A Guide to, Getting the most out of the PMDG 777

[Nyxx 6,993]

Thanks Tony.

 

Brynjar, the NG is not a VAS hungry aircraft like the 777, There is no need to use that for the NG but you should still see a gain as your not loading the model its a 250-300 saving with the 777. If you dont see a gain your end, sorry i have no idea why not.

[wde12 19]

 

 

the NG is not a VAS hungry aircraft like the 777,

 

Dumb question I'm asking here since I've seen a TON of VAS posts, not to mention Rob's update on the 777 memory fix. 

 

What is it about the 777 that is VAS hungry, and why isn't this an issue in the NGX? 

[Fi5kuS 57]

Dumb question I'm asking here since I've seen a TON of VAS posts, not to mention Rob's update on the 777 memory fix. 

 

What is it about the 777 that is VAS hungry, and why isn't this an issue in the NGX? 

 

For me, its the opposite. NGX uses more VAS than the PMDG777.

[Nyxx 6,993]

Many people in the past have posted about VAS in the NG and 777 with SS, never seen anyone say VAS is higher in the NG. Very strange indeed and very odd.

 

@William.

Its not a Dumb question if your new.
With out going into details.

The 777 is properly the best aircraft you can buy in many ways it over shadows the NG. Why so high in VAS? Its simply the price we pay for that level of aircraft. I hope PMDG will find a way to bring that down with the 747v2 because the 777 is really about the max it can be to make it usable within the sim.

 

Complex aircraft come with a cost of FPS and VAS, VAS untill the 777 was not really a problem.

If I fly the 777 i have to be very careful or I get a OOM, with the NG It feels am getting away with murder its so much better in that way.

 

The only other aircraft at this level is the Majestic MJC8 Q400, very good on fps and VAS. It breaks a lot of rules a stunning aircraft, shame I just cannot love it.

[Victoroos 205]

Nice. What great tips!

Just, what is teh zoom value? because I can't see it somehow on the screenshot.. maybe my fault?

As said, it just has so many systems, texture and model quality, that is eats (nomnomnom) you VAS very fast.. I fly very often with process explorer.. to keep an eye on my VAS usage

[~Craig~ 10]

How did I miss this thread?

 

Fantastic work David M - really appreciate the effort this must have took. 

[Nyxx 6,993]

Thanks guys, your welcome.

 

I've always done my own flows etc and wanted to share all the good tweaks that really do work and put them together in one place. Most well read people on here will get Little out of it, but we all can miss a trick or two, so here we are.

 

Enjoy!

 

You cannot see my zoom level as I use the hideinfo tweak. It does not matter what the level is, so to speak just zoom in or out till you get that view.

[~Craig~ 10]

Got a list of 5 things to try (and there was me thinking I knew it all!) from the guide David.  It was worth reading it just to find out about the sound preload (mine was not set to 'none'!).     Bravo, sir.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

I hope PMDG will find a way to bring that down with the 747v2 because the 777 is really about the max it can be to make it usable within the sim.

 

Seeing this is somewhat upsetting (but please understand that - despite quoting you directly here - I'm not aiming the following specifically and only at you). I challenge anyone who sees our aircraft as "the problem" to turn off all of their scenery. From there, add in the various sceneries you use to see the VAS delta. It's pretty extreme in some cases. There are very few scenery developers out there at the moment who are VAS conscious and make high quality stuff without unnecessarily huge texture sizes.

 

Compared to the hits taken from scenery, out aircraft don't take up that much. Moreover, the 777 doesn't take up too much more than the NGX. I think people should sit down and look at this. The issue here isn't so much that the 777 uses more VAS through things that can be controlled. It's more that the 777 flies longer legs. We all know that the sim is notoriously terrible at freeing memory it no longer needs (that HD airport you left 4 hours ago), and VAS usually creeps up as the flight goes on and you fly over more and more scenery. That being said, it's pretty easy to see why - for two exactly similar airports to depart and arrive - the 777 is seen are more of a VAS culprit:

 

Total VAS = Sim Weight + Aircraft Weight + Dep Airport + Arr Airport + (Cruise Cost * Time )

[Cruise Cost * Time metric, of course, is an approximation of the "sum of scenery flown over."]

 

Without even using example values, one can easily see why there is a discrepancy between the two aircraft: the 200LR (and even the 300ER) flies longer legs, on average. Even if everything else were exactly the same, you're more likely to see VAS issues on the 777 because it's being flown on 6-10 hour legs, while the NGX is only being flown 1-4.

 

I'm not saying we don't contribute to OOMs - the product is very feature-packed, and therefore takes a large chunk of VAS itself - but it's pretty upsetting to always see the rock thrown at our windows while scenery seemingly gets a pass. It's not "not us," but it's also not "just us." There's only so much you can optimize while still including the detail we'd like to include, and people know us for. I think it's high time people start making the same demands of the scenery devs, honestly.

