I usually fly GA aircraft but I'm thinking of trying out something more commerical. I have no problem with the more sophistocated GA aircraft (Aeroworx B200, F1 PC-12, etc.), and I know my way around the GNS 430/530 quite well. However, I've never used an FMC/FMS.So my question is: What commercial-aviation add-on would be best for me to start with? Right now I'm considering the DF ATR 72, the PMDG 737 (or maybe the 747), the Level D 767, and the feelThere ERJ. Which one of these would be easiest to jump into and learn my way around? I'm not only looking for a good add-on, I'm looking for something that's easy to figure out with good tutorials and support. Besides the ones I've listed, are there any others I should consider?

hello,I have a lot of FMC capable addons. I learned to program the PSS airbus first but would now say my best learning experience since is the PMDG 737 series. I can now set up flights on all of my FMS systems including my Project Magenta systems (airbus and 737/747).If you weant to really learn about the FMS systems, you really have to read the manuals over and over!. Just loading a flight plan from the FS2004 system isn't the answer (although after a while, you may do it a lot to speed up things).I'm only a sim pilot but have really learned a lot from these systems. The Forums have been a great help but you really have to read the manuals a lot to get and keep the knowledge.Good luck,Ron SagelNEAR KCHS

well i own all of the above except the feelthere erj, so keep in mind that the stuff i tell you below is relating to only the 4 you mentionedso... its a tough call, i would suggest the F1 atr72, that is really great as all the others you mentioned - they all have great support - the dox are great, they have this section that has a walk through for a flight that explains what you do and then WHY you are doing it, however the ATR probably has the largest manual ive ever seen, i believe its around 300pages if i remember correctlynow after i say all of that, it is/has some different/unique ways of doing things, so that if you would want to move up to the boeing line (pmdg 73G, 744) and the LDS 763 it might be a little tougher because it wont near be like firing up the atr. so with that said, if you start with the pmdg 73g and really learn that well, moving up to the 763 then the 747 would be a lot easieri personally like the LDS 763 is my favorite - it is fairly quick to get going - even without cheating, going through the checklist, it "flies" great, very smooth and i get better smoothness/fps on my machine than the pmdg 73G, however, all our great...ciao!Brian S

Concur with that, except to say that I have the ATR, PMDG 737 and the Level D 767, and I 'd say that compared to the size of the learning curve up to ANY FMC, the differences BETWEEN them are relatively small.All are great (although have to say I think the 767 has a slight edge) - and all have strong enough flight models that they can be hand flown (with difficulty in my case!)I think you'd be best to think about what kind of flying you want to do, how much of a change you want to make.The 767 is the 300ER and feels a bit embarrassed doing flights of much less than 3 hours and is probably happiest going trans-Atlantic - although one advantage it has is that you can save flights and restart where you left off, which the 737 can't do.The 737 is perfect for serious 1 to 2 hour short-haul flights where you don't have time to get bored in the cruise.The ATR is great for short hops at altitudes where you can still see some of the ground, be concerned about the clouds and fly into a multitude of regional airports. However, maybe it's not much of a step up from what you have been doing apart from the technology - maybe a good thing, maybe not.

Hello All, For being a non-FMC pilot most of my life, learning FMC's came rather late in life for me, as I am one of the holdouts who likes to fly the aircraft rather than let the computer do it. Sayint that, with the exception of the new PMDG 'Queen' all can be flown without heavy programing of the FMC.I'd have to say i my opinion, the ATR or the Level D 767 are the best -- the PMDG will get there after a patch to get all the little quirky bugs worked out, but presently those two seem to top my list.Best,Clayhttp://www.dreamfleet2000.com/gfx/images/F...ers/Dopke01.jpgClayton T. Dopke (Clay)Major, USAF (retired)"Drac"

I have both the ATR and the 737 NG and have been flying the 737 much more lately on Vatsim, due to the FMC having more capability than the ATR FMC. After all the patches, my 737 seems to be relatively bug free. It appears that now that the 747 is released, the 737 won't get too much more attention from PMDG. Probably when the MD11 is released, the 747 will suffer the same fate.

