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ronzie

KMSP from FRF STUDIOS

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If I add (as described in the documentation) the two ils v1.1 files from the included set by Jim Vile, I am getting duplicate offset building structures particularly the SE commuter terminal. Has anyone noticed this?e-mail to the KMSP author from me has been rejected so far by his SPAM filters at his yahoo e-mail domain.I have tried different priority schemes to no avail.If Jim Vile sees this, do you have available just the .bgl with the ils objects only?Thanks for looking.

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Hi Ron, I anxiously tried out this new scenery last night and had the same issues as you. The author suggested in the readme that some people had better results with missing textures by moving the included texture files into the main FS9 texture folder - I tried this, but didn't have any success - they still flickered.Also, last night on approach the active runway was 22 with winds 176 @16 and from what I am aware of, MSP rarely if ever uses 22/4 except for military or big cargo?? I was previuously using Jim Viles "Active ILS" and 22/4 would never be used, although the frustrating thing was if winds were like 250, the 12's/17 would be active instead of 30's/35. Oh well...:)I wish there was a way to better integrate the two files - and with some better framerates. ;-)Regards, KendallDell 8400 3.2 GHZ H.T.3GB 533 DDR2X800XT 256MB/Catalyst driver - 7.1's6x AA/16x HQ A/FDiamond Xtreme/Logitech X-530'sDual Monitor: Dell 2405/1905CH Yoke/Pedals - Saitek Throttle

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If you do not have it, get AFCAD 2.21 (free in the libs here) and install it.In the KMSP scenery folder, which is where I have the AF2_KMSP.bgl file, make a new folder called holds. Copy the AF2 file and then open your holds folder and paste it there to make a safe backup and close the scenery folder.Start AFCAD and select from the File menu open airport. After the country list builds (takes about 30 seconds) in the search box enter KMSP and execute it. In the lower part a stock layer should be listed and only one other on top of it. Double click the upper layer and you'll get the airport diagram.Click on lists, then runways. Don't worry about the short ten foot ones. They are psuedo runways that enable AI to land on multiple active non-parallel runways (called the star or cross runway technique).Click on 4/22, then properties. A dialog box opens. On both ends of 4/22 mark them both closed for take-off and closed for landing, then OK. That should take care of ATC I believe from assigning you those runways.To keep AI from using them, click lists again followed by start locations. Highlight 4, then click delete. Highlight 22, then delete.I think I've got the correct order :).Now click file/save as and accept the current path/file name to insure AFCAD writes the modified one to disk. (There are some weaknesses using just Save and also opening using a recent listed file name. Always use the open airport search).The next time you use FS, the scenery index will rebuild as will the scenery database and you should be good to go.I have not used FS9 ATC for a couple of years (see my tag :) ) but I believe this will take care of eliminating 4/22.I should note that in ATC options you may find the pseudo runways listed. Just ignore them.I am still awaiting hopefully the designers answer to the duplicate buildings question. Perhaps since my e-mail was rejected you can e-mail him at the address in his docs to see what suggestions he has to offer. I'll see if I can contact Jim Vile's attention to take scenery objects out of his ils file.He is over at the projectai site forum.

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I don't know anything about KMSP, but I couldn't find any problems with scenery objects. Perhaps OP could post a screenshot with lat/long shown? I did notice that the default flatten was too big, at least with FSG 38m mesh and UT streams/roads. The flatten extends into the river. So I fixed that.scott s..

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I only have Jim's package, but if you add a new package, the only thing I'd keep is KMSP_ILS_jv.BGL in Scenery/Generic/Scenery. Which is the file that makes the added runway work (that and a proper Afcad). Try that and see the result. And the Afcad explanation sounds good to me. KMSP works well with the three "parallel" runways. If you add 4/22, it's gonna get messy.

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I used v1.1 of the ils file. I also ran it through an analyzer I have and it does show building and other scenery objects in it. I'll try moving it into another folder. The ils v1.1 zip was included in the KMSP package.I'll move it separately into a lower priority folder instead of trying to prioritize it in the same folder. Maybe the KMSP flatten will exclude the buildings.Thanks for your suggestion.

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Thanks for the tips Ron and Mike - I'll give them a try and also shoot out an email the the author. I've tried reducing the .BGL's in the FRF scenery (especially the jetways - these always seem to hog resources) but still get a good hit on frames - anyone else have this too? Regards, KendallDell 8400 3.2 GHZ H.T.3GB 533 DDR2X800XT 256MB/Catalyst driver - 7.1's6x AA/16x HQ A/FDiamond Xtreme/Logitech X-530'sDual Monitor: Dell 2405/1905CH Yoke/Pedals - Saitek Throttle

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As suggested by Fj_Mike I moved the ils file to Flight Simulator 9SceneryGenericscenery and the double buildings are gone. We'll find out if the afd properties stuck. (See Jim's read.me in the ils zip collection.)If the FRF coordinates are the same as default for the runways, then we should be all set. I'll set up some IFR and with an overhead view keep an eye on AI landing.I have not checked for framerates yet but with lots of AI around, there will be a hit, of course.Generally I find the FRF airport scenery OK on FPS as the name implies.Thanks, Mike!

