Bert Pieke

Ignition Switches in P3DV4

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The ignition switches which cause the ticking noise after startup need to be turned off, but in the P3DV4 version, they do not operate correctly. 

The best I have been able to do, is click on the top of the right toggle switch which somehow turned off both switches..

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For me they work the same as they did in v3.4.  Click anywhere on either of them toggles them both.  I have never seen them work independently in either sim. 

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5 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

OK, worked independently in FSX...

I have heard that from others.  I looked at the model.  They are two different animation variables, so something might be wrong with the clickspot that manifests itself only in P3D.  I don't know of a way to change that....or even find it. 

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Code looks the same:

FSX version:

Switch ignition right (%((A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:2,BOOL) 0 >)%{if}On%{else}Off%{end})1 (>L:BUFFER_CLICK1_PLASTIC,number) 2  (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)

Switch ignition Left (%((A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,BOOL) 0 >)%{if}On%{else}Off%{end})1 (>L:BUFFER_CLICK1_PLASTIC,number) 1  (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)    

P3D version:

Switch ignition Left (%((A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,BOOL) 0 >)%{if}On%{else}Off%{end})1 (>L:BUFFER_CLICK1_PLASTIC,number) 1 (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)    

Switch ignition right (%((A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:2,BOOL) 0 >)%{if}On%{else}Off%{end})1 (>L:BUFFER_CLICK1_PLASTIC,number) 2 (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)

 

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Interesting.....

Neither SDK provides an index for (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE).   It's as though the SDK believes a turbine airplane would only have a single ignition switch.  It allows for 4 different magnetos, 4 different generators, 4 different alternators, 4 different primers, etc......

I wonder if " 2 (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)" means anything different than " 1 (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)".  I wonder if in either case the lone IGNITION SWITCH is toggled?  Maybe plugging in "2" had some undocumented meaning in FSX but no longer has meaning in P3D? 

Edit:  Also....neither SDK provides for an indexed ignition switch.  The variable (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:index, bool) does not exist in either document.  The variable is simply (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH).  It is boolean in FSX and enum (0 - off, 1 - on,  or 2 - auto) in P3D.  So if the " 2 (>K:TURBINE_IGNITION_SWITCH_TOGGLE)" has any meaning at all, it is trying to turn the switch to AUTO in P3D, but the switch doesn't have an AUTO position in the Cheyenne.  It's either on or off.  

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I would say that the difference between boolean in FSX and enum in P3D indicates that something has changed.  Maybe FSX had an "undocumented feature" that P3D treats differently.

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Well.....I can't find the variable for the switch itself.  There is a variable for the light next to the switch (L:TURB_ENG_IGNITION_1 and  L:TURB_ENG_IGNITION_2) and it correlates well.  But I can't find anything that correlates to the switch.  There two variables in the log (L:ASD_DO228_BTN_IGNITION_LH and L:ASD_DO228_BTN_IGNITION_RH) but they remain =0.00 regardless of the position of the switches. 

Very puzzling......

Edit:  In the GAUGE UPDATE I find this:

(A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,bool)
(A:GENERAL ENG STARTER:1,bool) and  
(>L:ASD_DO228_BTN_IGNITION_LH,number)

The "(A:GENERAL ENG STARTER:1,bool)" is a valid variable.  But as we have already seen " (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,bool)" is not.  Therefore nothing can ever be injected into " (>L:ASD_DO228_BTN_IGNITION_LH,number)" so it is always zero. 

I think the "smoking gun" is the invalid variable "(A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,bool)".  Nothing connected with it works properly. 

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Checked it all with VARWATCHER.  All the variables work including the one that shouldn't.  The problem remains that turning on either ignition switch turns them both on even though they are separate variables.  The problem may be in the model or it may be the invalid variable.  I'm not smart enough to figure it out.   

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Something is not right...

How can there be

(A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,BOOL)  and  (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:2,BOOL)

and no way of switching these individually..

I can confirm that I had them opposite to one another and clicking either switch would reverse them both at the same time.  No way to get them back in sync, other than reloading the airplane.

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I think because it's an invalid variable, (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH:1,BOOL), and because the valid variable, (A:TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH,enum) doesn't discriminate between engines...... anytime the invalid variable is toggled the valid variable responds accordingly.  That is, both switches respond since the valid variable doesn't know the difference between left and right or engine 1 and engine 2. 

The adjacent starter switches work fine because they have valid variables that recognize separate engines.  (A:GENERAL ENG STARTER:index,bool)

The generator switches work fine for the same reason.  (A:GENERAL ENG GENERATOR SWITCH:index,bool)

The fuel pumps.  (A:GENERAL ENG FUEL PUMP ON:index,bool)

But the valid ignition variable is not indexed and therefore doesn't know the difference.  (TURB ENG IGNITION SWITCH,enum)

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I opened a support issue on this with Carenado:

1. The ignition switches seem to be tied together. When you turn one on, the other goes on.
2. The AP and YD are not properly tied together. When you turn on the AP the YD should go on. When you turn off the YD, the AP should go off. When you turn off the AP, the YD should stay on. People have been working on a script but it'd be good to have it fixed.
3. Are the fuel tank switches and boost pumps working correctly? People are reporting that the fuel is being drawn from one tank. It should draw from both tanks.

Their response:

Quote

Greetings,
Thanks for your feedback, this issues will be checked and corrected in a future version.
Best regards

Carenado.

So, perhaps we'll see another update.  I'd really like to have a good solid new turboprop for flying around the Caribbean.  This one or the Alabeo 441 (which also has issues) would be nice.

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1 hour ago, Gregg_Seipp said:

1. The ignition switches seem to be tied together. When you turn one on, the other goes on.

That's a known problem and since there's only one installer for fsx and p3d they could only choose to make it work correctly in fsx or p3d. 

So it's working for me :) 

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Just now, J35OE said:

That's a known problem and since there's only one installer for fsx and p3d they could only choose to make it work correctly in fsx or p3d. 

So it's working for me :) 

Hmmm.  The Turbine Duke works right so, at least, we know it's solvable.

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16 minutes ago, Gregg_Seipp said:

at least, we know it's solvable.

Not for the guys at Alabeo/Carenado....

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