>Is anybody at Avsim, willing to look closely at this lot, as>the last thing we need is another bunch of freeware pirates.Not quite with you here, DC. All files on their site appear to be freeware, available as freeware. If an author expressly states - as perhaps you do in your EULA - that files are not to be uploaded to any or that particular site, well there's a reason for complaint - but otherwise freeware is freeware. Where's the piracy? Maybe I'm missing your point, so no flames please.MarkMark "Dark Moment" BeaumontVP Fleet, DC-3 AirwaysTeam Member, MAAM-SIM[a href=http://www.swiremariners.com/cathayhk.html" target="_blank]http://www.paxship.com/maamlogo2.jpg[/a]

I cannot believe the challenges you are receiving over there. It is as if an author's demands are just meaningless words, and they have more rights at your work than the author does. Hang in there buddy! Don't let 'em get ya down! ;)Don

Hi MarkNo flames, not my game!Are you then saying that I could go through the Avsim file library and download files at my liberty for hosting on another site?Due to recent freeware piracy (Ebay, FSPlanet etc.) many file providers, like UGA, have chosen to restrict distribution of their work.The vast majority of files are uploaded to Avsim as freeware (with limited distribution). The reason for this is purely so the author has the right to choose which site holds the file. Surely the distinction is clear from unlimited ditribution rights?The UGA file concerned, clearly states not for redistribution, yet it was still plundered.Just how many file providers have willingly allowed FS2004.com to host their work, or to put it another way, how many don't know that FS2004.com is hosting their work?

Hey Don!Good to hear from ya, old boy!:-) They've removed the file, but still insist they had my permission to host it! Silly boys!I ask everybody, who has uploaded a model, repaint, scenery, or Afcad recently to Avsim, to have a look through the FS2004.com library. Did you also give permission to the FS2004.com owners to download it from Avsim and host it as well?

Howdy,Geeze. What a storm in a teacup.As I see things:(i) the file has been removed and an apology has been issued.(ii) actually, there were some very serious questions asked re: the EULA which you chose to ignore and then proceeded to denigrate the questioner. (iii) personally, I consider the EULA unnecessarily restrictive (even given the current climate). Of course, it's your perogative to issue such stipulations. (iv) I suggest you read up about "plaigarism" ... there was no attempt by the offending site to pass off your work as their's. It was appropriation.All that being said, I guess some people just do not know when to stop flogging a dead horse.

Just went over and read the thread. I'm amazed that the replies were as polite as they were. I have known Kewlceo (Rick) and worked with him for a little while now, and I can assure you that he never intended to harm you in any way. He is my friend. Knowing him and having read his previous threads, he takes files that he thinks are excellent, uploads them, and tells his community how good he thinks they are.Plagerism? I think not. No one took credit for anyone's work. Yes, your file wound up on fs2004.com in clear violation of your very restrictive EULA and yes, this was wrong. I frankly think, though, that you owe them an apology for the inappropriate and inflammatory way you went about handling this affair - both here and there. This is only my opinion and in no way do I speak for AVSIM or FS2004.COM.I would be flattered if someone thought my work was good enough to put in their library and announce to other simmers.Regards,Paul(edited for spelling)

I think this is a little bit overexagerated. fs2004.com is a great site as is avsim. If you released this file as freeware for any individual to use why does it matter where they downloaded it from.I feel that people that brew stuff up like this ultimately hurts the whole flight sim community.I however dont agree with people taking freeware files, putting them on a cd and selling it off to others. Thats just ot right. Or like that one incident with DSB design, That is not right either.Just my 2 centsP.S I am not affiliated with fs2004.com or avsim.com. Im just a big fan of both sites

Here is my take after reading the thread, first off I agree with the EULA, while maybe a bit restrictive, David has that right, especially since it represents many others that contributed to the package and in light of many other sites/people ignoring EULAS most of the time anyway. I do feel he come on quite strong on the forum and should have handled it differently and I think Coffee handled the thread quite well by locking it and listing the appropriate actions to be taken and stating the lack of affiliation of the rude forum members.To be honenst I have seen other posts in the past from users who have had files uploaded to this site without permission which seems to be the issue. Personally with the limited number of people in this community (compared to others) and the existing sites already, I fail to understand why more sites need to start up, not enough files to go around and many authors want to have some control on where their work goes.Regards, MichaelKDFWhttp://www.calvirair.com/mcpics/mcdcvabanner.jpgCalVirAir International

Hi.If a Commercial developer would have had his software taken, without consent, I am sure the opinions would have been different. The fact is that the author has the right to put any restrictions on his property, and it does not carry any less weight than a payware. I am not sure what DC said on the other site, but the other site

David:Thanks for the link.I was unaware of this site.Wilson

I immediately lose respect for any site that has a "You have won our hourly prize" ad jiggling around.Respect factor for FS2004.com: -1000.James

Thanks to those who offered support on this.I knew there would be a couple of people who do not see a problem with what FS2004.com have done! That attitude in this community is hardly encouraging to the thousands of freeware developers out there. Perhaps, if the product had a price tag on it, the response would have been different.Does a freeware developer not have the same rights as a commercial developer?Ok, plagiarism was the wrong word, bit read on and you may understand my anger with this lot. Storm in a tea cup it ain't!!I contacted them privately 10 hours prior to posting in their forum and nothing was done with regards to the file. Obviously, my posting got the file removed. A direct approach I know, but effective.The site owners have so far failed to apologise.

Ah the power of Firefox and it's marvelous extensions.I see no jiggling ads. :D-Jeremy BurchThe Ozark DogfighterHappy Flying!Pilot-The friction locks are causing the throttle levers to stick.Mechanic- Umm, that's what they're there for...

I understand your frustration over this, clearly you have as much right over your own files as a commercial developer.However, I personally would have given at the very least 24 hours for them to respond. It's a 24 world after all, and that is if they check emails on a daily basis.I have a top ten of FS sites that I visit, and FS2004 is one of them. Perhaps you could try to see things in a less harsh light? They did remove the file, they could have taken a route similar to FSPlanet in that regard, perhaps it was just an oversight?But even if they blatantly ignored your EULA, you could have at least given 24 hours to respond. -Jeremy BurchThe Ozark DogfighterHappy Flying!Pilot-The friction locks are causing the throttle levers to stick.Mechanic- Umm, that's what they're there for...

Greetings all!As usual, the issue gets obscured by people who are not sufficiently familiar with copyright legislation. In short: only the author (of freeware, payware, shareware or whatever "ware") owns the right to publish his work. Unless this right is explicitly waived, EVERY publisher (in our internet world: website) needs the explicit permission of the author to publish/post.Publishing without such permission is violating the authors copyright. I am astonished at the amount of people in the flightsim world who have no objections at all against violating this right. In fact, copyright is an "immaterial possession", it is OWNED. If ownership means so little to so many of you, I wouldn't like to invite y'all to my home. Within a few hours I might find it empty.Be well!Jaap Verduijn.