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Glad it worked for you Ron, but I still have the flickering, duplicate textures in the SE area. I dunno...maybe we're looking at different areas - I'll have to look at a map to be more specific. I have been using Mr. Viles' files, for some time now and have always had the KMSP_ils_BGL. in the scenery/generic/scenery folder. Tonight, I removed the flatten and landclass files and the scenery was definately different, but still duplicate terminal textures. My frames were better after stripping out all the jetways, etc but my system has been a sim dog from day one and we're very accustomed to that by now. :-lol Thanks for the help guys.Regards, KendallDell 8400 3.2 GHZ H.T.3GB 533 DDR2X800XT 256MB/Catalyst driver - 7.1's6x AA/16x HQ A/FDiamond Xtreme/Logitech X-530'sDual Monitor: Dell 2405/1905CH Yoke/Pedals - Saitek Throttle

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FWIW I think Jim's "Active ILS" sceneries have always been designed such that certain of his files are to be placed in scenerygenericscenery. If a user choses to place them somewhere else he can, but I think that would be at his own risk and it isn't really fair to complain. Any objects in his file should be excluded by the 5 scenery excludes in the FRF KMSP scenery, unless of course the authors didn't size the excludes properly. The active ILS flatten file is a simple Area16N flatten and shouldn't casue any problems, though I don't use it because I found the default flatten caused problems so I redid the flattens myself, using LWM flattens instead of Area16N. Either way should work though. The LC file simply lays down a couple VTP polys to set the terrain textures.Here's a couple shots of the ActiveILS and the areas excluded by FRF:http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/173042.jpghttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/173043.jpgscott s..

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>I don't know anything about KMSP, but I couldn't find any>problems with scenery objects. Perhaps OP could post a>screenshot with lat/long shown? I did notice that the default>flatten was too big, at least with FSG 38m mesh and UT>streams/roads. The flatten extends into the river. So I>fixed that.>>scott s.>.> The up hill river has always bugged me too Scott, would you mind e-mailing your tweaked flatten bgl to -streiber@yahoo.com- thanks.

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The up hill river has always bugged me too Scott, would you mind e-mailing your tweaked flatten bgl to -streiber@yahoo.com- thanks.

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I agree. I was just trying to keep things organized.Information I had about scenery priority within the same folder being based on ASCCI alphabetic priority didn't seem to work here, that's all.My mistake and I'll heed your words for the future.Thanks for the information.

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I'm sorry I am late to the party. Glad to see so many people are enjoying the KMSP scenery.There will be an update to KMSP V3 coming out very soon. The flickering textures are a design issue and will be addressed. Also, FYI, the new rwy 17/35 in my AFCAD was created using the exact same coordinates as Jim Vile's active ILS.Any other ?'s email to: newmorgan4@sbcglobal.NET or: morganroad4000-frfstudio@yahoo.COMWil

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Thanks for the scenery.As you know, AFCAD can only supply an ILS for the user aircraft but AI will not recognize it for IFR conditions (per Jim Vile's readme and postings on projectai forum). This is why his ils fix file is still required and only in addon sceneryscenery.What function does his lc_ landclass file perform and is it necessary for your scenery?I monitored AI in IMC with a southerly wind and everything worked well on 17/35 as AI departed 17 as well as 12L and 12R.

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Hi Ron, sorry but I am confused. I assume you are you saying that the KMSP_ILS_JV.BGL is the file that needs to be moved to Addon scenery/scenery. The original placement according to both readme's was scenery/generic/scenery, which is where I have it, but it seems to act differently in Wil's FRF-KMSP scenery package. Wil, glad to see you stopped by to take a look - thanks again for the scenery and taking time to respond.Regards, KendallDell 8400 3.2 GHZ H.T.3GB 533 DDR2X800XT 256MB/Catalyst driver - 7.1's6x AA/16x HQ A/FDiamond Xtreme/Logitech X-530'sDual Monitor: Dell 2405/1905CH Yoke/Pedals - Saitek Throttle

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It only worked in the scenerygenericscenery folder correctly as described correctly by the authors. I was questioning if the KMSP_LC_jv.BGL had any effect in there in this application.

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What the "LC" file does, is get rid of some inappropriate urban landclass texture and replace it grass landclass texture (or something approximating that) alos prevents autogen from popping up on the new runway. Note that the KMSP (NOT THE AF2_KMSP) file contains numerous scenery objects. Some of these, such as terminals need to be excluded. This will only happen if the file is at a lower priority than the FRF KMSP files. That's why it should be in genericscenery. I think also this file has the taxisigns for 17/35, so if you don't use this file you won't have these signs even if you install FRF KMSP.scott s..

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Thank you for this information. I was not sure if stacked (by priority) excludes worked. I did think that LC generally stood for land class files. I did not want excludes to exclude excudes :)

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