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Guest Shalomar

Cessna Citation crash in Houston...

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Anyone heard about that Cessna Citation crash in Houston??? If I'm not mistaken isn't that the first crash for this Cessna type since they've been in production. I think this was the same Citation model type Eaglesoft did (if I'm not mistaken)...

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It isnt, actually. A Cessna Citation crashed here in Pueblo a while back with a bunch of Circuit City corporate junkies on it. All died. Unfortunately the media kept trying to lay blame on mechanical stuff and Cessna. The truth of the matter is it was entirely pilot incompetence. They tried to "stretch fuel" and did not stop in Kansas like they should have to pick up fuel.They ran out of fuel on final.The meeting the execs were going to -- would have been better late than never.<> Spelling.

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It's funny I hear Corporate Junkies and private jets I automatically think of unfair working conditions, money laundering, cutbacks on healthcare, and overpaid CEO's. Hard for me to sympathize with these types of people but I guess it's sad when anyone goes down in an aircraft. I really thought the Citation held a record for no aircraft loses, oh well...

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MECHANICALLY it does . . . no records of mechanical failure yet on a Citation. I do not know yet about the Texas incident though, but as for the Colorado one . . .It's when pilots like that are so incompetant that the losses happen. The aircraft was in perfect shape. Just had a couple of hotshots behind the yoke who took risk before safety and thus the result.When the crew is competant, the Citation is indeed one of the safest bus jets out there.

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FOLLOWUP:Here is the story:2 die in small-plane crash at Hobby AirportBy PAIGE HEWITT and ANNE MARIE KILDAYCopyright 2005 Houston Chronicle Two unidentified people died this morning when the twin-engine Cessna Citation 500 they were in crashed at Hobby Airport, officials said.The plane is owned by cardiologist Antonio Pacifico of Texas Arrhythmia Institute, a six-physician practice located in Scurlock Tower on Fannin Street in the Texas Medical Center. Pacifico, 55, is a clinical associate professor at Baylor College of Medicine.He is best known as the cardiologist of former Houston Rockets center Hakeem Olajuwon. In 2003, Pacifico led a group of investors that bought the 50-story Enron building downtown for $55.5 million after the energy giant's collapse.As the small business jet was waiting to take off on runway 22 shortly before 10 a.m., an incoming Southwest 737 issued an alert because of engine trouble, said Tommy Dowdy, district chief for the Houston Fire Department.Response to the Cessna was immediate, Dowdy said, because emergency crews had been preparing for the alert from the pilot of the Southwest flight.The pilot of the Southwest flight witnessed the Cessna crash from about 7.5 miles away from the airport, according to Southwest spokeswoman Paula Berg.The Southwest flight, which left Hobby for Las Vegas at 9:20 a.m. was returning to the airport. About 60 miles into the flight, the pilot declared an emergency because of a high fuel temperature indicator light on board, Berg said."There never was a high fuel temperature on the plane, it was just the indicator light," Berg said.Because of the emergency, air traffic controllers instructed the Cessna pilot to take off quickly.Moments after take-off, however, the pilot of the business jet radioed the tower for permission to return to the airport, Dowdy said.Upon receiving the OK from the tower, the pilot attempted to land the smaller plane, but the craft nose-dived into the runway, burst into flames, flipped and skidded nearly 300 feet, Dowdy said.The aircraft was completely burned, and its pilot and only passenger died at the scene, Dowdy said. The Citation 500 can hold up to nine people.The Southwest flight, meanwhile, was diverted to Bush Intercontinental Airport, where it landed safely, officials said.A witness told authorities that when the Cessna was in the air, it appeared to wobble to one side, which could indicate an engine went out.Berg said she did not know whether any of the 119 passengers on the Southwest flight had seen the crash at Hobby. The airline "ferried" another 737 to Intercontinental airport to take the passengers on a 3:10 p.m. flight to Las Vegas, Berg said.Raytheon Aircraft Services provided hangar services for the Cessna, but it did not maintain the craft, said Raytheon media relations representative Jackie Berger.The airport resumed regular operations around 11 a.m.Operations by Southwest were affected by the crash, Berg said. There were eight flights diverted to other cities, eight canceled flights and 20 flights that were delayed by 30 minutes to three hours, Berg said.The crash marks the second on a private aircraft at Hobby since June 20, when a Cessna 401 landed short of the runway after clipping a street sign and two pickups on Telephone Road. The pilot was not seriously injured in that accident.Last year, the three-member crew of a Gulfstream III were killed on approach to Hobby when attempting to land in bad weather. The jet, en route to Hobby to pick up former President Bush for a trip to Ecuador, clipped a light pole on the Sam Houston Parkway and crashed into a field about three miles short of the runway.---------------------------------------I copied this from http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/topstory2/3441002 for the source. Sounds like pilot error here as well -- the mergency made someone do something a little too hasty -- when the Citation was instructed to "take off quickly" they must have missed something during the takeoff checklist which - emergency or not - should have been run thouroughly. Okay I know I misspelled that somehow.

