Drumcode

Drzewiecki's ORD new runway config

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RC isn't reading the new runway configuration, for example I physically taxi to 9R and watching the distance increase in the RC window and by the time I'm there and ready to roll, I'm unable to get the T/O clearance. I've rebuild the db and using the latest version of MakeRwys. Pinging @Ray Proudfoot for some insights on this. 🙂

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Hi Jacek, have you examined the AFCAD using ADE? That might give some insight into which runways are available. Sometimes there are multiple AFCADs and a configuration tool to enable / disable depending on wind.

If you have GSX then open the option to customise the taxiway and see which AFCAD it's using. If you have EFB how does the airport runway layout look? Is 9R showing?

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Thanks for the tips. I'll look into this tonight.

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It is using the correct ADE file for DD ORD. No idea why RC isn't recognizing the new length of the runway. 

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Drumcode said:

It is using the correct ADE file for DD ORD. No idea why RC isn't recognizing the new length of the runway. 

Are both ends closed for takeoff and landing? If they are then I'm pretty sure it gets ignored. If you have EFB does 08R appear? You could zip up the BGL and send it to me at rayproudfoot _ at _ btinternet_dot_com.

Edited by Ray Proudfoot

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Hi Jacek,

Having looked at the AFCAD in ADE there's nothing wrong with 27L / 09R. It has an asphalt surface like 10L / 28R whereas all the others are concrete. Both ends of 09R / 27L are open for landings and departures.

Assuming you have used the latest version of MakeRunways I can't see why it should present a problem.

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I don't have this scenery, so I can't help directly.

Ray--did you look at where the "Start" points are placed on the runways?  It sounds like a start point not placed near the new runway end(s) might be the issue.

Regards

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Hi Bob,

I ran the fault finder and it didn't report that. I would expect it to if they were too far away.

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If I was to send DD the file from which RC reads the position of the runway, which .csv would that be? 

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Posted (edited)

Pretty sure it's r4.csv or r5.csv. But copy the KORD entries into a text file, zip it up and send to me. I have FSDT KORD so the runway coordinates aren't going to be that different.

Edited by Ray Proudfoot

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makerws.exe puts r5.csv into your FS folder. In the batch file that runs after makerwys.exe rc continues by copying files into rcv4/data at that time renaming r5.csv to r4.csv. In rcv4/data check the csv files time/date to insure the batch process completed its work.

 

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Hi Ron/Ray,

It looks like the batch completed as the files in the P3D root directory have recent date/time stamps.

r4 referencing KORD

KORD,0041,41.981750,-87.913834,668,42.440,7497,0,150,-3.000,41.989693,-87.905045,0
KORD,0042,41.953323,-87.899437,668,44.450,8072,110.10,150,-3.000,41.961620,-87.889580,0
KORD,0091,42.002842,-87.926582,668,93.000,7500,111.75,150,-3.000,42.002842,-87.912743,0
KORD,0092,41.984016,-87.918335,668,92.990,7955,110.50,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0
KORD,0093,41.988289,-87.931671,668,92.960,11220,110.90,230,-3.000,41.988300,-87.910965,0
KORD,0101,41.969090,-87.921036,668,92.890,10127,111.10,150,-3.000,41.969116,-87.902359,0
KORD,0102,41.957188,-87.928078,668,92.880,7500,110.75,164,-3.000,41.957211,-87.914246,0
KORD,0103,41.965694,-87.931732,668,92.900,10801,108.95,200,-3.000,41.965721,-87.911812,0
KORD,0221,41.969917,-87.879723,668,224.450,8072,110.10,150,-3.000,41.961620,-87.889580,0
KORD,0222,41.997635,-87.896255,668,222.440,7497,111.30,150,-3.000,41.989693,-87.905045,0
KORD,0271,41.984016,-87.888977,668,272.990,7955,110.50,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0
KORD,0272,42.002842,-87.898903,668,273.000,7500,111.75,150,-3.000,42.002842,-87.912743,0
KORD,0273,41.988312,-87.890259,668,272.960,11220,110.90,230,-3.000,41.988300,-87.910965,0
KORD,0281,41.957233,-87.900414,668,272.880,7500,110.75,164,-3.000,41.957211,-87.914246,0
KORD,0282,41.969143,-87.883682,668,272.890,10127,111.10,150,-3.000,41.969116,-87.902359,0
KORD,0283,41.965748,-87.891891,668,272.900,10801,108.95,200,-3.000,41.965721,-87.911812,0\

