon modeling (since I have no piloting or military background). If there's a 10-minute flight to a combat zone, I will definitely want a fast forward button. Also, I'm not interested in a super-challenging AI, since I'm more interested in the exploration/novelty than striving for perfection. I don't intend to play anyone online. In other words, I'm not that interested in a steep learning curve and eternally delayed gratification. I'm more interested in fun than challenge.

 

So: I prefer aerocaches (something new) to hamburger runs (grinding), and hate the redbull racing missions in FSX, because they are too hard and repetitive.

 

I've tried Rise of Flight (which is free), and find it too hard. The biplane in Flight is a lot easier to control. The planes in Rise of Flight seem horribly unstable and "fiddly". They spin often, and recovering is hard. After about 10 dogfights, I don't think I ever hit any enemy planes, and each time ended up spinning into the ground. This is not my idea of fun. Sure, I know if I invest enough hours in learning the subtleties of WWI flight models, I might start enjoying it more... but at this point in my life I don't want to have to pour hours and hours into learning computer games. I'd rather have some instant gratification, or at least a game that oozes potential, like Flight did when it was released. Rise of Flight seems pretty one-dimensional to me: you shoot at other planes with machine guns, and they shoot at you, and the terrain always seems to be the same. Perhaps that is interesting to true aviators and WWI buffs, but I'd be more interested in seeing a variety of missions and aircraft types... like the ones in FSX.

 

I've watched videos for IL-2 and it looks more varied, but it also looks pretty complex. It's hard to get a sense for how fun it is to fly the different planes and missions, and how dependent we are on keyboard shortcuts. I'd rather just use the joystick 90% of the time, like I do with Flight and FSX.

 

Some other preferences:

 

1) I prefer WW2-era combat to the more complex, technology-dependent modern ones

2) I'd love TrackIR support, since that has made Flight and FSX even more enjoyable

3) Steam would be great

 

 

So, do any sims pop into mind?

 

And, I'm curious: is anyone else in the same boat as me, frustrated by the drying up of scenery-based civilian flight sim options, looking for something new?

[jcomm 5,939]

I'd try DCS p-51 definitely and wait for "World of planes".... a successor of Wings of Prey I believe....

[xplanery 250]

IL-2 Cliffs of Dover. In Singleplayer it has fast forward ability, big and good looking area to fly in (and even one non combat plane, tiger moth), trackir support and can be bought and used through Steam. Also planes are from WW2 era of course.

 

You can configure buttons to your joystick, and its not really complicated other than maybe then if you turn all realism settings full on, you have very good control over what things you want to be simulated and what not. So really you don't have to manage any other systems than just push a button or two on your keyboard or joystick to start/stop engines, and handle flaps & landing gear, though you can also simulate more complicated engine management if you want to do so.

 

It is kind of heavy though, wouldn't recommend it if you have lower end computer. IL-2 1946 is nice too if you don't care too much about graphics, that too can be bought from steam, I think it also has at least partial trackir support.

[HiFlyer 9,363]

I'd try DCS p-51 definitely and wait for "World of planes".... a successor of Wings of Prey I believe....

 

Not to be confused with World of Warplanes (confusing, huh?)

 

 

Or Combat Wings!

 

http://youtu.be/wEZkaDMbnAI

 

There is a lot of choice.

[TheFamilyMan 280]

"Wings of Prey" is a great starting point for a WW2 combat flight sim (CFS) with decent graphics, visceral action, and easily scaleable difficutly. The CFS purist go for IL-2 1946 (modded), Rise of Flight and the DCS series, each which have a learning "cliff" (i.e. they are sims), but climbing it is worth it. I recommend staying away from IL-2 Cliffs of Dover simply because it's still half baked as a CFS (though for solo tours of England and France in WW2 aircraft it'll work nicely).

 

BTW, WWI and WW2 aircraft gunnery is difficult, as is ground attack. RoF and IL-2 model that difficulty accurately as possible, so you get a "realistic" experience (after all, they are sims). When I first got IL-2 years ago it took me days before I could shoot down a friendly transport aircraft which was flying straight and level. Read this to get an idea of what its all about: http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/9121094645

[tripecac 1]

Thanks for the info!

 

For solo play of IL-2 1946 do you recomment Ultrapack 3 or the latest patches (1.11.1 I think)? My understanding is that Ultrapack 3 is based on an earlier version and is compatible with the latest patches. I'd be getting it from Steam, if that makes a difference.

 

Wings of Prey is currently part of an Indie Bundle on Steam for $9.99 (with HOARD, Swords and Soldiers HD, Demotlition Inc, and SOL: Exodus... most of which look pretty dumb). Does this mean that Wings of Prey has that unpolished indy feel, or was it just unfortunately to get bundled with those other games?

