It's not out context. I like what Andy writes. I said that his info regarding the RV9 is second hand. I wish I could reply there. It's a bit tough, when solutions are not based on actual reality, as with the directional stability of the RV9, and what X-Plane projects as a model.

Post removed.  its moot.

The breakdown is one of pilot perception at the hand/joystick interface.  It's a cheap spring-loaded joystick with a null zone.  It will NEVER feel right for small inputs and 95% of flying is exactly that....so even discussing handling in a regime a joystick cannot go is invalid.   The problem is that this is all a bunch of armchair talk thus far.  I trust tests, measurements and physics, not words.

 

TomK

We've certainly had discussions about physics & perception before. On this subject.................YOU'RE WRONG!!!!

 

I could care less about the joystick length or interface. It does need a bit of  centering spring, and I've adjusted the force of them in numerous sticks to my preference. I'm not talking from an armchair perspective. I've seen your thoughts as far as the physics question goes.........but you're missing something somewhere. I seem to remember that you believe that us pilots are usung a bit of aileron imput, thinking about it or not. I totally disagree, and have quite a number of real life take off & climb pics to prove it. I also just recently asked the owner of a supersized Pitt's M-12 & nine cylinder Russia radial(who I use to share a hangar with), about the force of torque on takeoff. He just uses lots of left rudder (engine turns counter-clockwise) and that's it. I mentioned that the question was specifically for flight modeling purposes on a desktop sim.  I do think I have credibility from the actual takeoff, climb, and cruise experiences, even if I'm not an engineer dealing with physics.

 

L.Adamson

 

Post removed.  its moot.

Looks like I had already snagged it......

 

We've certainly had discussions about physics & perception before. On this subject

 

So, you're a physicist now?

 

Larry, pray tell, why can't you give your opinion on the matter at the org?

still waiting for the measurements.

I guess a real Baron's yoke must be inaccurate too because in level flight it needs no rudder or aileron trim. A real Baron most certainly must be off because it doesn't do what xplane does ... Isn't that where it always goes back-one can see the same circle by searching old org posts on much older versions of xplane-At least since I started using xplane in the mid 90's. Yet each version has gotten a little closer to the point xplane 10 was the first I actually didn't shelve fairly quickly.

 

Somehow though some sims seem to get it closer regardless of the joystick used and some even in xplane do-though I find I still can't use it for a useful ifr trainer....yet...still hoping....for the future.

Well, what else can I say than:

 

1) Larry is RIGHT, spot on in all issues he reports on his post!!!!

2) Geof is, naturally, just as Larry, spot on and right too...

 

What do these guys have in common? Simple - they both fly aircraft for real!!!!

 

BTW: could someone point me to that thread at the org? It's been some time since I've been there. Probably one of the threads I initiated myself about this and other bugs that plague XP's fdm (?)

So, you're a physicist now?

 

Larry, pray tell, why can't you give your opinion on the matter at the org?

No, I'm just one of those guys who actually set's the wing's incidence, drill & reams the hole, and then torque the bolts to hold everything in place. And then I fly it, to see if it's correct. Since there is much interest in this subject, here and at the org., I've looked up a lot of specifications for wing incidence settings. I've heard that a few exist for a small amount of added incidence in the left wing, but I never found any. Most specs call for the same amount. You then fly it, and make adjustments for out of rig, or slight building errors.

 

If you feel that my hands on experience has no relevance compared to what an engineer might believe, then that's your choice.

 

 

BTW: could someone point me to that thread at the org? It's been some time since I've been there. Probably one of the threads I initiated myself about this and other bugs that plague XP's fdm (?)

 

Cubby's corner, which is the technical stuff. It's not the general forum.

 

"Flight modeling, how to stablize the longitudinal axis."

 

There is some interesting info there. I agree with a lot, and disagree with some. The org actually has some other interesting forums too.

I read them all the time.

Well, what else can I say than:

 

1) Larry is RIGHT, spot on in all issues he reports on his post!!!!

2) Geof is, naturally, just as Larry, spot on and right too...

 

What do these guys have in common? Simple - they both fly aircraft for real!!!!

 

BTW: could someone point me to that thread at the org? It's been some time since I've been there. Probably one of the threads I initiated myself about this and other bugs that plague XP's fdm (?)

Hey jcomm-in my case did fly for real for 26 years but taking first break for multitude of reasons for at least one year if not forever.

 

Therefore a realistic sim that allows me to retain essential skills is an even more desperate important need for me. I' ll go for the platform that gives it to me the best so hopefully if I get back in a year not much if any remedial needed. I had one such period 15 years ago and the sim at the time kept me in shape so that no remedial was needed.

 

Of course real gps, realistic weather conditions, rw instruments, and aircraft that perform like their real counterparts need apply.....

Geof, one of our best glider pilots here in Portugal, which happens to be a MD too, had to quit for 2 yrs. He's back flying now, and the oldest guy around is now 83, a lot older than both you and me!!! So... I hope you get back in shape as soon as possible, and flying :-)!!!!

 

I don't know yet what I will do with my license. It's still valid until March 2014, but with the crisis around here, affecting not only me directly but many others, I don't know if I will be able to get it valid for another 2 yrs :-/  Finding a good sim is also something I've been looking  for too lately ;-)