r5

KORD,0041,41.981750,-87.913834,668,42.440,7497,0,150,-3.000,41.989693,-87.905045,0,,
KORD,0042,41.953323,-87.899437,668,44.450,8072,110.10G,150,-3.000,41.961620,-87.889580,0,,
KORD,0091,42.002842,-87.926582,668,93.000,7500,111.75DG,150,-3.000,42.002842,-87.912743,0,,
KORD,0092,41.984016,-87.918335,668,92.990,7955,110.50DG,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0,,
KORD,0093,41.988289,-87.931671,668,92.960,11220,110.90BDG,230,-3.000,41.988300,-87.910965,0,,
KORD,0101,41.969090,-87.921036,668,92.890,10127,111.10DG,150,-3.000,41.969116,-87.902359,0,,
KORD,0102,41.957188,-87.928078,668,92.880,7500,110.75BDG,164,-3.000,41.957211,-87.914246,0,,
KORD,0103,41.965694,-87.931732,668,92.900,10801,108.95DG,200,-3.000,41.965721,-87.911812,0,,
KORD,0221,41.969917,-87.879723,668,224.450,8072,110.10G,150,-3.000,41.961620,-87.889580,0,,
KORD,0222,41.997635,-87.896255,668,222.440,7497,111.30BG,150,-3.000,41.989693,-87.905045,0,,
KORD,0271,41.984016,-87.888977,668,272.990,7955,110.50DG,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0,,
KORD,0272,42.002842,-87.898903,668,273.000,7500,111.75DG,150,-3.000,42.002842,-87.912743,0,,
KORD,0273,41.988312,-87.890259,668,272.960,11220,110.90BDG,230,-3.000,41.988300,-87.910965,0,,
KORD,0281,41.957233,-87.900414,668,272.880,7500,110.75DG,164,-3.000,41.957211,-87.914246,0,,
KORD,0282,41.969143,-87.883682,668,272.890,10127,111.10DG,150,-3.000,41.969116,-87.902359,0,,
KORD,0283,41.965748,-87.891891,668,272.900,10801,108.95DG,200,-3.000,41.965721,-87.911812,0,,

I have no idea to tell which one of these records is referencing 9R, but from the looks of it and the distance I have in the RC window to 9R from where I actually am, it's possibly pointing me to where the FSDT's 9R started. 

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7 hours ago, Drumcode said:

Hi Ron/Ray,

It looks like the batch completed as the files in the P3D root directory have recent date/time stamps.

r5

KORD,0091,42.002842,-87.926582,668,93.000,7500,111.75DG,150,-3.000,42.002842,-87.912743,0,,
KORD,0092,41.984016,-87.918335,668,92.990,7955,110.50DG,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0,,
KORD,0093,41.988289,-87.931671,668,92.960,11220,110.90BDG,230,-3.000,41.988300,-87.910965,0,,

I have no idea to tell which one of these records is referencing 9R, but from the looks of it and the distance I have in the RC window to 9R from where I actually am, it's possibly pointing me to where the FSDT's 9R started. 

The way it works is 0091 is 09L, 0092 is 009R and 0093 is 09C. Those lat / lon values look okay. I'll need to look at what entries I have. More on that later.

If you have GSX use the customise jetway option to identify which BGL it is referencing. It shows which near the top-left of the window that opens. It's possible it may not be the correct one.

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Posted (edited)

This is the entry I have for 09R for FSDT KORD...

KORD,0092,41.983898,-87.918358,668,89.990,7955,110.50BG,150,0.000,41.983898,-87.903679,0,,

compared to yours...

KORD,0092,41.984016,-87.918335,668,92.990,7955,110.50DG,150,-3.000,41.984016,-87.903656,0,,

The differences are minimal and I can't understand why it would be a problem in RC4.

You said in your first post the distance increases as you taxi towards 09R. That's the bit I don't understand. Can you double-check? Was that the runway chosen by RC4 or did you select it yourself?

Edited by Ray Proudfoot
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Hi Ray,

If the differences are minimal, that's a concern. DD's new scenery provisions for the expansion of 9R, which adds 3,000+ ft to the length. You can see the map in the link below, DD's scenery is doing so, but whenever I find myself  at the beginning of 9R, RC thinks I am way off. 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/ct-map-of-new-runway-opened-at-ohare-airport-20151015-htmlstory.html

I am going to continue communicating with DD about this. 

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Hi Jacek,

Firstly, that link is not available outside the US. Second, if the runway has been extended then I'm pretty certain you're still picking up the older (FSDT?) one as the runway length is identical in your post and mine. 7955ft.

Did you use GSX to check which BGL it's using?

