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FO CDU, PFD & ND Shuts Off When Cutting Engines

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With AP on ( I normally start APU when exiting runway.) and at the gate, with APU Gen "on" when I shut down engine 1 & 2, the ARIDU, CDU and ND, PFD on FO's side shut off, and then it re boots. This happens also if I connect external power.

 

This shut down issue began  after installing SP1 and still happens with SP1B. Before I send a ticket, is this normal behavior ? I am using "Long" panel state, and they are fresh panel states installed with SP1B. Any help appreciated.

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This shut down issue began  after installing SP1 and still happens with SP1B. Before I send a ticket, is this normal behavior ? I am using "Long" panel state, and they are fresh panel states installed with SP1B. Any help appreciated.

 

This is not a normal behavior, but I haven't seen it on my system, which makes me think you're somehow doing something to cause it.  No offense, but I've spent too much time on help desks to rule out the human factor.

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Kyle, it maybe me. But what ? I have been flying the old girl since release, what could I be doing wrong, if APU Gen is on, or External power is connected and confirmed ? I have followed the shut down check list. This never happened pre SP1

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I noticed this too but chalked it up to something I did wrong.  I'll try it out again and report.  

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Thanks Craig. For me, it happens on every flight, and saved ones as well. I don't know why Kyle thinks it is human error in this instance, I would have to depart from the normal shutdown sequence, and 12 months of flying the 777, I think I know how to shut it down, at least by now.

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Badfinger, on 11 Aug 2014 - 5:36 PM, said:

Thanks Craig. For me, it happens on every flight, and saved ones as well. I don't know why Kyle thinks it is human error in this instance, I would have to depart from the normal shutdown sequence, and 12 months of flying the 777, I think I know how to shut it down, at least by now.

Check the ELEC page when switching over to see what it says 

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Check the ELEC page when switching over to see what it says 

Will do on the next flight, thanks Wes.

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Check the ELEC page when switching over to see what it says 

Wes,On engine shut down, I get APU  power from APU GEN to L Main and R Main bus and to L XFR and R XFR bus. No feed to Back up Gen or to L Gen Cntrl and R gen Cntrl.

Main batt:

Volts 27

Amps 0

Same for APU Batt

 

Now when I shut down both engines with APU GEN on, everything powers off ie no power for about 2 - 3 seconds, then I get power from the L side bus, then r side.. other words, a total reboot of all electric power on engine shut down.

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Wes, I get APU  power from APU GEN to L Main and R Main bus and to L XFR and R XFR bus. No feed to Back up Gen or to L Gen Cntrl and R gen Cntrl.

Main batt:

Volts 27

Amps 0

Same for APU Batt

 

Now when I shut down both engines with APU GEN on, everything powers off ie no power for about 2 - 3 seconds, then I get power from the L side bus, then r side.. other words, a total reboot of all electric power on engine shut down.

Can you try a different panel state? 

 

I am not seeing this issue myself after SP1B.

 

What happens if you connect chocks and ground power while engines running, then cut engines? IE leave APU off.

 

Just out of interest.

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What happens if you connect chocks and ground power while engines running, then cut engines? IE leave APU off.

Thanks for reply Wes. Does the same with ground power as well. Will try different panel state tomorrow and let you know.

 

I appreciate you taking the time to help. And not assuming it is human error ( see above ) :lol:

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I strongly suspect a broken panel state. Thats caught me out before. Saved flight panel state was the cause. But it could be a number of things. Try cold and dark and see. I may be totally wrong...

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I just witnessed this today for the first time.

 

When I do an autoland the backup generator converter isn’t closing the right transfer bus breaker after autopilot disconnect. Only after I took the AFDS out of LOC mode by shutting off both F/D’s did the R TBB close. If I disconnect the AP any time before landing the right TBB reconnects the transfer and main bus correctly.

 

I’ve tried all the default panel states with the same result, but I’m surprised more people aren’t reporting this, so I'm wondering if this is something only a few of us are seeing.

Brian

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Thanks for your post Brian, had the same results as you. I am using fresh panel states. Maybe Kyle will test doing an autoland, and see if it does it to him. User error indeed :lol:

 

One question Brian, do you have the autopilot disconnect through a controller ? I have. I will try disconnecting AP with the VC yoke and see what happens.

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Yeah, I have autopilot disconnect mapped to a key command in the PMDG settings, and that key combo assigned to a button via FSUIPC.

 

I didn’t think to try the VC yoke but I did try the disconnect bar after landing to no avail.

 

 

Brian

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Yeah, I have autopilot disconnect mapped to a key command in the PMDG settings, and that key combo assigned to a button via FSUIPC.

 

I didn’t think to try the VC yoke but I did try the disconnect bar after landing to no avail.

 

 

Brian

Ok, will be landing in about 2 hours, so will try the VC yoke, and let you know.

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Ok, fixed.You cannot map the A/P on your controller. You must press the button on the VC yoke.