 

The DCS series seems to get great reviews, but those are all single aircraft, right? And most are modern? For some reason, I'm just not that interested in jets and missiles; they seem somehow impersonal. I've watched some videos of Warthog and it looks like the player had fun, but I think I prefer the WW2 environment. I also like the idea of trying out different planes (e.g., fighters, bombers, whatever). I can see how getting used to a single plane would help us perfect our skills, but I'm more interested in seeing new stuff than honing [virtual] skills. (Although I will say, it is very satisfying to be able shoot things from horseback in Mount and Blade, and that took a long time to learn).

[TheFamilyMan 280]

That's a bit weird about Wings of Prey on steam...I hope it's this title:

I hope some indie developer didn't "borrow" the name; I'm pretty sure steam sells Wings of Prey.

 

As for IL-2 1946, patch update it to 4.11.1 and get the HSFX 6.0 mod pack instead of UP...UP seems be falling behind in their mod support. Beware the IL-2 1946 graphics are somewhat dated, though the game play more than makes up for it.

[mgh 89]

I've tried Rise of Flight (which is free), and find it too hard. The biplane in Flight is a lot easier to control. The planes in Rise of Flight seem horribly unstable and "fiddly". They spin often, and recovering is hard. After about 10 dogfights, I don't think I ever hit any enemy planes, and each time ended up spinning into the ground.

 

That's how World War I aircraft actually flew.

[tripecac 1]

Here's the Wings of Prey on Steam: http://store.steampowered.com/app/45300/ -- it doesn't have a video but the screengrabs look decent. The other bundled apps don't, however!

 

Thanks for the recommendation to patch IL-2 to 4.11.1 instead of going the Ultrapack route. That will save some time (research, download, install)!

 

Is IL-2 easier to learn (flying-wise) than Rise of Flight? I'm really having trouble with the latter; I've crashed on the 2nd and 3rd tutorial missions, which is pretty sad, given the decades I've spent (off an on) with the MS FS series!

[Oracle427 45]

I find il2 offline play to be very poor. The friendly AI is terrible and will shot though you and shoot you down to get an enemy.

 

The AI also cruises along at speeds that frequently require full power and keeping your engine very hot. The only way to keep up is to use autopilot. If you're the leader, this isn't a problem.

 

The competition in multiplayer is very good, especially on the rare closed cockpit servers.the game works very well in multiplayer.

 

I don't like the ROF dlc model so I don't use it, but as a former red baron 3d multiplayer, I find that the game play is great.

 

Both IL2 and ROF share some "complex"flight models. I think you will find the very powerful aircraft in IL2 easier overall, but you will find the gunnery solutions and maneuvering more complex at the higher speeds.

[tripecac 1]

Would Wings of Prey be a gentler intro to WW2 simming? Does it have a steep learning curve? Would learning Wings of Prey help prepare me for IL-2? Or would it just result in 2 steep learning curves?

[FrankFasi 0]

Don't forget to check out Aces High. It's 14.99 per month but worth it. I've had an account there since open beta in late 1999. I still enjoy it a lot. I think you can play free for two weeks to see if you like it.

 

www.hitechcreations.com

[HiFlyer 9,363]

Would Wings of Prey be a gentler intro to WW2 simming? Does it have a steep learning curve? Would learning Wings of Prey help prepare me for IL-2? Or would it just result in 2 steep learning curves?

 

Wings of Prey is much more of a shooter and the learning curve is largely nonexistent for an experienced flyer. the graphics and game-play (multiplayer) are next generation, even now, of the type that the rest of the world has long since gotten used to, but which we still mostly cannot match.

 

This is my favorite wings of prey video, and shows nice use of Track IR

 

http://youtu.be/lxJGcsZYZsU

[Dillon 2,197]

The other day I was flying to the cruise ship aerocache in Juneau, and when I saw those big ships, I was thinking, "it would be neat if I could bomb them!"

 

It would be cool to bomb a cruise ship???

[tripecac 1]

Is Wings of Prey multiplayer/online only or is there a decent solo campaigns? It's hard to tell when reading the Steam description.

 

Is the Wings of Luftwaffe DLC worth getting (for solo play)? Right now Wings of Prey is $10 (as part of that indie bundle) and Wings of Luftwaffe is $15, for a total of $25. It would be nice if both went on sale as a bundle, but I don't know how often that happens.

 

The base game has 50 missions and 40 planes, but Wings of Luftwaffe only adds 10 missions and 2 planes. So, why is it so expensive (as a DLC)? I'm guessing the emphasis is multiplayer support, but right now that doesn't interest me.

 

So is Wings of Luftwaffe overpriced? Should I skip it until I actually finish Wings of Prey (assuming I get it)? Or does it make sense to wait for a bundle and get them both?