Sign in to follow this  
ErichB

For those who have come from FSX/P3D

Recommended Posts

I've been reading a number of forum posts on DCS and it clearly seems that the physics modeling and systems modeling cannot evn be compared to FSX/P3D.  From what I am reading, it seems as though DCS might be placing me at risk of diverting all of my flightsim budget in favour of it as opposed to P3D.

 

Has anyone made a semi-permanent move to this sim away from FSX/P3D.  There seems to be alot of great aircraft being developed for it now.   

 

I have not actually done any flying in DCS yet, but for those who are familiar with it, what it the most striking difference when flying in DCS compared to FSX/P3D?

Share this post


Link to post
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

Me :-)

 

I have been using flightsims since 1987, when one of my university teachers showed me FS3 on a MAC :-) 

Got my PPL in 1980, and after 2000 started seeking the "perfect" flightsim, with my main aim being, above all, flight dynamics and accurate / detailed systems modeling.

 

I used about all versions of MSFS, started also using xp since version 7, and in the middle I tried many other simulators, most civil since I was never fond of combat flight.

 

I had bought the Combat Flight Simulator series 1, 2 and 3, but played each for only one or two weeks. Also tried Jane's WW2 fighters loooong ago, and CYAC... Then I tried the first version of IL2 Sturmovik.

 

Somehow, I always returned to civil flight simulators in the hope that someday, somehow, the flight dynamics could equal what, by that time, I was already finding a lot more plausibly modeled in combat flight simulators. I used my P3D v2 refund top buy RoF an almost all of it's DCLs in a recent Anniversary Sales Promotion :-)

 

Regarding civil flightsims, by far the one that gave me the most rewarding experiences was Aerowinx PS1, now thanksfuly about to be replaced by the new Aerowinx PSX! As a PS1 user, MSFS ( 9 and then X), and even Flight Gear, soon became scenery generators for it, on a two PC setup I used for some years.

 

To put an end to the long and tedious story I might start from here, I'll say that early last year a friend finally convinced me to try DCS World and it's P51d. That was the end of a personal fight against myself regarding not using combat flight simulators, and although I still primarily use the p51d and now the th51d for simple circuits around an aerodrome, sometimes under adverse weather conditions, or some aerobatics, I have began to enter MP servers too.

 

The 3 helicopters available for DCS are also on my hangar, although almost never used the Ka-50.

 

Well, latter, that same friend kept saying that I should really give ears to what he was ( long ) been saying, and should now give a try to Rise of Flight, to see how further away from the civil simulators the quality and detail of a leaving World can go. I struggled against the idea for 1 yr, until he decided to offer me IL2 Battle of Stalingrad Open Alfa ( Std Edition ). Well, from that moment on, I really have to say that using either fsx or x-plane 10 became a very painful task since, although I still like to use a detailed airliner or a nicely modeled GA, and most A2A's make part of my hangar as well as PMDGs 744, NGX and 777, the same applying for a few great XP10 add-ons, truth is that both sims fail miserably to compare to the quality of the flight dynamics models of DCS World, IL2 BOS and even Rise of Flight...

 

I use IL2 BOS most of the time, and completely fell in love with it. DCS Is also superb just to fly the p51d and the helos. I have the A10C, and look fwd for the EDGE scenery engine and Nevada Map, but those sophisticated war systems of modern fighters / bombers are simply too complex for me, so, although I even got FC3 as a form of supporting DCS World, I do not even have it installed.

 

Going back to either fsx or x-plane 10 could only be done, in as far as I am concerned, as an exercise of nostalgy, pretty much like some do when playing older PC games... 

 

In these combat flightsims what amazes me, apart from the attention to modeling ( specific modeling ) of aircraft characteristics, systems, damage models, etc, is the complexity of the AI, even the weather modeling, scenery, sometimes online with 30 players on a furball, and still run smoothly on my rig, where I have long been striving to get some acceptable FPS, lower the VAS, etc..

 

Above all, all give me excellent flight models that I simply couldn't find on even the most acclaimed products for my civil platforms. So, heck, what problem do I have in simply starting DCS, IL2 or ROF for a short ride, feeling almost like being there, like never before in a flightsim? But I have to confess that an unexpected outcome resulted from my passion specially for IL2 BoS - online combat!  I am slowly becoming an addict ww1 and ww2 pilot :-)

 

I still use also Condorsoaring for some online soaring competitions, at least once a month :)

 

 

Why can't we have a civil flightsim with this level of quality, detail, smoothness?????

Share this post


Link to post
Striking difference? Damage model :)

 

I made a switch (well, not permanent) and eventually bought everything for DCS.

Choppers are unbeatable and you don't have to shoot stuff to make use of them.

 

Try it yourself. DCS is free. You get free su-25T and p-51 TF Mustang.

Su-25T has simplified cockpit (not clickable) but very complex flight model.

Free Mustang has fully functional, clickable cockpit, but disabled weapons (in free version).

Cockpit is a bit sterile, compared to A2A, but again - complex flight model.