[Nyxx 6,993]

I agree Kyle about Scenery devs. The New Split airport coming out looks like it going to have its VAS out side of the sim, it could well be the start of new things. We will have to see. sadly there "soon" is like your    :smile:

 

Also bare in mind my guild is for this very reason and a lot of it is to do with scenery, airports and Sim setting. We are on the same page!

 

Kyle the quote about the 747v2 is, it would be nice to have the extra room the NG brings us. Hoping the 747v2 users less VAS than the 777 is not a dig at PMDG honestly.

 

As for 777v Ng

I don't fly any longer flights with the 777 than the NG. But given the same flight and same setting e.g Bergen to Copenhagen, I cannot do that flight with the 777 (OOM on final) with a LOD of 4.5, 3.5 and am fine all other setting the same. In the NG I can use a LOD of 5.5. That's with all the tweaks/tricks I have in the guild. Sure Copenhagen is a huge/main part of the problem and I totally agree with you about scenery dev's.

 

 

I hope scenery and autogen will also by the sounds of things could change and lighten the load of sim VAS, Orbx have some new tech with HD Trees that are about 10% fps boost and a little lighter on VAS, so hopefully scenery dev will all have to keep a keen eye on there airports etc, because if they become un flyable(OOM) then they become a waste of time.

 

Note: I do understand the tone and what your getting across in your reply Kyle and agree with 95% of it. 

[~Craig~ 10]

There are very few scenery developers out there at the moment who are VAS conscious and make high quality stuff without unnecessarily huge texture sizes.

 

Definitely agree with this statement.

 

In all honesty, as Nyxx suggests, I've avoided all OOMs in the 777 now by taking just two steps;-

 

1. Setting LOD to 3.5
2. Disabling all scenery that won't be used during a specific flight, using Scenery Config Editor.

​Taking these two actions, I've actually been able to increase the settings I was previously using with the 777 (and sometimes getting OOMs).  I've increased autogen a little, and AA.

 

People sometimes get hung up by the numbers.... urgghhh! LOD set at 3.5 no way! ..... but seriously, try it.  When you're flying the 777 it's more about the aircraft and I really cannot tell much difference with the LOD change;  especially with some good Opus weather going on.

[Fi5kuS 57]

But given the same flight and same setting e.g Bergen to Copenhagen, I cannot do that flight with the 777 (OOM on final) with a LOD of 4.5, 3.5 and am fine all other setting the same. In the NG I can use a LOD of 5.5. That's with all the tweaks/tricks I have in the guild. Sure Copenhagen is a huge part of the problem and I totally agree with you about scenery dev's.

 

 

I have noticed something peculiar with the FlyTampa Copenhagen scenery in P3D, contrary to FSX. If I load up either aircraft on say 04L, the nose and camera will point away from the airport itself. However, if I turn the camera against, or enters the runway thus facing the airport directly, VAS increases 400 MB - just by looking at it. I think its strange since I'm already loaded up and sitting next to it. Sometimes these 400 MB disappear after departure and sometimes don't. Needless to say, an OOM is of course right around the corner if departing with this extra VAS load.

[Nyxx 6,993]

People sometimes get hung up by the numbers.... urgghhh! LOD set at 3.5 no way! ..... but seriously, try it.

Within FSX(dont use anymore) I had LOD at 6.5 and 4.5 was a step backwards. Within P3D 4.5 is my norm and imo looks as good as 6.5 did in fsx, within P3D I find 6.5 to be a waste of time I get better texture loading with 4.5 and like you said even 3.5 looks fine.

 

Copenhagen is not on my "best" airport list Brynjar, its not even on my 777 airport list anymore. I love UK2000 airports, don't have flightbeams looks or Copenhagen looks but they lol at "VAS".

I see no point in modelling the inside of an airport with signs to the Toilets. 

[Artur Munteanu 1]

Hi David, I follow in some points you're guide, good job. There are still some point's wich are not so clear for me:

1. Does the REX4 tip improve somehow in any way the global FSX memory or is just a tip for nice weather?

2. Which is you're opinion about using DX10 with fix or DX9, because you didn't talk much about this in you're guide. What do you recomand for you're guide, DX9 or DX10 in FSX?

[Nyxx 6,993]

1) Its a Tip all in the title "a Tip to get the most out of REX4" most people use a set they like and that's it. But using the weather to generate it, its is so nice, I did a flight that went into dusk last night and It had a yellow hue really nice and subtly, I really like how you can make each flight look/feel different by using this feature. Its just a tip for enhancing your flights.

 

2) Don't use DX10, I know some people say it help with VAS but when i tried it with the fixer on by two screens it was a mess. IMO DX9 is the safe way to go.