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I don't follow this to well "Moments after take-off, however, the pilot of the business jet radioed the tower for permission to return to the airport, Dowdy said.Upon receiving the OK from the tower, the pilot attempted to land the smaller plane, but the craft nose-dived into the runway, burst into flames, flipped and skidded nearly 300 feet, Dowdy said."Were there a total of 2 planes involved or are they/you saying that the smaller plane is actually also refering to the cessna CJ?Just a bit confused here. I'm assuming you mean the smaller plane and biz jet are the same.I also gather that that CJ was issued an immediate takeoff clearence due to the incomng SWA 737?Thanks.

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The smaller jet is the CJ -- the larger jet being the Southwest 737 which was diverted to another aiport as a result of the smaller CJ's crash. Basically what happened was 737 calls in emergency . . .Tower tells CJ to basically "get the heck out of dodge quickly" . . .CJ takes off but 737 calls off the emergency . . .CJ has issues and crashes . . .737 and all other flights to the airport are diverted.Quite an interesting little loop there, actually. What I think happened is that once the 737 called the emergency the CJ pilots skipped sections of the checklist and took off with some settings off somewhere, ended up stalling out an engine or something and as a result crashed.That's just speculation on my part, but at the moment it seems like a conclusive logical outlook. Either way looks like we'll have to wait for the NTSB report to be released to know the official verdict.

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I can relate to that. The last time the tower told me "winds--bla bla bla, round the corner no delay, RWY 1, cleared for t/o" I lost an 80 dollar pair of Raybans that were still sitting on the throttle Q...LOL.

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Heheh by the way -- off topic -- OSS Sceneries are addicting . . .Back on topic . . . communication is a key that can make or break almost any situation ESPECIALLY in our industry. That is followed VERY VERY closely by "keeping calm" and "making sure safety is first". Unfortunately we are all guilty of slipping from time to time. It's human nature. But this can be quite the example of what would happen if we REALLY slip at the worst possible time.Murphey's law . . .

