>Do you own any of the new Carenado models?>>I do, and the frame rate increases are substantial over the>'ports'.>>That tells me something.Usually means that now that it is exported with the new FXS format and dual MDLs, you'll see a performance increase usually. Using the existing FS9 mesh source files, redoing the animation (if needed), applying bumpmapping textures and specular, checking tne new properties in the material editor does not mean it is a new mesh, just exported using the new compiler. Majority of any conversion is going to be gauge work, but Carenados aircraft are not that complex..Don't get me wrong, I love Carenado and I am real happy to see them going full FSX, just I understand wanting some type of discount for existing users considering so little was changed to bring it up to FSX standards.Regards, MichaelKDFW

Asus A8N32-SLI Deluxe nForce4 SLI-x16 / AMD

>Do you own any of the new Carenado models?As I've already said, I'm not parting with $29 just to own one of the new models and prove to myself that the core mesh/flight modelling hasn't changed.Michael has fully understood the technicalities I've referred to regarding exporting and appears to also understand how charging full price for these 'new' versions doesn't justify the amount of work Carenado has done to make these aircraft fully FSX certified.a really excited user aside, the answer to my original question is that there is not enough difference between the two versions to warrant another purchase and yes, I choose not to buy. Thanks for clearing up any residual doubt on my part.

Micheal, you of all people should understand that mesh is mesh, is mesh, is mesh, period.The differences are that mesh load can be now be lightened and properties manipulated, new texture formats and properties, mapping and draw calls can be reduced along with many other "tricks of the trade" to provide a much improved FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified Product.One fact that is often overlooked by customers is that FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified Products are the only products that will offer forward compatibilty for FS Next. The net result is that an investment in FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified Products now will provide enjoyment thru FS Next while FS9 Portovers will become useless going forward.This is the reason that we've spent nearly two years now rebuilding our products to the new FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified standard.We've even been able to provide no cost Full FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified versions of certain aircraft to those who've purchased the earlier FS9 to FSX portovers.Best value for customers has been and is Eaglesoft goal and it appears other vendors are following suit.

>Micheal, you of all people should understand that mesh is>mesh, is mesh, is mesh, period......Pretty much what I was trying to get across without going into to much detail Ron. I view ESDG products as more detailed and complex than Carenados and it is very obvious you guys are tops and ahead of the curve when it comes to conversions into FSX, your quality and price point prove it, keep up the good work!!Regards, MichaelKDFW

Asus A8N32-SLI Deluxe nForce4 SLI-x16 / AMD

Thanks Mike. It is important that the community understand that an investment in FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified Products means that the transition to FS Next will be smoother than the mess that took place the last time around. A purchase of FSX/SP2/DX10 Certified Product increases future value based on Phil Taylors Taxonomy and all that we know at this time.:-)

The new FSX versions (206, 182RG, dunno about the Mooney) have mirrored the wing textures, which is a big downer for me (European aircraft have their reggos under the left wing...). The FS9 version had both wings fully textured, and indeed the same texture sheets *with both wings* are used for FSX, but only one wing is mapped. :(Two emails to them about the issue, and neither got a reply. For me, this knocks them off their 'premier league' perch, and they are now firmly in the also-rans, with much less chance I'll buy any more planes from them. I was always a big Carenado fan, but no more. It's spoiling the ship for the sake of a ha'peth of tar.Please, devs, DON'T SKIMP ON THE WINGS - THESE THINGS MATTER!!

>I think this is really funny - where else in the real world>do people expect to get upgrades to a purchase for next to>nothing. I am sure that the 2008 Ford **** was a slight>incremental improvement ( maybe?) over the 2007 model, but you>are going to PAY quite a bit to go from the 2007 model to the>2008 model.>>Barry Apples to oranges.Is is VERY common in the software industry to offer upgrades to existing customers at a discount or even for free in some instances where on-going maintenance is involved (MS SQL comes to mind). Anti-virus and financial software are some examples for a home user. Adobe and Autodesk have been offering reduced price upgrades for their (expensive!) software for 15+ years. You don't make any money off of someone who chooses to "make do" with the old version because they don't see enough value in buying the new version at full list to get a few incremental features. By offering that discount, you make a sale where one probably didn't exist by making the expenditure more palatable. Same thing goes for someone who has bought an add-on for FS9 and now has FSX. It does the same thing, but because of changes MS made, it won't work with the new version. Most (myself included) would balk at having to shell out another $30-40 for the SAME add-on, but may not have a problem paying $15 to get the new version. They are better off offering the discount at $15 than getting $0 if the customer decides to sit on their hands.So, to the developers reading this. You can tell someone all day long about how you had to re-engineer this that or the other, but your customers don't see it that way. You have to create value and remodeling something for DX10 from DX9 probably doesn't create much value in the mind of someone who owns the existing product. You either need to offer more in the new product or adjust your pricing for an existing customer. It is much easier for someone in that situation so say "I don't need it" and you've lost a potential sale.

byoungblood,Extremely well put, I think you've hit the nail on the head with that post and fully understood the issue I was getting at.

Yep, exactly the point. Carenado are not adding even adding value, they're taking it away!

Simple-Dont buy it!I bought their fs9 version plus cargo.Added the FSX patch.They wanna sell it to me again.I would rather spend my money on something else.So I bought their 182rg that I didnt have.Done.Same with the big warbird developers.With a few panel edits,they work in FSX/sp2.Some annoying but IMO minor visuals but they work.They are now starting to come out with fsx/sp2/dx10 versions, for a fee of course.I would rather spend my money on something else.So I do.Done.Ive decided that the "possibility" of better performance and visuals is not worth buying the planes again.I would rather try another aircraft or better yet, a new scenery.I have enought planes and helis collecting dust already.Life goes on.Stressing and wasting another minute of your life over this issue is silly.Just dont buy it.Move on.....

Fair comment, good advice - and noted :)

If we want free updates for the future versions of FS, then the prices of the add-ons will go higher. That

>>If we want free updates for the future versions of FS, then>the prices of the add-ons will go higher. That

I've retrofitted most all mine with both RXP GPS units (either the Garmin 430/530) and Friendly Panel 'radio' units as well. Most all of them are pretty flexible.For instance, here is one of my 182 RG configurations:http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/192926.jpg