Share this post


Link to post

Can you fly from Tulsa airport KTUL to Fargo KFAR using a Garmin GPS. Land using ILS and park at the GA facilities building using RW weather?

Share this post


Link to post

Thats great.  Thanks both for your replies.  I'm looking forward to using it.

Share this post


Link to post

Can you fly from Tulsa airport KTUL to Fargo KFAR using a Garmin GPS. Land using ILS and park at the GA facilities building using RW weather?

 

Yes to the ILSs in DCS World, not to the airfields you mention of course, but I'll answer with another question - can you interact with a scenery full of detail, a true living world of AI, online multiplayers, or both, and feel that your aircraft reacts to your inputs, errors, and "help" from others like in a civil flightsim?

 

Not being able to fly around the World and use civil aviation avionics was one of the reasons that kept me from jumping into combat flightsims for quite a while.... The other good reasons, mainly the flight dynamics and even systems modeling plus the immersive World around you eventually won.

 

Can you really feel like flying, meaning the detailed FDM, the immersive scenery and even weather modeling quality ( yes, not Real Time weather, but.... that's a price I gladly pay for other visual and even physic effects I get a lot more plausibly modeled in these sims than in any of the civil flightsims I used ( well, with the exception of PS1 in as far as weather effects ( not visual ) were concerned, and with an Honorable Mention to ASN for FSX/P3D which does miracles for weather in those platforms))?

Share this post


Link to post

Thats great.  Thanks both for your replies.  I'm looking forward to using it.

 

If you are going to spend some money, read this: DCS Product Terms

Share this post


Link to post

DCS is a fantastic product,I'm not a real pilot but , I find the flight model very believable,The only place it is lacking now is in it's 10+ yr Old Terrain/Maps.This will be fixed soon (2014) with the new graphics engine (EDGE) that's in Final stages of development.

Share this post


Link to post

Just a last note.

 

Honestly, I do not like, nor do I fly, the non-clickable cockpits, hence I will use only the A10C, KA-50, UH-1H, Mi-8 and the two Mustangs. 

 

Although I bought FC3, it was more as a form of supporting this great sim.

 

I do look fwd for the Fw-190, and some more ww2 aircraft that are expected to be released on the Complex series...

 

The Su-25T is very nice to handle and feel, although very heavy too, but since it has no clickable pit, it's not for me :-/

 

In the A10C, for instance, you can and should interact with all of the controls, switches, etc... The engine startup sequence includes using the APU, etc...  The same applies to the helicopters, all of them.

 

Another barrier for me are the rushing cockpits with all in Cyrillic :-/, although the tooltips are in English :)

Share this post


Link to post

Just a last note.

 

Honestly, I do not like, nor do I fly, the non-clickable cockpits, hence I will use only the A10C, KA-50, UH-1H, Mi-8 and the two Mustangs. 

 

Although I bought FC3, it was more as a form of supporting this great sim.

 

I do look fwd for the Fw-190, and some more ww2 aircraft that are expected to be released on the Complex series...

 

The Su-25T is very nice to handle and feel, although very heavy too, but since it has no clickable pit, it's not for me :-/

 

In the A10C, for instance, you can and should interact with all of the controls, switches, etc... The engine startup sequence includes using the APU, etc...  The same applies to the helicopters, all of them.

 

Another barrier for me are the rushing cockpits with all in Cyrillic :-/, although the tooltips are in English :)

 

 

I have to say, after last nights intro to DCS, I may be sticking with it for a while.  I was most impressed with the flying characteristics of the Su-25.  Another very convincing feature about it is the sounds.  It really sounds like the thrust of a loud jet.    Because the whole experience is so new, the non-clickable VC didnt bother me - and I havent even tested the weapon systems yet.  Spent most of my time on the tutorials.

 

It has blown me away overall. 

Share this post


Link to post

Also, check the realism about the systems modeling, even on the Su-25T. 

 

For instance, see how the turbines are modeled, how asymmetric thrust is so realistically reproduced, how a perfect simulation of fan windmill is implemented .... etc....

 

Then move to the t51d, and profit from a prop FDM that you can't find in MSFS ( A2A's excellent p51s included, but still very limited by the underlying flight dynamics core, something that not even accusim can cure :-/ ) or, even less,  in X-Plane 10 with it's prop model limitations...

Share this post


Link to post

I'll try the P-51 tonight.

 

So what should I purchase??? :)  I'm thinking Huey and A-10.  I love helos but find it all a bit lacking in FSX/P3D.  It will be interesting to fly one in the DCS.

Share this post


Link to post

Well Erich, simply forget about helicopter "flying" in MSFS / P3D. The DODOSIM Bell 207 could be the only exception, but even so, can't compare to the level of accuracy of helicopter flight and systems modeling available for DCS complex helicopters.

 

I bought the Ka-50 initially, but it's so complex to make good use of it for what 't's meant to be used - combat - that I almost never use it.

 

The UH-1H and the Mi-8 are both AMAZING, but if you have to choose, go for the UH-1H for a start.