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It seems someone in this report screwed up order of sentences. I had trouble reading/understanding it.How about this edited version which simply moves some sentences around:---------------------------------------------------------------Two unidentified people died this morning when the twin-engine Cessna Citation 500 they were in crashed at Hobby Airport, officials said.The plane is owned by cardiologist Antonio Pacifico of Texas Arrhythmia Institute, a six-physician practice located in Scurlock Tower on Fannin Street in the Texas Medical Center. Pacifico, 55, is a clinical associate professor at Baylor College of Medicine.He is best known as the cardiologist of former Houston Rockets center Hakeem Olajuwon. In 2003, Pacifico led a group of investors that bought the 50-story Enron building downtown for $55.5 million after the energy giant's collapse.As the small business jet was waiting to take off on runway 22 shortly before 10 a.m., an incoming Southwest 737 issued an alert because of engine trouble, said Tommy Dowdy, district chief for the Houston Fire Department.The Southwest flight, which left Hobby for Las Vegas at 9:20 a.m. was returning to the airport. About 60 miles into the flight, the pilot declared an emergency because of a high fuel temperature indicator light on board, Berg said."There never was a high fuel temperature on the plane, it was just the indicator light," Berg said.Because of the emergency, air traffic controllers instructed the Cessna pilot to take off quickly.Moments after take-off, however, the pilot of the business jet radioed the tower for permission to return to the airport, Dowdy said.Upon receiving the OK from the tower, the pilot attempted to land the smaller plane, but the craft nose-dived into the runway, burst into flames, flipped and skidded nearly 300 feet, Dowdy said.The aircraft was completely burned, and its pilot and only passenger died at the scene, Dowdy said. The Citation 500 can hold up to nine people.Response to the Cessna was immediate, Dowdy said, because emergency crews had been preparing for the alert from the pilot of the Southwest flight.The Southwest flight, meanwhile, was diverted to Bush Intercontinental Airport, where it landed safely, officials said.The pilot of the Southwest flight witnessed the Cessna crash from about 7.5 miles away from the airport, according to Southwest spokeswoman Paula Berg.A witness told authorities that when the Cessna was in the air, it appeared to wobble to one side, which could indicate an engine went out.Berg said she did not know whether any of the 119 passengers on the Southwest flight had seen the crash at Hobby. The airline "ferried" another 737 to Intercontinental airport to take the passengers on a 3:10 p.m. flight to Las Vegas, Berg said.Raytheon Aircraft Services provided hangar services for the Cessna, but it did not maintain the craft, said Raytheon media relations representative Jackie Berger.The airport resumed regular operations around 11 a.m.Operations by Southwest were affected by the crash, Berg said. There were eight flights diverted to other cities, eight canceled flights and 20 flights that were delayed by 30 minutes to three hours, Berg said.The crash marks the second on a private aircraft at Hobby since June 20, when a Cessna 401 landed short of the runway after clipping a street sign and two pickups on Telephone Road. The pilot was not seriously injured in that accident.Last year, the three-member crew of a Gulfstream III were killed on approach to Hobby when attempting to land in bad weather. The jet, en route to Hobby to pick up former President Bush for a trip to Ecuador, clipped a light pole on the Sam Houston Parkway and crashed into a field about three miles short of the runway.Michael J.WinXP-Home SP2,AMD64 3500+,Abit AV8,Radeon X800Pro,36GB Raptor,1GB PC3200,Audigy 2http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/747400.jpghttp://www.hifisim.com/images/asv_beta_member.jpg

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Aye I just copied and pasted from the web site. I have to say if I were the reporter I would have also gathered more interviews and information before publication. Then again . . this IS a Texas publication. I served down at Ft. Hood while in the Army . . . media from thatstate never impressed me back then either.

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Thanks Chris for the nice comments.I think we might wait and see though what the actual outcome is of the accident.

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>I was at Hood also. Heheh didnt it amaze you how they can take the most beautiful base the Army has and place it in such a cruddy town district?I was in from 94 to 96 and that was my home. 2-5 ADA, 2nd AD (with the patch on the chest -- #### on Wheels), which no longer exists as they merged with 4th ID.As for the accident -- aye most of the thread is speculation until the accident report comes out. Also been checking AOPA off and on to se if they had any input on it.

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I was there briefly for just a few months while we were training a Nasty Gaurd Unit to go to Desert Storm...LOL. The war ended 36 hours later while we were still there. 1991. I got out in 1994. The place is huge. Land of the big PXey...if you get it.

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Hi guys! I live in houston, and sadly, there were 2 crashes this weekend.I know of a crash at Hobby, then there was one at Hooks. The one at hooks, i have hear, was a man flying his grandson, coming from a hunt near austin, and while on the approach, decided a go around, but was to late, and clipped a light pole then a car. Here is the link to the citation..http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/3441710Crash at tomball...http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/3442190Anyways, theres some links for you guys..

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Donny AKA ShalomarFly 2 ROCKS!!!Off topic, but back when no one had as yet died on any model of Citation two mechanics in two separate incidents decided to go for a joy ride. One crashed on takeoff, the other on landing. Both survived. The one who crashed on takeoff was scooped up by the long arm of the law, but not the one who crashed on landing. He could not be charged with theft since there was evidence he was attempting to return the aircraft to its rightful owner.Lawyers at work:-) Best Regards, Donny:-wave

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