What is IFR? (read to know what I mean)

[KevinAu 441]

@ Kevin & Ozzie ... Yes (see my edit).. I understand that point... and it's an excellent point.. why I like these discussions ..

 

As for departing an un-towered airport, where the first 700' are 'G', in IMC ? .. sure I've used timed, phone clearances.. and yes, technically that's IFR flight (albeit brief) through 'G' airspace, but it always involved a filed flight-plan. .. and would require ATC clearance (for the approach), for me to land there, in IMC.

 

The filed flightplan is only required because you intended to fly into controlled airspace. Notice some of the different subleties of the clearances they give you over the phone when you depart an airport sitting inside uncontrolled airspace. They'll tell you to "Enter controlled airspace on a so-n-so heading." They don't tell you to fly runway heading or turn to so and so heading. You can do whatever you want while in the uncontrolled airspace as long as when you fly into the controlled airspace, you are flying a certain heading. They have and want no control over what you do while in G airspace. Hence the terms controlled and uncontrolled. When you legally takeoff from that G airport in 0-0 weather, you are IFR whether you've filed or not. Why? Simply because it certainly isn't VFR when it's 0-0.

[Brett_Henderson 5]

Great discussion fodder.. the technicalities and nuances are where the learning gets substantive....

 

From my point of reference.. the idea of flying in IMC, un-filed, is non-starter. It wouldn't even enter my mind. You just can't get to/from any place I've ever needed to get to/from, while remaining in 'G' airspace.. and even if you could, I'd still file IFR, and LOOK for a route with ATC control. I'd even file IFR in VMC, if it meant quicker/easier transitions through, large airspaces.. ala flying through Detroit, or Chicago "B" airspace, instead having to fly all the way over, or around it. Many a time, availing VFR flight-following, I'd end up getting pushed around, or over those airspaces.

 

ANYway, I think the OP got his answer... and learned a bit, too .. :smile: .. navigating by instrument in VMC, is not IFR flight. What's especially neat, is that he has learned instrument navigation, and was enthusiastic enough after using it, to ask about it... keep it up, and keep the questions coming.. soon you'll be able to take that flight IN IMC, an get yourself down to the destination via a published approach. If there is anything close to, "As Real as it Gets", in FSX, it is instrument navigation, and IFR procedures.. :smile:

[scottb613 1,188]

Well said Brett...

 

Yeah - I did know that the guys out west could fly IFR in uncontrolled airspace without ATC but in practice "big sky - little plane" theory wouldn't work for me... For me it's more the exception than the rule... Heck - I really enjoy talking to ATC even under VFR on cross country trips... Good discussion though...

 

Regards,

Scott

[jalexb88 7]

You guys should come to Canada we have LOTS of that class G (or ''the green'' as I like to call it), and further north extends up to 18000.

 

Alex Bart

[scottb613 1,188]

Hi Alex,

 

I would but our government treats US pilots pretty poorly... GA is the only form of transportation that requires a US Citizen to get permission to leave the county... We've heard horror stories of Customs Agents acting like the Gestapo - threatening huge fines for being a few minutes off your planned schedule - or - making a simple clerical error on the EAPIS forms... All in all - I've heard enough bad stories to certainly discourage flights outside of the county... Once again - our tax dollars at work...

 

On the other hand - I've heard nothing but good things about Canadian Customs...

 

Regards,

Scott

[KevinAu 441]

Here is a listing of oceanic airspace and one can see that Class G airspace can extend well up into cruising altitudes. Description of services provided state that IFR flights are permitted in Class G.

 

http://regulations.vlex.com/vid/operating-flight-airspace-designation-22847363