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Ok, fixed.You cannot map the A/P on your controller. You must press the button on the VC yoke.

 

Not true.  I have AP DISCONNECT mapped to my controller along with AT DISCO.

 

Here's how you do it (beware the slight dose of sarcasm that I think I recall tossing in that video  :ph34r: ):

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I had this problem too. My fix was to shut down engine 2 first, wait a second or two before shuttiing down engine 1, thus allowing time for the APU to take the load.

 

All the best,

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I don't know why Kyle thinks it is human error in this instance, I would have to depart from the normal shutdown sequence, and 12 months of flying the 777, I think I know how to shut it down, at least by now.

 

As I mentioned earlier, I worked help desks for too long to rule humans out completely.  A good number of the time, when I was able to go down and work with the person's issue while observing them, they would assert "I'm doing it exactly [per the manual, as you told me, etc]," but they weren't.  It's not me taking a shot at you, personally.  It's me realizing that people are human, and therefore prone to faults.  That's all.  I didn't say it was absolutely caused by you, but I wasn't going to say it absolutely wasn't.

 

 

 


Maybe Kyle will test doing an autoland, and see if it does it to him. User error indeed

 

I have video of me doing this, but it's pre-SP1.  I'll check again.

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I'm also seeing this now you mention it.  Like Julian, I wasn't sure if it was correct behaviour not.  I don't think it's related to the AP DISCON either.  I would appreciate your further input on this please Kyle and I think Tessa might be onto something regarding the engine shutdown timing and possibly sequence.

 

Tim Gyno

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Ok, fixed.You cannot map the A/P on your controller. You must press the button on the VC yoke.

No problem with that here though.

SP1b

 

I have mapped a button on my yoke via FSUIPC to key stroke Ctrl+Shift+Z (default PMDG key press for AP disc).

And it works perfect here.

Aslo after an Autoland on the runway.

 

How could pressing the AP disconnect switch be any different from using a key press for the same thing??

 

Something is up at your end with that!

 

As for the electrical system:

I never do any autolands so I have not noticed before, but after disengaging the AP (to get of the runway) after autoland just now, the PMDG electrical system stays in its 3 way seperated Autoland mode. (each one of the 3 AP is then powered by a separate power source).

The real 777 elec system will reset back to its normal mode when TOGA is pressed or when the AP is disconnected (you have to disconnect the AP to be able to get of the runway anyway so that should reset it.)

 

So during Autoland:

L MAIN powered by L Gen

R MAIN powered by R Gen

R XFR powered by Backup Gen.

Both Bus TIE breakers stay open and do NOT connect the running APU to the Main busses after landing untill the engines are shutdown (this is normal).

 

in the PMDG777 the elec system stays like this even if I disconnect the AP after an autoland (not normal).

(I have not tried and looked what happens with TOGA for a go around yet).

 

Now in my case, as I shutdown the engines the L and R TIE breaker closed immediately and no displays went black.

So even though the electrical system is not correctly configured here either, I do not have the black screens like you do.

 

You have the TIE breakers in AUTO right and no failures (check TIE breakers on elec synoptics are not amber)?

A far fetched onee would be that your TIE breakers close slower than mine. (makes no sence I know).

But if the TIE breakers were just a bit slower to close that would result in a Battery Only powered state which causes load shedding to drop some displays.

Untill the TIE breakers do close and APU comes online....then all displays work again.

 

Would be interesting to see how your TIE breakers are switching during engine shutdown.

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in the PMDG777 the elec system stays like this even if I disconnect the AP after an autoland (not normal).
(I have not tried and looked what happens with TOGA for a go around yet).

 

Would you mind submitting a ticket on this please?

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Would you mind submitting a ticket on this please?

Not at all.

 

I just thought I would wait a bit and see if and how the OP replies and if he wants to submit the ticket himself (since he discoverd the issue).

But I will if there are no more replies here.

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Not at all.

 

I just thought I would wait a bit and see if and how the OP replies and if he wants to submit the ticket himself (since he discoverd the issue).

But I will if there are no more replies here.

 

Honestly, might as well just submit a ticket if you see something too.  Different perspectives are nice, and often, even the differences in phrasing or experience could help track the issue down.  Please, submit your own.

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With AP on ( I normally start APU when exiting runway.) and at the gate, with APU Gen "on" when I shut down engine 1 & 2, the ARIDU, CDU and ND, PFD on FO's side shut off, and then it re boots. This happens also if I connect external power.

 

This shut down issue began  after installing SP1 and still happens with SP1B. Before I send a ticket, is this normal behavior ? I am using "Long" panel state, and they are fresh panel states installed with SP1B. Any help appreciated.

 

I have the same issue, even following to the letter the steps described in the Tutorial 1, shutdown and secure procedure sections. Haven't submitted a ticket to PMDG yet. This problem is not bothering me too much, so if the solution is found please post it here.

 

Edward

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