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WebMaximus

RAID0 vs separate physical disks

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Hi,I have two VelociRaptor 10K disks, what do you think would give better FSX performance - having them configured in a RAID0 config with both Vista 64 and FSX installed on this RAID0 disk set or to split the disks into single non-RAID drives but with Vista on one of them and FSX on the other one thus separated from each other?

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Hi,I have two VelociRaptor 10K disks, what do you think would give better FSX performance - having them configured in a RAID0 config with both Vista 64 and FSX installed on this RAID0 disk set or to split the disks into single non-RAID drives but with Vista on one of them and FSX on the other one thus separated from each other?
Hi,Some info here http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/Ya...?num=1208959973 Scroll down to post titled A NOTE ABOUT STORAGE PERFORMANCE by Nick.

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Thanks alot Ulf, a very informative and interesting thread - will keep what is says in my mind when setting up my new Core i7 FSX rig.

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Hi,You should also check out this "HD Controller" thread a little further down in this forum: http://forums1.avsim.net/index.php?showtopic=241932 and the link near the end of this dicussion as to how to setup a 3ware controller for the best performance. You won't be dissapointed as all information is once again provided by Nick. :( Regards,

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I've setup my sytem in RAID 10 (4 disks! 1TB which was a lot at 3 years ago, RAID10 leaves me up to 500GB) I'm still very content with this. had some disks breaking down (warranty) and the sytem completely rebuid it self. due to a mistake :( it even rebuild it self on 2 of the 4 disks (I was stunned at the time) Hopefully somewhere in a not to distant future I will be able to build a RAID sytem based on SSD's that would be very fast. :( Comming to a point: yes it makes sense to build a RAID system. I'm told RAID 5 works very nicely as well. :(

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Based on my work experience with them, I would not recommend RAID for most people in a home environment. However...WebMaximus you are an FS hardware person, so you can do a RAID and get it properly configured, because you most likely have the know-how, or know where to get it.There is nothing like a properly configured RAID0. Just be sure to backup often. :)On my FS machines (2 of them) I run single Raptors, with FS on the Raptors, the OS on a 7200 rpm drive.

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I've now gotten so far it's time to install FSX on my newly installed Vista installation and this time I decided to try having the Raptors running in non-RAID mode but after running some disk benchmarking I got a little bit hesitant since running in single mode the Raptors clocked in at about 120-130 MB/sec while when I had them configured in a RAID0 (using the onboard RAID controller on my motherboard) the same test resultet in about 220 MB/sec ie almost 100 MB/sec better performance.Do you still think despite this fact having them running in non-RAID but with a dedicated disk for FSX will give me better FSX performance than having FSX and Vista on the same disk but then a RAID0 disk instead consisting of my two Raptor disks?Hope you will be able to give me some quick input because I'm longing to have FSX on my machine again ;-)

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I've now gotten so far it's time to install FSX on my newly installed Vista installation and this time I decided to try having the Raptors running in non-RAID mode but after running some disk benchmarking I got a little bit hesitant since running in single mode the Raptors clocked in at about 120-130 MB/sec while when I had them configured in a RAID0 (using the onboard RAID controller on my motherboard) the same test resultet in about 220 MB/sec ie almost 100 MB/sec better performance.Do you still think despite this fact having them running in non-RAID but with a dedicated disk for FSX will give me better FSX performance than having FSX and Vista on the same disk but then a RAID0 disk instead consisting of my two Raptor disks?Hope you will be able to give me some quick input because I'm longing to have FSX on my machine again ;-)
Benchmark results are only as good in value as the experience in the person reading the resultWhat you were seeing is the burst speed, not the transfer rate, and, most benchmark software use a sequential read test which is also worthless because FSX is a random read/access applicationMy post was quite clear.. 2 drives and dump RAID on motherboard portsWhen you set up a RAID array you set up the STRIPE or BLOCK during the array creation process. That STRIPE or BLOCK size will set the performance of the array based on the average file size of the application to be used. With FS9 the average file size was small and therefore a 64 to 128K STRIPE or BLOCK was fine however with FSX the average file size is 4-5 times that of FS9 and therefore the typical motherboard RAID BLOCK size is FAR too small for the application. A minimum of 256K is required for FSX or the files will be broken into so many small chunks what you are effectively doing is increasing the number of access EACH drive must make to recall a single file, effectively removing and even LOWERING the performance of the storage system... add to that, each time a chuck in called the CPU is polled... double whammyDrop the motherboard RAID and place FSX on its own drive which has a good chunk of free space left after all addons are installed. If you read what I posted in that thread linked above it will direct you accordingly.1st Gen Raptors are not as fast as the 2nd Gen Vraps