Of those which you have listed something like the ATR-72 sounds like a good step forward. I haven't tried the DF version but you will probably see some similarities between that and what you may have already flown. Maybe the PSS Dash-8 would be nice too, prop which you might be used to but has plenty to keep you busy including a FMC plus it only costs

Well the ATR may be the best along with either the PMDG73 or 744.The LDS 76 is fantastic buts its SID/STAR database is extremely incomplete and in need of much work.For a first up the ATR FMC is a little tricky to learn and not as user friendly as the others.The NG and 744 are great.Take your pick.Darren

Why can't you fly the 767ER routes shorter than 3 hours? Cargo companies such as UPS do it all the time

Thanks to everyone for their responses.Right now I'm leaning towards the F1 ATR or the LD 767. I would really like to try the PMDG 737 series, but to get the whole deal you have to buy two packages and that's nearly $80. In my opinion that's excessive, although I fly Southwest several times a year and am really interested in trying the 737 so I may cave in and get it anyway.Regarding short hops with big planes, I think that's pretty common in places like Japan where they need to move a lot of people but don't really have all that far to go. I personally have flown on a 747 from Las Vegas to Los Angeles, which is less than an hour flight (JAL has service from Las Vegas to Tokyo with a stop in Los Angeles on the way over).

doesn't navdata have a sid/star update for the LDS?

Hi AlIts very limited with only a small portion of the worlds larger airports covered.For instance there are virtually no SIDS or Stars for Japan,Australia etc.There are quite a few now done by people but it is a royal pain to insert them into the XML file with a good chance of having to start again each time you do an update.Given the quality of the aircraft the FMC database issue is a major disapointment for such a great aircraft.DArren

Don't forget the great Feelthere ERJ-145. This is a jet that has a lot of the flying stuff automated, so it gives you time to work the FMC. The FMC itself has more than enough features to really learn working the FMC.The jet itself is small and regional so no long boring flights, but still enough to fly 1500 NM (Dallas-Seattle?)Don't go for the PSS Dash, it's outdated. If you like a real tough professional machine take a look at the MAJESTIC SOFTWARE - DASH 8Q 300 (http://www.majesticsoftware.com/) although a rather steep price it gives you plenty of time to enjoy and learn:The vendor site boasts the following features:-Every edition includes a close to 100% correct airplane system simulation -Every aircraft panel, used for the normal operation with almost every possible switch simulated. -Advanced FMC with the waypoint and terminal database, holding function, Direct To and PVOR maneuvers . -Virtual cockpit with animated handles and wipers. -(first time in MSFS) Animated prop blades angle in both standing and running modes -6 liveries - Tyrolean Airways, Air Nostrum, Austrian Airlines, Liat, Lufthansa, British Airways -Pax loader application which allows loading the plane in every possible way, and provides the feature to move the Center of Gravity as desired by the user. -(first time in MSFS) Remote Control Station (REMCL), provides the monitoring of every aircraft system and allows the selected failures (the number of allowed failures are edition dependant). -(first time in MSFS) Simulated in a custom way, DirectX based sound engine, which does the close to real sound simulation for the propellers, engines and the environment. -(first time in MSFS) Simulated in a custom way Powerplant logic, that utilizes our custom made prop blades pitch control algorithm, and gives the close to the real - engine indications, powerplant (engines and propellers) behavior and performance -Close to real air dynamics and airplane performance, tested thoughtfully by a team, consisting mostly of the airline pilots and Dash 8 technicians. -The real weather radar, utilizing the fs2004 NWI (New Weather Interface) and creating an accurate representation of the weather within the desired range, from both World Real Weather, fs2004 own weather or any weather controlling addons. -Fully integrated with SquawkBox 3.0 including the Transponder modes, COMs and Audio panel. -Entertainment and announcements module with built in MP3 player and recorded cabin announcements. -The through documentation consisting of 70 pages describing the function of every airplane system as well as the practical notes on usage. The quick start guide is also included to simplify the initial training. -Discussion board and email support by our support team. Detail, details...In any case I like the Feelthere ERJ-145 a lot :)Rob "Holland&Holland" de Vries http://www.emotipad.com/emoticons/Flying.gif"To go up, pull the stick back. To go down, pull the stick back harder"

Good products have their price, and they're worth it, believe me. Look what Project Magenta takes for their FMSs only!Andreas

Well, strictly speaking there isn't a cargo version of the Level D 767, although you will find some repaints for cargo airlines.No, I don't fully understand what that means either, but it's true!