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Heimi

User generated content

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Just read the actual EULA for DTG Flight School on STEAM. There is a long paragraph for providing and using "user generated content".

Promising to me.

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Now that's interesting

I've been hoping they'd keep open the file structure for having a poke about. Although the file structure was open in the alpha, I think Martin mentioned the structure itself could change before release.

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Maybe, but it could also be standard copy-pasta from DTG's other EULA's for FSX and their train sims. I wouldn't read too much into that, based on what Martin has said about the plans for Flight School as a closed, standalone product.

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Clause 9.3 has my attention...

9.3 We may provide software or tools which assist the creation of UGC (also known as the "Editor"). Please note that the Editor requires expert knowledge to be used properly.

 

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Hmm, I wonder why the EULA is dated 22 May 2016 when it's currently the 20th? That's certainly a fairly lengthy section on UGC. Perhaps a question in the 'Ask DTG' thread requesting clarification is in order? I note that there's mention of an "Editor". I suspect that if there is to be UGC that the "Editor" may not be available until after the Flight Sim is released since they'll need to produce one for the Sim anyway.

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I just took a quick look at the EULA for Train Simulator 2016. It's the same exact language. They just copy-pasted it for Flight School as a standard "cover all the bases" EULA. Again, I wouldn't read too much into it.

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To me, it just shows an understanding of this community, as we all know that despite what anyone says, there will be people out there trying to shoehorn FSX stuff into Flight School nearly from day one.

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HiFlyer -

To me, it just shows an understanding of this community, as we all know that despite what anyone says, there will be people out there trying to shoehorn FSX stuff into Flight School nearly from day one.

 

No Siree. I had no idea those people existed, certainly never met one, or heard of their like.

 

*innocent face*

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To me, it just shows an understanding of this community, as we all know that despite what anyone says, there will be people out there trying to shoehorn FSX stuff into Flight School nearly from day one.

 

a very good idea.

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To me, it just shows an understanding of this community, as we all know that despite what anyone says, there will be people out there trying to shoehorn FSX stuff into Flight School nearly from day one.

It will be interesting to see if Dovetail is active in preventing addons to Flight School, or if they turn a blind eye to it.

 

Dick

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It will be interesting to see if Dovetail is active in preventing addons to Flight School, or if they turn a blind eye to it.

 

Dick

 

well - they said that 'We recognize the community passion regarding addons'  if they will start to block everything and everybody it will surely backfire on their doorstep ! Even said so i will not buy 'Locked up School' from dtg unless i can add stuff on that.

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well - they said that 'We recognize the community passion regarding addons'  if they will start to block everything and everybody it will surely backfire on their doorstep ! Even said so i will not buy 'Locked up School' from dtg unless i can add stuff on that.

 

They've said very clearly its not designed or intended to be expandable by third parties. Where we repeatedly get in trouble is when we ignore plainspoken English and substitute our own desires, then get upset when the two don't mesh.

 

I'm going to take them at their word, then maybe be pleasantly surprised if something else happens, but honestly I hope they can maintain order and not let things get out of control into the wild wild west take you life into your own hands tweak-a-thon a palooza that the current market has become.

 

We may swim like happy fish in the kaleidoscopic confusion, but to newcomers I'm certain it looks like absolute chaos.

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They've said very clearly its not designed or intended to be expandable by third parties. Where we repeatedly get in trouble is when we ignore plainspoken English and substitute our own desires, then get upset when the two don't mesh.

 

I'm going to take them at their word, then maybe be pleasantly surprised if something else happens, but honestly I hope they can maintain order and not let things get out of control into the wild wild west take you life into your own hands tweak-a-thon a palooza that the current market has become.

 

We may swim like happy fish in the kaleidoscopic confusion, but to newcomers I'm certain it looks like absolute chaos.

 

 

 

 

 

I see your point but you have pro and against in everything;

 

i know for facts that lots of newcomers love to be able to add addons into a game - and that is what keep them play it.

Do you really believe that a newcomer will play  flight school for months see exactly the same visuals day after day ??

 

the will loose interest after a week !  guarantee !

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Do you really believe that a newcomer will play  flight school for months see exactly the same visuals day after day ??
 

 

No, I think DTG have made a calculated decision to create a limited-interest product that won't get in the way of its full simulator.

 

I don't think they want Flight School to have any longevity.

 

In which case they wont want anyone else enhancing the products longevity by adding things to it.

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Right, it's a "starter" sim. People who try it and are bitten by the flightsim bug can move on to the more complex big brother.

 

Besides motivating the user to upgrade, disallowing addons simplifies the product for the newbie simmer, and also makes it easier to support: No trying to decipher the combinations or permutations of addons to get to the root cause of a problem. Plus the user may be more likely to focus learning to fly, instead of endless tweaking and trying to make their sim look like some doctored youtube video.

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No, I think DTG have made a calculated decision to create a limited-interest product that won't get in the way of its full simulator.

 

I don't think they want Flight School to have any longevity.

 

In which case they wont want anyone else enhancing the products longevity by adding things to it.

 

you make sense - i agree

but i observe teens everyday - the attitude is to fly from flower to flower very very quickly !

