ATC is NOT 'as real as it gets'! :-(

[martinlest2 58]

Hi. Just wondered of anyone has any advice as to how to get ATC back working properly. I use Oncourse PFE, but this is probably not a PFE issue per se... things are no better if I don't connect PFE to my sim.

Firstly (this is by the by), is there any setting I can change within FS9 to get AI a/c to 'see' and respond to my user a/c sooner? Planes taxiing towards me do often (though by no means always) stop if I clearly have right of way, but mostly too late and my wings nearly always slice through their fuselage.

Secondly, this being my main question, why does ATC allow me to enter the runway when a/c are still occupying it? And why does it allow two a/c to land almost on top of each other?



I use AISeparation and AISMooth together (and I think I am using the 'recommended' settings for both), but juggling these (or not using them at all) doesn't seem to help, so any input would be appreciated.

Thanks,

 

Martin

[Johan_Dees 84]

Speeding up atc and ai talk with editvoicepack helps also. Faster responses.

Less traffic of course helps also a lot.

And, I use a modified atc.dll what doesnt constantly yell to anyone about climbing 100 feet, wat

will saturate the radio, and thus atc.

You can find it at calclassic.com forums here: http://calclassic.proboards.com/thread/4931/propliner-atc

Works well for modern flying too!

[Pe11e 812]

Will this dll work in FSX?

[martinlest2 58]

Hi. I did use that dll file and it was fine.. an improvement. No CTDs. But I use 3rd. party ATC (PFE) - the editvoicepack is redundant with 3rd. party software like PFE and RC4.

 

Nevertheless, I don't think it is PFE that is actually programming the AI a/c, that is still done by FS9 and the bgl files. I have asked this question on the PFE forums too, but I think it is probably an FS9 question - possibly with AISeparation and AISmooth.

 

Thanks

[A32xx 129]

Dave Sheffield's manual on AISeparation and AISmooth might help:

 

http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/fslib.php?do=copyright&fid=127479

[mgh 89]

The simple explanation is that FS9/FSX are games - marketed for the game market.!

[martinlest2 58]

I remember reading that many moons ago - I'll read it again and check my settings, though I can't see that any settings would allow two a/c to land within five seconds of each other!

 

Thanks for the heads up!

You say it's a 'game' Gerry (I was talking about FS9 BTW, not FSX), but what's in a word? To most simmers it's more than that, as you must be aware. And even if you have more of 'a life' than the rest of us (?) and it is just a game to you, why not even so make it as real as you can? It's a large part of the challenge and fascination. Many of these issues are tweakable and often fixable.

[mgh 89]

Microsoft developed FS9 (and all the version) as games - with all their limitations. By all means enhance FS9 by add-ons to improvement it. Don't blame Microsoft for not including all add-ons people wanted.in the base price. It wouldn't have sold at that prices and we'd have had nothing!

[martinlest2 58]

"Games" (in bold type). Yes, we all know what Games are! Where has anyone blamed Microsoft for anything here??? Not sure where your comments are coming from, but you clearly have your own agenda here. I am not commenting on this line of 'reasoning' any more, it doesn't stem from anything posted here and is quite pointless..

[HaraldG 559]

Could this be a problem with your afcad file (or multiple afcad files)? I don't have a proof for this idea, it's just an idea. What scenery do you use? Or does it happen in several sceneries?

 

I never saw such a behaviour neither with the default ATC nor with the modified version Johan has kindly pointed to (and that I also use for years now).

[John Hinson 22]

I can confirm that both of the alternative ATC programmes do sit on top of the default one (in fact, the default is chatting away in the background with the sound off) which means the traffic is still being generated in the standard manner.

 

Like Geyer, I have never seen behaviour like that double landing and concur witrh the idea that FS thinks there are two separate airports one above the other so i would certainly check for duplicate AFDs with perhaps different airport co-ordinates or maybe an airport with an updated ICAO code.

 

John

[martinlest2 58]

Hi. It happens at various airports, but I'll double check for multiple AFCADs. Seems unlikely though.

[A32xx 129]

Just for everyone's reference, here are Dave Sheffield's AI Smooth & AI Separation compatibility settings:

 

AI Smooth:

Distance of AI aircraft to landing aircraft: 5.000000

Distance of user aircraft to landing aircraft: 5.000000

Heading range for intercept: 1

Global approach fix distance: 0.000000

Minimum Separation time: 1

User plane response: Ticked

Show ATC message: Unticked

Landing release altitude: 3.000000

Min. centerline distance: 0.000000

Reduce speed on approach: Unticked

Speak ATC Messages: Unticked

Control Batchsize, Poll Interval, Command Delay: Unchanged

 

AI Separation:

Min Separation: 6

Desired Separation: 8

Refresh rate: 5

Heading difference: 20

No move zone: 6

Reduced separation zone start: 35

[ronzie 21]

I'd also check for overlapping ai traffic files (duplicate schedules). This might happen with an ai all-inclusive package with individual add-on ai chedules such as World of AI. Think two renderings of the same ai with simultaneous arrivals causing heavy traffic.

 

For ai take-off clashes where parallel runways exist or there are opposing runway entries try scattering the flow by opening some taxi links.

[DaveCT2003 1,820]

Well, I guess I'm going to be "THAT" guy this time around, and recommend VATSIM.

 

Truly, there is nothing like it, and no AI program is ever going to come close to flying with real pilots and controllers.

 

Flew out of Heathrow this evening, must have AT LEAST 50 other human controlled aircraft and went through 1 delivery controller, two ground controllers, one tower controller, followed by departure during which I changed ATC frequencies 6 times in 5 minutes, speaking to every level of controller on my departure. Then one to Bremen Radar, Prague Radar (x2), two approach controllers, tower and ground.

 

All the ATC coverage and procedures were SPOT ON, which is usually the case in the UK and Europe (and not bad in the US - some US areas are as good as Europe as well).

 

Anyway, there it is.  Been on VATSIM for close to 10 years and my biggest mistake was not flying online sooner.