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Thanks alot Nick for pushing me in the right direction and also explaining once again WHY it's the right direction. I'm truely looking forward to hopefully see some very nice FSX results this coming weekend when I will also have the time installing my new CPU waterblock so I can do some serious o/c of my new i7 920 :( I will also search for the FSX guide I know you've written and see what else there is to think about when setting up FSX from scratch to make sure you do it the right way.Speaking about Raptor disks mine are called VelociRaptor Icepack if my memory serves me right, I hope they are not considered 1st gen Raptor disks? You never know thinking about how fast your new hardware become old hardware in this hobby...

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You have got the right one! VelociRaptor is the latest generation.

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Just wanted to let you know I have now finished setting my new system up including a watercooled Core i7 920 @ 4 GHz and a watercooled GTX285 together with 6 GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600 MHz RAM and the two VelociRaptor disks (one for Vista x64 and one for FSX) and I followed Nick's FSX/HW setup guide step by step both for all FSX settings as well as using nHancer with all the recommended settings and I can tell you FSX never looked or performed better - I'm stunned!!Thanks for your input and advice guys and special thanks to you Nick for your GREAT guide for how to set everything up in the best possible way!!!

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Just wanted to let you know I have now finished setting my new system up including a watercooled Core i7 920 @ 4 GHz and a watercooled GTX285 together with 6 GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600 MHz RAM and the two VelociRaptor disks (one for Vista x64 and one for FSX) and I followed Nick's FSX/HW setup guide step by step both for all FSX settings as well as using nHancer with all the recommended settings and I can tell you FSX never looked or performed better - I'm stunned!!Thanks for your input and advice guys and special thanks to you Nick for your GREAT guide for how to set everything up in the best possible way!!!
nothin like doin it right.... its really great to read that you are having fun When we put the right parts together and tune everything correctly the result is worth the investment and you now have something that will follow you for a good period of time and you wont be lookin for an upgrade in a few monthsenjoy! :(

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Hello friends,I have 2 150gig Raptors Raid0 in a Nvidia 680i MB, OS is Vista32. The disks are getting full, I would like to upgrade to 2 Velociraptors Raid 0, can you guide me an easy way how to clone the disks ? Thanks,Jimmy

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Hello friends,I have 2 150gig Raptors Raid0 in a Nvidia 680i MB, OS is Vista32. The disks are getting full, I would like to upgrade to 2 Velociraptors Raid 0, can you guide me an easy way how to clone the disks ? Thanks,Jimmy
Don't run a raid off the MB HD ports. Follow the link at the top of this thread and see the storage discussion near the bottom of that link. Raid should only be used with a deicated PCIe dedicated hardware controller such as a 3ware card and at least a 256K stipe and 64K clusters during format. Otherwise, use Raptors or Velociraptors individually, one for the OS, and one dedicated to FS with only a single parition spanning the entire drive. Good luck.

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nothin like doin it right.... its really great to read that you are having fun When we put the right parts together and tune everything correctly the result is worth the investment and you now have something that will follow you for a good period of time and you wont be lookin for an upgrade in a few monthsenjoy! :(
Thanks Nick, true what you say about making an investment which will then offer you lots of joy!However I'm afraid I was a little bit too fast writing my last post because now after some more testing I seem to suffer from the same problem many other i7 users do with stuttering graphics especially when banking at low altitude. I find this very strange since I never had a more powerful and faster computer but I hope I will find the solution to this by trying all the tips like using BufferPools, JobScheduler etc. One thing in particular I will try next is what is better for FSX - having the CPU running @ 4 GHz with HT off or decrease the speed to maybe somewhere between 3.6-3.8 GHz with HT on. I have been trying to make HT on work @ 4 GHz but that seems almost impossible with my CPU. However I should also do some more reading on overclocking the i7 because for the moment I haven't touched anything else other than the BCLK and the CPU voltage and guess there might be other things as well in BIOS I need to adjust to be able to run with HT enabled but still at a high clockspeed.Will report back here if/when I find the solution and until that I appreciate all the tips I can get :(

