who stole the plane

[Orlaam 306]

50 minutes ago, udidwht said:

Nothing is going to be 100% foolproof but given how mental health is greatly ignored in this country it's asinine to not at least have it be part of the process. Emergency rooms across the nation are treating people in a 'revolving door process' due to mental health.

I'd love to know why you think mental illness is "ignored"?

[E6BAV8R 88]

5 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

I'd love to know why you think mental illness is "ignored"?

When is the last time you filled out any form of an application, registration, or anything of the sort that asked about mental illness?  Have you ever had a mental health evaluation?

Not only that, if someone is diagnosed as having some form of mental disability, it is often grounds for immediate denial of many things.  Rather than offer some form of treatment program to keep their job, they are very often punished for self disclosing.

Edited August 16, 2018 by E6BAV8R

[Orlaam 306]

3 minutes ago, E6BAV8R said:

When is the last time you filled out any form of an application, registration, or anything of the sort that asked about mental illness?

About 2 months ago. It's a 4473.  Actually, when you go to the ER, PCP, or even my last dental visit.  A questionnaire was required that asked about mental illness.

Also, most of my job applications inquire about mental disorders and limiting conditions. 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Orlaam

[E6BAV8R 88]

1 minute ago, Orlaam said:

About 2 months ago. It's a 4473.  Actually, when you go to the ER, PCP, or even my last dental visit.  A questionnaire was required that asked about mental illness.

Also, most of my job applications inquire about mental disorders and limited conditions. 

Sure.  But why would anyone admit to having a mental disorder if they aren't required to?  You are more often punished for doing so in this country.

Edited August 16, 2018 by E6BAV8R

[E6BAV8R 88]

For example, the FAA Medical Certificate evaluations are getting heavy on "sleep apnea".  While not admitting you snore isn't grounds for immediate removal, you essentially get reviewed by the FAA Medical and have to then go pay, out of your own pocket, thousands of dollars for a sleep study review and diagnosis, submitting those results to the FAA Medical Office; and potentially having your medical certificate revoked.

Do you think many pilots are going to admit they snore?

[Orlaam 306]

1 minute ago, E6BAV8R said:

Sure.  But why would anyone admit to having a mental disorder if they aren't required to?  You are more often punished for doing so in this country.

You just invalidated your argument.

[udidwht 133]

4 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

Why stop there?  I mean we should prevent anyone with thyroid, adrenal, cancer or history of cancer, pregnancy (perinatal depression/anxiety), any woman in the age range for menopause, chronic pain disorders, parasomnia, HIV, steroid/hormone treatment, and even antibiotics.  You do realize antibiotics have resulted in cases of psychosis, right?  I've even treated one.  There are no less than 200 medical problems that can present with psychiatric symptoms.  So you have effectively taken more than 50% of the population out of flying or owning firearms. 

Those cases are very rare compared to an actual diagnoses of say schizophrenia. Very rare. 50%? Hardly correct by any measure. LOL!

So you're completely ok with allowing one who takes medication daily to fly a commercial aircraft with dozens or hundreds of people knowing that the medication may stop working or better yet....they willfully stop taking it because they decide it makes them feel funny?

When others safety is at risk there are no second chances at altitude. No point in taking a chance even if it saves lives?

[E6BAV8R 88]

4 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

You just invalidated your argument.

How?  Because you happen to be in a field that asks about mental health?  And it doesn't change the fact that mental health is largely shunned in this country. 

I've been a pilot for 16 years.  Not once have I been asked about mental health.  I also don't own a gun, though, so I guess you could add that to your "invalidated argument" list.

Edited August 16, 2018 by E6BAV8R

[Orlaam 306]

Just now, udidwht said:

Those cases are very rare compared to an actual diagnoses of say schizophrenia. Very rare. 50%? Hardly correct by any measure. LOL!

So you're completely ok with allowing one who takes medication daily to fly a commercial aircraft with dozens or hundreds of people knowing that the medication may stop working or better yet....they willfully stop taking it because they decide it makes them feel funny?

When others safety is at risk there are no second chances at altitude. No point in taking a chance even if it saves lives?

So cases of hypothyroidism, cancer, paroxysmal disorders arising out of the blue (e.g., CVA, MI), chronic pain, sleep disorders, and hundreds of other medical conditions that give way to psychiatric symptoms are rare?  That's a new one.  50% applies to medical conditions that present with psych Sx.  Like I said, even some antibiotics can result in delirium and psychosis.  Albeit rare or not, do think anyone can predict this?  Not hardly.

[KevinAu 441]

What does faa medicals have anything to do with this? he wasn’t even a pilot.

[udidwht 133]

5 minutes ago, E6BAV8R said:

Sure.  But why would anyone admit to having a mental disorder if they aren't required to?  You are more often punished for doing so in this country.

If it's during an interview/application process who's going to know outside of the process? Plan on telling everyone?

I don't know about you but IMO people that fly commercially have a right to know if their pilot has a history of going of the deep end however slight it may be. These days I see people all to often routinely for it in the emergency room. Number 1 reason....they willfully stop taking their medication.

[Orlaam 306]

5 minutes ago, E6BAV8R said:

How?  Because you happen to be in a field that asks about mental health?  And it doesn't change the fact that mental health is largely shunned in this country. 

I've been a pilot for 16 years.  Not once have I been asked about mental health.  I also don't own a gun, though, so I guess you could add that to your "invalidated argument" list.

Shunned is not ignored.  You can walk into any ER or psychiatric hospital and tell them you need help.  That's not ignoring.

[udidwht 133]

2 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

So cases of hypothyroidism, cancer, paroxysmal disorders arising out of the blue (e.g., CVA, MI), chronic pain, sleep disorders, and hundreds of other medical conditions that give way to psychiatric symptoms are rare?  That's a new one.  50% applies to medical conditions that present with psych Sx.  Like I said, even some antibiotics can result in delirium and psychosis.  Albeit rare or not, do think anyone can predict this?  Not hardly.

Compared to a clinical diagnoses of a mental health disorder that can't be cured. Nice try.

Have a side effect from antibiotic medication? Stop taking them. Problem corrected. Can't say the same for many mental health diagnoses that require daily medication.

[Orlaam 306]

2 minutes ago, udidwht said:

If it's during an interview/application process who's going to know outside of the process? Plan on telling everyone?

I don't know about you but IMO people that fly commercially have a right to know if their pilot has a history of going of the deep end however slight it may be. These days I see people all to often routinely for it in the emergency room. Number 1 reason....they willfully stop taking their medication.

If you work in an ER, you should be far more aware of mental illness and comorbidity, which it doesn't seem you do.  People who stop their psych meds do so because they A. feel better, B. would rather pay for illicit drugs than Rx, C. have no insight/judgment, which is as a result of an SMI status.  They aren't flying planes or running a big business, let me tell you.

[udidwht 133]

3 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

Shunned is not ignored.  You can walk into any ER or psychiatric hospital and tell them you need help.  That's not ignoring.

To a degree yes.

But it still takes a willing participant to want the help. Getting the court involved is a process that doesn't come as easy as it should and is to late for many in the end.