 

The A10C is also a mandatory buy, specially if you want to get the EDGE Nevada scenery later when it get's available. Again, it's for me a more or less useless model since I didn't yet even try to learn it's sophisticated weapon systems, and even less tried to fly a combat mission - too complex for me :-/, but again, flight and systems modeling wise, is way ahead of any similar offer for either MSFS / P3D or X-Plane!

Share this post


Link to post

Well Erich, simply forget about helicopter "flying" in MSFS / P3D. The DODOSIM Bell 207 could be the only exception, but even so, can't compare to the level of accuracy of helicopter flight and systems modeling available for DCS complex helicopters.

 

I bought the Ka-50 initially, but it's so complex to make good use of it for what 't's meant to be used - combat - that I almost never use it.

 

The UH-1H and the Mi-8 are both AMAZING, but if you have to choose, go for the UH-1H for a start.

 

The A10C is also a mandatory buy, specially if you want to get the EDGE Nevada scenery later when it get's available. Again, it's for me a more or less useless model since I didn't yet even try to learn it's sophisticated weapon systems, and even less tried to fly a combat mission - too complex for me :-/, but again, flight and systems modeling wise, is way ahead of any similar offer for either MSFS / P3D or X-Plane!

 

 

Yeah, I guess that's one of the issues regarding a complex sim of this nature.  You have to invest the time to learn things properly and most of us just dont have the time to learn how to operate these flying weapon systems the way they should be.    But it's fun trying.

Share this post


Link to post

A-10C (not "10A") has the best value for the money. You won't get Nevada map for free. It was for beta purchasers

Ka-50 is awesome, but it won't give you experience of flying a classic helicopter (coaxial rotors), and It's supposed to fly itself, so the pilot has the time to manage weapon systems. It requires some learning about autopilot and trimming.

The best choice to start with choppers is Huey. Nimble iconic chopper. Easy to learn and has very good campaign. Recently they implemented sling load operations, but it's still WIP

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, I guess that's one of the issues regarding a complex sim of this nature.  You have to invest the time to learn things properly and most of us just dont have the time to learn how to operate these flying weapon systems the way they should be.    But it's fun trying.

 

It's always a question of focus of attention. I spent "years" learning how to fly more complex stuff, starting with Air Transport Pilot Rev D, then.... PS1 and ELITE, some great add-ons for MSFS (NGX, 747 and 777, plus a few buses...) and the An-24 for X-Plane 10.  I am sure the weapon systems of a modern fighter could easily have been learned, should I ever have found any interest in that, but I really couldn't care less about it - military flight simulation was not my choice, with the exception of ww1 and ww2 ...

 

Now that I settled for the combat flightsims, I started eating ww2 and ww1 aircraft and combat tactics documents, and I believe that I will probably even dedicate some time to the A10C. The Mig-15 and the Sabre would also be great to have, specially because the Portuguese Airforce had the Sabres, and I really loved to see them flying :-) The G91 would be also great to have, for the same reasons :-)

Share this post


Link to post

If I buy now any module will it be compatible with the new engine that is coming in 2014?

Share this post


Link to post

the new engine, no affect to the module previous release. All modules can working on EDGE.

Share this post


Link to post

How exactly is EDGE going to work, exactly?   On my latest flight sim computer, I haven't reinstalled DCS and several airplanes because I've been holding out for EDGE.  I don't want to spend time setting things up again from scratch and then have to redo it all when Edge comes out.  I'm assuming that once EDGE comes out, everything then becomes DX11 and full SLI support?  Or is that only going to work with the Nevada map, and everything else stays the same?  Please explain how this "system" will work.

Share this post


Link to post

How exactly is EDGE going to work, exactly?   On my latest flight sim computer, I haven't reinstalled DCS and several airplanes because I've been holding out for EDGE.  I don't want to spend time setting things up again from scratch and then have to redo it all when Edge comes out.  I'm assuming that once EDGE comes out, everything then becomes DX11 and full SLI support?  Or is that only going to work with the Nevada map, and everything else stays the same?  Please explain how this "system" will work.

 

I thought SLI worked, just Crossfire didn't. I maybe wrong though. 

 

What they said is, features that have to do with the terrain, for example clip mapping, will be exclusive to new maps created with EDGE tools. Other features that have to do with the renderer, DX11, and the engine, SLI support, should work with the old map.

Share this post


Link to post

Again, it's for me a more or less useless model since I didn't yet even try to learn it's sophisticated weapon systems, and even less tried to fly a combat mission - too complex for me :-/, but again, flight and systems modeling wise, is way ahead of any similar offer for either MSFS / P3D or X-Plane!

 

I'm starting to find DCS not for me either, Not really interested in learning about all the weapon stuff. Even more not interested in trying to memorize all the key board controls. I also miss the whole Earth for scenery.

 

It's free and a fun diversion but I'm keeping FSX as my main flyer for now.

Share this post


Link to post

FSX is still the regression line of  flight simulation :-)

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this