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Don Quixote

Poor sounds?

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Hi,

 

I've just bought the DC-6 and, to be honest, my first impressions are somewhat mixed due to a number of things. The biggest issue right now are the sounds:

 

a )  Sound is non-directional in the cockpit, i.e. when turning your head/view everything sounds exactly the same. Is this intentional or a bug?

 

b )  The engine sounds are present, but very quiet - what I hear is mostly what appears to be the props. The result is a loud but thin "whirring" sound instead the roar of the big engines. It seems that the sounds are exactly like in this preview video from last year:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXnUEjgKfcU

 

However, they are nothing like in the sound preview vid from earlier this year:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0qOndg0ro8

Was this changed for some reason? As it is, the engine sounds are very weak, even on takeoff. Also, the startup sounds are pretty much inaudible from the cockpit (although this may be realistic, perhaps).

 

I'm on Win 10 64bit, XP10.45, all sounds settings in the sounds menu are set to 100%.

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Is this intentional or a bug?

 

Intentional.

 

 

 


The engine sounds are present, but very quiet - what I hear is mostly what appears to be the props. The result is a loud but thin "whirring" sound instead the roar of the big engines. It seems that the sounds are exactly like in this preview video from last year:

 

Sounds like your sound is not properly set up in Windows and/or X-Plane.

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Thanks for your reply Kyle.

 

Intentional.

 

 

Well that's disappointing.

 


 

Sounds like your sound is not properly set up in Windows and/or X-Plane.

 

Are there any recommended settings for the sound? I couldn't find anything in the manual, although admittedly I only skimmed through it. Currently I have the settings at 100%:

MX7G8C4.jpg

 

I don't have any sound issues with other aircraft, so I believe it's something to do with the above sound settings (which, I believe, are individually set for each aircraft in X-Plane) or the DC-6 itself.

 

Edit: I've tried changing some of the sliders, such as reducing the "props" sound, but it doesn't seem to have any effect. Only the "engines" slider changes the overall volume, but doesn't change the overall composition of the sound.

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Well that's disappointing.

 

Thanks for the feedback. All the same, I challenge you to find a better soundset for a radial out there with such dynamic independent mixing for prop and power...

 

 

 


I don't have any sound issues with other aircraft

 

Likely because they're not going to the levels we've gone with our sound here, despite the lack of directionality currently. Do you have a default device selected in your Windows sound settings?

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Hi Kyle,

 

Thanks for the feedback. All the same, I challenge you to find a better soundset for a radial out there with such dynamic independent mixing for prop and power...

 

 

No need for a challenge, although the A2A B377 and the freeware C-47 by Manfred Jahn are pretty damn good (yes, both for FSX, and probably not as accurate as the DC-6, but still). :smile:

But anyway, I'm just wondering why the sounds I'm hearing are so different from the "sound preview" video, but very much like the earlier preview video. It seems like something was changed for the later video, but then changed back to an earlier state for release - it may be intended that way, just wondering about the differences.

 

 

Likely because they're not going to the levels we've gone with our sound here, despite the lack of directionality currently. Do you have a default device selected in your Windows sound settings?

 

Yes, I have set up my sound settings in Windows (using an Asus Xonar ST sound card) to stereo (2 speakers), 44.1 KHz sampling rate, 16 bit. I've also disabled any "sound enhancements" like EQ, Dolby virtual speaker and such.

 

I've tried speakers as well as headphones, the result is pretty much the same. Using headphones, where it's possible to hear different sounds more distinctly, it's evident that the "roaring" engine sound is present, just very quiet compared to the "chopping" sound of the props. Possibly I'm wrong, but it seems more like a design choice rather than some faulty settings...

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but very much like the earlier preview video.

 

These were artificially lowered for the duration of the video through the mixing of the inputs: the onboard audio was turned down to about 5-15%, with the microphone at 100%.

 

 

 


It seems like something was changed for the later video

 

Kinda, but only because as mentioned in the video: the sound was turned down initially to speak without shouting over the sounds, and then the sound was turned up.

 

 

 


Possibly I'm wrong, but it seems more like a design choice rather than some faulty settings...

 

Definitely not a design choice.

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I'm not saying that this needs to be changed/fixed, but at least for me the issue is pretty much solved.

 

People really shouldn't be editing their sound files, so I'm going to be hiding this. Glad you've found something that works for you though.

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Fair enough - I can understand that you don't want people editing stuff and then complaining that "it doesn't work anymore!" :P 

Happens all too often. Anyway, with the sound issue out of the way I'm starting to enjoy the DC-6, it's a mighty fine aircraft despite a couple of issues. 

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People really shouldn't be editing their sound files, so I'm going to be hiding this. Glad you've found something that works for you though.

