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Ariel

Falcon 50 engine fail light on take-off

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I've got a persistent problem through many updates - but nobody mentions it so I might be the only one!  For take-off I use 90-92% N1 thrust, opening up steadily on the TO run.  Somewhere short of this (80%?) I get a red engine failure warning light for the no. 2 engine.  I've learnt to ignore this and continue - it goes off shortly after.  Performance seems unaffected.  So why?

Graham

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Hi Graham,

It mentions this in the manual, as for the why that I don't know.

 

"14. ENGINE 2 FAIL WARNING (The ENG 2 FAIL light illuminates on ground when the No.2 power lever

is greater than 84 degrees FCU and the No.2 engine power is not more than 85% N1."

Cheers

Martin

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53 minutes ago, Ariel said:

I've got a persistent problem through many updates - but nobody mentions it so I might be the only one!  For take-off I use 90-92% N1 thrust, opening up steadily on the TO run.  Somewhere short of this (80%?) I get a red engine failure warning light for the no. 2 engine.  I've learnt to ignore this and continue - it goes off shortly after.  Performance seems unaffected.  So why?

Graham

This has been discussed extensively here https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/545327-engine-2-fail-light/

Bottom line is that what you are seeing in the sim is an approximation to what happens in the real a/c. As for why it does this, one explanation is that on the takeoff roll, the loss of engine 2 may not be immediately obvious because there will not be any asymmetrical thrust since it is the center engine. The red engine2 fail light, if it stays on, is to warn the crew in time to abort the takeoff.

Al

Edited by ark

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42 minutes ago, MartinRex007 said:

That explains it, thanks Al.

Martin

I think it was Jim Barrett who explained that to me. Jim knows the Falcon 50 'inside and out' and has been a big help to Mark with his knowledge of Falcon 50 operation and systems.

Al

Edited by ark

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The engine fail light illuminates on the real aircraft if the number 2 engine has not achieved 85 percent N1 by the time the center power lever reaches 84 degrees. On the real aircraft, the engines tend to accelerate faster than they do in the sim, so the light typically will not illuminate during initial power application for takeoff unless the pilot firewalls the power lever very quickly, in which case it may come on for a moment then go off as it does in the FSW Falcon.

To alleviate that problem, on the Falcon 900, the engine 2 fail warning does not become active until 10 seconds after the power levers are advanced.

In both the 50 and 900, the fail warning becomes inactive as soon as the aircraft becomes airborne.

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Not directly related to the #2 engine failure light but I continue to see the Take Off Config warning light. Can't see what is causing this. Flaps 20, Trim in the green, anti skid green, power around 97 but not in the red. I don't get why I see that config light.

Have I narrowly escaped disaster and never realized? 🙂

Thoughts please.

Thanks

Rick

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Hi Rick, here is what the manual mentions about the TO/Config warning. Do you have any of them that might not be set correctly?

T/O CONFIG (Illuminates red if aircraft is on ground and any power lever is greater than 84 FCU if any

of the following condition exist: flaps greater than 22 percent; any slat not extended; horizontal stabilizer

(elevator trim) outside of the -3 to -7 range; inboard or middle airbrake panels are not retracted; or the

autopilot is engaged.)

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I had the T\O Config light illuminate--the reason why it did in my case, take off elevator trim was not set properly--noticed that right away and once properly trimmed the warning light went off.

Raymie

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4 hours ago, Wink207 said:

Not directly related to the #2 engine failure light but I continue to see the Take Off Config warning light. Can't see what is causing this. Flaps 20, Trim in the green, anti skid green, power around 97 but not in the red. I don't get why I see that config light.

Have I narrowly escaped disaster and never realized? 🙂

Thoughts please.

Thanks

Rick

Autopilot must be off. And your power lever more than 84%.

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14 hours ago, MartinRex007 said:

Hi Rick, here is what the manual mentions about the TO/Config warning. Do you have any of them that might not be set correctly?

T/O CONFIG (Illuminates red if aircraft is on ground and any power lever is greater than 84 FCU if any

of the following condition exist: flaps greater than 22 percent; any slat not extended; horizontal stabilizer

(elevator trim) outside of the -3 to -7 range; inboard or middle airbrake panels are not retracted; or the

autopilot is engaged.)

Yes Martin thanks. I did see this in the manual and those items all checked and green. Very puzzling.

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9 hours ago, Flysimware said:

Autopilot must be off. And your power lever more than 84%.

Aha! I have the A/P main switch off, but I do pre-select HDG and V/S, so those lights are ON. Could that be it?

Thanks

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Wink207 said:

Aha! I have the A/P main switch off, but I do pre-select HDG and V/S, so those lights are ON. Could that be it?

Thanks

No,

Here is the list from my code that will cause the light to illuminate..

1. Trim not between 3 and 7 percent.

2. Flaps not 20 degrees or slats down.

3. AP on.

4. Speed brakes deployed.

Also the light will not appear until any of the 3 throttle levers are beyond 84 percent and the above is out of range.

=========================

Now to make sure you have not made a mistake. Try Pressing the flaps 1 or 2 times. 0 or 3 will fail. Then move the trim until the light goes away.

I just can't see you having issues after these instructions. Keep us posted.

Edited by Flysimware

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Thanks for the useful replies to my original question, guys.  I had a felling that it might be something on those lines.

Graham

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Ok thanks everyone. My problem turned out to be somehow related to my Saitek hardware. I have seen this before with other aircraft on both of my machines. Before taxi I just cycle the Falcon speed brake control and the problem no longer exists.

Thanks again

Rick

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6 hours ago, Wink207 said:

Aha! I have the A/P main switch off, but I do pre-select HDG and V/S, so those lights are ON. Could that be it?

Thanks

It’s perfectly OK to preselect flight director modes before takeoff - HDG, VS etc - just as long as you do not engage the autopilot lever to the UP (on) position before becoming airborne.

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25 minutes ago, JRBarrett said:

It’s perfectly OK to preselect flight director modes before takeoff - HDG, VS etc - just as long as you do not engage the autopilot lever to the UP (on) position before becoming airborne.

Ok thanks. Would be nice if the A/P would default to current heading and current V/S when engaged. Probably doesn't do that in the actual A/P though, right?. My emphasis is to smoothly engage the A/P during climb so as not to spill the coffee back aft 🙂

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Wink207 said:

Ok thanks. Would be nice if the A/P would default to current heading and current V/S when engaged. Probably doesn't do that in the actual A/P though, right?. My emphasis is to smoothly engage the A/P during climb so as not to spill the coffee back aft 🙂

If you have the heading bug on the HSI set to the current heading (eg, runway heading), and the AP HDG light is on, then when you engage the AP it will hold the current heading. Likewise, if the AP VS  light is on, and if immediately after turning on the AP you engage TCS momentarily, the AP will hold the current VS.

Al

Edited by ark

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21 hours ago, ark said:

If you have the heading bug on the HSI set to the current heading (eg, runway heading), and the AP HDG light is on, then when you engage the AP it will hold the current heading. Likewise, if the AP VS  light is on, and if immediately after turning on the AP you engage TCS momentarily, the AP will hold the current VS.

Al

Thanks Al. That was a great tip on the TCS. Works very well and helps a smooth transition from hand flying on TO to AP.

Thanks again

Rick

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