Reading this notice suggests 09L will be redesignated 09R.  https://www.airport-technology.com/projects/chicago/

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3 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Hi Jacek,

Firstly, that link is not available outside the US. Second, if the runway has been extended then I'm pretty certain you're still picking up the older (FSDT?) one as the runway length is identical in your post and mine. 7955ft.

Did you use GSX to check which BGL it's using?

Reading this notice suggests 09L will be redesignated 09R.  https://www.airport-technology.com/projects/chicago/

I did check and GSX is using the correct file from DD's scenery, the other ADE file from FSDT is no longer on my HD. So here is the question - should MakeRwys.exe be in the root P3D directory or where the scenery.cfg is? I know things have changed significantly recently, maybe I have it in the incorrect directory? 

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Jacek,

MakeRwys.exe needs to be in your main P3D folder. Do you have Lorby's freeware Addon Organizer? MakeRwys.exe can detect it and read all the scenery add-on entries. If you don't then it won't that could explain why RC4 is not using the DD BGL. This can be seen by looking at the runway lengths using ADE.

Note 09R is 11247.7ft long in that one proving RC4 is not using that one.

KORD.png?dl=0

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Posted (edited)

Are the RC's coordinates to the start point of the runway?

I've spent a little bit more time on this tonight. P3D is definitely using the correct ADE for DD's scenery. It is RC that is not reading KORD_ADE.bgl from the scenery directory as it surely is keeping the FSDT's configuration from a while ago. The longitude for DD's 9R is completely different that FSDT's ADE. I loaded both of these bgls into ADE tonight to confirm and these coordinates in r5 file are surely FSDT's.

How does the rebuilding process work when the scenery.cfg and the actual add on scenery files are completely on different drives? I used to keep FSDT's scenery on the same drive as P3D, I think that's what's being cached in the r5 file in the P3D root. I can probably reinstall Chicago and temporarily place it in the P3D Addon directory just for the purpose of scanning and then move it to my usual drive to see if that will take care of the RC's db rebuild. 

Edited by Drumcode

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Posted (edited)

Yes, it will use the start point. But I asked you whether you have Lorby's Addon Organizer installed. You didn't answer. Is KORD installed into an addon folder or scenery.cfg? If the former then without Addon Organizer you won't be able to see where it is in the loading order and MakeRwys won't be reading the BGL. That's why you're not getting the correct entries for RC4.

From memory MakeRwys creates a huge file named Runways.txt in the main P3D folder. Examine that for all KORD entries. Default will be first followed by the DD ones. The location of addon scenery is irrelevant. The paths are stored in either scenery.cfg or in the relevant add-on folder under MyDocuments\Prepar3D v4 Files

Edited by Ray Proudfoot

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Posted (edited)

I only just installed Lorby's AO yesterday, but I'm not really familiar what it is supposed to do. I'll check the runways file tonight after work.

All my addon sceneries are installed on dedicated drive. Add-on xmls in the directory you've mentioned and scenery.cfg in LM's folder in Program Data. I have no scenery installed in the P3D root directory apart from ORBX stuff. 

Edited by Drumcode

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Lorby's utility allows you an overview of the contents of scenery.cfg and all your addon scenery which of course have no entry in scenery.cfg. You can move entries up and down as you wish. Make sure DD KORD is near the top and check there is no entry for FSDT Chicago O'Hare.

But crucially for MakeRwys it scans the contents of your addon folder so will add DD KORD to the files that eventually feed RC4.

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Two things not already mentioned here--first, there's this note from Pete's readme: "Those Prepar3D version 3 and 4 scenery installs abiding by the new L-M system for add-ons will NOT be seen by MakeRunways unless you copy the LorbySceneryExport program from the ZIP into the Prepar3D folder, to sit beside MakeRwys.exe"  This is not the same as having Lorby-SI's P3D Addon Manager installed.

So make sure you not only have makerwys.exe in the main P3D folder, but also the LorbySceneryExport.exe that is included in the same zip file as makerwys, otherwise none of your xml-based scenery is processed by makerwys.

Second, you need to run makerwys as admin for it to work properly with the various P3D xml folders.

Regards

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6 hours ago, w6kd said:

Second, you need to run makerwys as admin for it to work properly with the various P3D xml folders.

Bob, you beauty! That was it! 🙂  I could easily see all the sceneries getting scanned too!

Thanks to everyone for the input! 

KORD,0091,42.002842,-87.926582,668,93,7500,111.75
KORD,0092,41.983891,-87.931648,668,93,11248,110.50
KORD,0093,41.988289,-87.931671,668,93,11220,110.90

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