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Thanks Nick, true what you say about making an investment which will then offer you lots of joy!However I'm afraid I was a little bit too fast writing my last post because now after some more testing I seem to suffer from the same problem many other i7 users do with stuttering graphics especially when banking at low altitude. I find this very strange since I never had a more powerful and faster computer but I hope I will find the solution to this by trying all the tips like using BufferPools, JobScheduler etc. One thing in particular I will try next is what is better for FSX - having the CPU running @ 4 GHz with HT off or decrease the speed to maybe somewhere between 3.6-3.8 GHz with HT on. I have been trying to make HT on work @ 4 GHz but that seems almost impossible with my CPU. However I should also do some more reading on overclocking the i7 because for the moment I haven't touched anything else other than the BCLK and the CPU voltage and guess there might be other things as well in BIOS I need to adjust to be able to run with HT enabled but still at a high clockspeed.Will report back here if/when I find the solution and until that I appreciate all the tips I can get :(
Make sure you have set the BIOS up correctly, shut down the advanced CPU items for clocking and use with FSX, and have correctly load tested using the right software to both test and monitor the temp which must remain below 80c.. I do not have time to post direct instructions.HT has absolutely no use in FSX, none, and that was confirmed. FSX must be tuned for the system. Texture Bandwidth Multiplier Can be between 70 and 90, Bufferpools can be between no entry in the config at all and 100000000 depending on the card. Affinity Mask of 14 or 7 may be of help in cutting down thread collisions which cause stuttersAddons such as UTX and their latest patch for the USA add car traffic which can not be shut down by setting the slider to zero in FSX. To confirm cars are not causing problems in FSX with UTX installed one must disable moving traffic from within the UTX configuration tool. Since the inception of that patch a car traffic setting of 12 is equal to 25 in default FSX. I7 does not mean carte blanche to jack everything sky high especially traffic. The addons, the area and the weather will all contribute to the settings required. Since i7 offers a much higher CPU ability than processors of the past the Vsync frame rate fluctuation issue noted by Phil Taylor and introduced with SP1/2 is seen much more with i7 and therefore locking frames at 25 to 30 tends to be the better choice over running unlimited.

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Don't run a raid off the MB HD ports. Follow the link at the top of this thread and see the storage discussion near the bottom of that link. Raid should only be used with a deicated PCIe dedicated hardware controller such as a 3ware card and at least a 256K stipe and 64K clusters during format. Otherwise, use Raptors or Velociraptors individually, one for the OS, and one dedicated to FS with only a single parition spanning the entire drive. Good luck.
Thank you very muchJimmy

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Thanks Nick, true what you say about making an investment which will then offer you lots of joy!However I'm afraid I was a little bit too fast writing my last post because now after some more testing I seem to suffer from the same problem many other i7 users do with stuttering graphics especially when banking at low altitude. I find this very strange since I never had a more powerful and faster computer but I hope I will find the solution to this by trying all the tips like using BufferPools, JobScheduler etc. One thing in particular I will try next is what is better for FSX - having the CPU running @ 4 GHz with HT off or decrease the speed to maybe somewhere between 3.6-3.8 GHz with HT on. I have been trying to make HT on work @ 4 GHz but that seems almost impossible with my CPU. However I should also do some more reading on overclocking the i7 because for the moment I haven't touched anything else other than the BCLK and the CPU voltage and guess there might be other things as well in BIOS I need to adjust to be able to run with HT enabled but still at a high clockspeed.Will report back here if/when I find the solution and until that I appreciate all the tips I can get :(
Im seeing some reports that disabling HT, leave affinity mask out of the config file and set Texture bandwidth Multiplier to 90 with a frame lock of 28 and bufferpools set to 100000000 on a GTX 280/285 is showing some good results with i7My first impressions with trying it are looking good however I am really limited on time to explore all flight circumstances right now.You may want to bop over to Simviation in the tweaking section and take a look at the threads there

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Thanks Nick for all good advice, already find lots of info on this subject Googling for it and actually one of the threads over at Simviation is already in my IE Favourites to be explored as soon as I find the time for it :-)

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