 

Users modifying payware aircraft to their liking have a long tradition in X-Plane (after all, a lot of aircraft still are mostly done in PlaneMaker, and there are still many aircraft using the SASL plugin with unencrypted .lua files), so it was to be expected that descriptions of user mods arise very soon :-) But I understand the support issues that can arise from that (and maybe also copyright issues; each developer handles such things differently).

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Users modifying payware aircraft to their liking have a long tradition in X-Plane (after all, a lot of aircraft still are mostly done in PlaneMaker, and there are still many aircraft using the SASL plugin with unencrypted .lua files), so it was to be expected that descriptions of user mods arise very soon :-) But I understand the support issues that can arise from that (and maybe also copyright issues; each developer handles such things differently).

Yeah, it's seemed to be more of the "do it yourself" type. All the same: if it's modified from its original state, we can't really offer support for it since it adds other complexities from the change itself.

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Dear all,

 

Before modifying the actual files please set the correct volume levels in the sound options.

 

We recommend the following settings:

 

Engines                          50%

Com Radio (AFE)          80%

Avionics Fan (Panel)    50%

 

 

 

 

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Are the sounds going to be directional? Hear the same noise in the cockpit and in the tower view, is disapointing. And more disapointing when this product costs 70$...

 

Welcome to the forum. Full names - first and last - are required here.

 

I'm kinda baffled that we can provide one of the most realistic sound sets out there for an aircraft, but we're catching flak for not setting up the sounds for some kitschy fly by stuff. Having flown in radials of the Douglas ilk for a few years now, I can honestly say that there is no better sound set available.

 

I mean, I can kinda see a little disappointment, but people are getting ravenous about this.

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I'm baffled that you're baffled over this:-) No matter how good anything is, ppl will always find something that makes it "not worth the 70$". You could be a doctor finding the cure for AIDS or cancer and someone would blame you for taking away jobs from global pharmaceutical corporations...its just how it works:-)

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I'm baffled that you're baffled over this:-) No matter how good anything is, ppl will always find something that makes it "not worth the 70$". You could be a doctor finding the cure for AIDS or cancer and someone would blame you for taking away jobs from global pharmaceutical corporations...its just how it works:-)

 

Logikken er grei, men rimelig kynisk.  :P

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Having flown in a real DC6 for 1 time 4 years ago (behind the engineer). Believe me... you think the soundset is bad because you know it better? Think of like "the other's do it bad"! Imagine a american on a english street "One ghost driver in news? I see MANY of them"...

I love it. Hearing the wind of change while in cruise? The prop's doing it's work? It's amazing.

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Steve was only expressing an opinion/question about something via a forum. No reason to feel dissapointed or baffled about it.

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Steve was only expressing an opinion/question about something via a forum. No reason to feel dissapointed or baffled about it.

 

Except that I care about the product we delivered, and I want to know where the source of this criticism can be found. I'm not sure why one would think someone on a development team would stand idly by...

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Except that I care about the product we delivered, and I want to know where the source of this criticism can be found. I'm not sure why one would think someone on a development team would stand idly by...

 

We all care about the product you delivered. If we didn't, I don't think we'd be here.  This is the most active I've ever been on this forum, and it's strictly because I love PMDG, and X-Plane.  

 

I think why some people are disappointed about the sound is this:  If you're in the cockpit with the windows closed, everything is AMAZING.  But when you open the window, or go to an exterior fly-by view, the amazingness (is that a word?) of the sounds end there.  That's all it is, and that breaks immersion for some people.  Other aircraft do directional sounds, and raise and lower the volume/wind noise depending on the windows that are open (Dreamfoil's Bell 407), so the bar has already been set, this is one bar PMDG didn't reach.  I'm not "ravenous" about it, in fact, I just won't open the window or use fly-by view in this plane.  But it's an observation that I made.

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We recommend the following settings:

 

Engines                          50%

Com Radio (AFE)          80%

Avionics Fan (Panel)    50%

 

Thanks for posting this information! I've now uninstalled the DC-6, re-downloaded and reinstalled it and set up these recommended settings. Unfortunately, without any noticeable changes.

 

 

 

 

I'm kinda baffled that we can provide one of the most realistic sound sets out there for an aircraft, but we're catching flak for not setting up the sounds for some kitschy fly by stuff. Having flown in radials of the Douglas ilk for a few years now, I can honestly say that there is no better sound set available.

 

 

Having flown in a real DC6 for 1 time 4 years ago (behind the engineer). Believe me... you think the soundset is bad because you know it better? Think of like "the other's do it bad"! Imagine a american on a english street "One ghost driver in news? I see MANY of them"...