 

the risk here is that once the new teen users are feed-up to fly  lockup fly school - (after a week) it will be bye bye DTG ! and is for good !

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you make sense - i agree

but i observe teens everyday - the attitude is to fly from flower to flower very very quickly !

 

the risk here is that once the new teen users are feed-up to fly  lockup fly school - (after a week) it will be bye bye DTG ! and is for good !

 

Actually, that's probably DTG's business plan! The trainsim market has a lot of loss over time as people use it for a while then move on. DTG has been good in that they get a lot of new people to replace them, and the circle goes round and round.

 

I think they would be quite happy with such a cycle for their plane sim, with loud flashy updates every year to draw in new crowds as others wander away, and a core market (Probably us, with some new blood added occasionally) that stays. And buys. And buys again.......

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I think they would be quite happy with such a cycle for their plane sim, with loud flashy updates every year to draw in new crowds as others wander away, and a core market (Probably us, with some new blood added occasionally) that stays. And buys. And buys again.......

And as a user of DTG Train sims for a couple of years, that is definetly the company business model. They release a product, most likely it has some faults, and the majority of the time the faults are never fixed, but there is a new product just around the corner that they promise will be better. You can spend a ton of money, until you realize that this is a never ending loop. 

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And as a user of DTG Train sims for a couple of years, that is definetly the company business model. They release a product, most likely it has some faults, and the majority of the time the faults are never fixed, but there is a new product just around the corner that they promise will be better. You can spend a ton of money, until you realize that this is a never ending loop. 

 

than i stick to fsx and xplane !   after all i already fly 64 bit - and if p3d goes 64 bit who need DTG LOOPS ??

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I'm not upset by their probable business model. With Carenado and other standbys in the loop there's bound to be lots of good stuff to buy. The big plus for me in all this is FINALLY a unified distribution system via steam, Painless installation, painless updates, and a sim that's designed to handle addons in an easy, comprehensible and rational manner rather than the hodge-podge we have now.

 

We've needed somebody to bring order to chaos for a long time now.

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I'm not upset by their probable business model. With Carenado and other standbys in the loop there's bound to be lots of good stuff to buy. The big plus for me in all this is FINALLY a unified distribution system via steam, Painless installation, painless updates, and a sim that's designed to handle addons in an easy, comprehensible and rational manner rather than the hodge-podge we have now.

 

We've needed somebody to bring order to chaos for a long time now.

 

i would not call avsim - flightsim - simviation - and others files libraries caos  :smile:

 

i find steam much more chaotic and confusing than any flightsim site out there - never understood this 'need the master to make order' theory.

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i would not call avsim - flightsim - simviation - and others files libraries caos  :smile:

 

i find steam much more chaotic and confusing than any flightsim site out there - never understood this 'need the master to make order' theory.

 

Trust me, its a mess. An organized one, but still a mess.

 

Go into your average flightsim store and imagine you know nothing, nothing at all. How do you know which products are good and which should be steered clear of? What the heck is a mesh? What are these landclass thingys? Whats all this orbx stuff! Jezz, you have to buy every single airport separately? Who makes the best airports? GOD this is expensive, these people are crazy! Whats the difference between this pmdg plane and this $19.99 one besides the price? They both look like big jets to me?

 

Wow, it says go to the forum for updates. Jeez there are 15 updates, do I need to do all of them? Wait, this one says only use if I are not already on revision 12789856743 but only after installing update 06549877....... Hmm the installer has three choices..... whats the difference between FSX and Fsx-SE? Whats P3D?

 

Hey this free plane says overwrite file in Simobjects folder. Whats a simobject?

 

Alrighty then, I'm gonna go play War Thunder.

 

For people who have been doing this for years, or whose interest is strong enough to propel them through any barrier, these things might be only slight annoyances, heck maybe even enjoyable. For everyone else not accustomed to having to become a car mechanic to drive a car. It looks like utter chaos.

 

Welcome to nichedom.

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Very well said Devon. I'm convinced the fact that the upcoming DTG flight simulator and all future addons for it will be distributed through Steam will make it the biggest sim soon. I for one am looking forward to the coming years. I now use P3D and I am very pleased with it. In recent weeks I did a reinstall of the sim and most of my addons. You all now the enormous hassle this is. Installing all these executables seperately, entering purchase details, waiting for extraction processes etc. And all that dozens of times! If I decide to purchase the DTG flight simulator and build on this new platform a reinstall of the sim and it's addons will only acquire me to log on to my steam account, go to my library and click install on the sim. Steam will save me a lot of file administration and a lot of mouseclicks, that's for sure!

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I just took a quick look at the EULA for Train Simulator 2016. It's the same exact language. They just copy-pasted it for Flight School as a standard "cover all the bases" EULA. Again, I wouldn't read too much into it.

 

That is correct. It is our standard EULA that we use for all Dovetail Games simulators. Like all EULAs it covers all the legal requirements we need to mention, some of these will be more applicable to a given title than others. 

 

As others have pointed out, DTG Flight School will be standalone experience. It will not support existing add-ons or content created by players. That will all come in DTG Flight Simulator, which is due out later in the year. 

 

I hope that clears things up. 

 

- Martin 

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