I love it. Hearing the wind of change while in cruise? The prop's doing it's work? It's amazing.

 

Guys, have you actually read my posts? Nowhere did I state that the sounds were bad, that they were not realistic, or that I knew better how it should sound. I did express my disappointment that they were non-directional, because that has been a standard feature in addon aircraft for years, but it's a detail and irrelevant to my main issue.

The main issue is that what I'm hearing in the sim is markedly different from the "sound preview" video linked in the first post.

Not worse, or better, or any other qualification was applied.

 

 

What I did was this: After reinstalling the DC-6, setting up the sounds as recommended and checking my sound settings in Windows, I matched my altitude, speed and engine settings to the ones used in the sound preview video. No open windows, no flyby sounds, just the sound as heard in the VC. After doing so I again compared the two, and the differences are obvious.

 

In the sim , the engine sounds are fairly quiet in relation to the prop and wind noise. This results in a fairly thin, whirring noise.

 

In the video, the engine sounds are much louder, but the prop and wind noise is still audible - in my opinion, it sounds very good and well balanced. I was hoping to achieve the same in the sim. To do so, I modified some of the corresponding wav files until the result more or less matched the video, and now I'm satisfied with the result.

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Guys, have you actually read my posts? Nowhere did I state that the sounds were bad, that they were not realistic, or that I knew better how it should sound.

 

I've read all of them, clearly. I think it's also very clear that I've been responding to multiple people's commentary on the sounds.

 

I'd be interested to hear your responses to the questions here:

http://www.avsim.com/topic/489592-sound-issues/

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Thanks for your reply Kyle.

 

 

Well that's disappointing.

 

Steve-

 

I am curious...

 

When I pull my headset off while flying the DC-3 (or the DC-4 for that matter) and turn my head... The sound does not change.  It is not stereoscopic...  It is so loud and so overwhelming that you cannot change it by rotating your head around on a swivel...

 

Now- if I shut down #2 (which would arguably be a dumb thing for me to do while flying around for fun- but lets just pretend for a moment!) THEN i will definitely hear a difference because only the left engine is running.

 

(You will also hear Aaron leaning into the cockpit to ask ##### the problem is- because he takes such things very seriously... but that is another story for another day...)

 

Now- if you take the DC-6 and run the same exercise (shutdown 3/4 in this case- just for argumentative consistency) you will hear that the sound is coming from your left...

 

What else are we trying to accomplish, precisely?

Gents-

 

I just removed 4 posts from 2 users in this thread because they were unsigned.

 

As is stated clearly in our main forum- users must sign their posts here if you want to contribute to the conversation. 

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Steve-

 

I am curious...

 

When I pull my headset off while flying the DC-3 (or the DC-4 for that matter) and turn my head... The sound does not change.  It is not stereoscopic...  It is so loud and so overwhelming that you cannot change it by rotating your head around on a swivel...

 

Now- if I shut down #2 (which would arguably be a dumb thing for me to do while flying around for fun- but lets just pretend for a moment!) THEN i will definitely hear a difference because only the left engine is running.

 

(You will also hear Aaron leaning into the cockpit to ask ##### the problem is- because he takes such things very seriously... but that is another story for another day...)

 

Now- if you take the DC-6 and run the same exercise (shutdown 3/4 in this case- just for argumentative consistency) you will hear that the sound is coming from your left...

 

What else are we trying to accomplish, precisely?

Gents-

 

I just removed 4 posts from 2 users in this thread because they were unsigned.

 

As is stated clearly in our main forum- users must sign their posts here if you want to contribute to the conversation. 

 

Robert no one is saying that sounds should be 3D while the camera is more or less static in the pilots seat but when you move it around the cockpit or outside for that matter. Right now the DC-6 sounds the same if you are in chase view right behind it or in runway view several miles away. This is something that is found in even the default aircraft (doppler effect, not 3D sounds in the VC) so not having it in a $70 addon is rather surprising.

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Felipe,

 

That isn't how I read Steve's comments- so you can see why I am confused as to what he is asking for...

 

I think Kyle mentioned earlier that we noted the feedback you just pointed out- and added it to the list of items for an update. 

 

One of the things we are trying very hard to do is sort out some of the norms that are interesting to X-Plane users that aren't interesting to our MS based customers.

 

So- give us feedback- and we shall see what we can whip up for you!

 

In the meantime- enjoy the airplane... 

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Felipe,

 

That isn't how I read Steve's comments- so you can see why I am confused as to what he is asking for...

 

I think Kyle mentioned earlier that we noted the feedback you just pointed out- and added it to the list of items for an update. 

 

One of the things we are trying very hard to do is sort out some of the norms that are interesting to X-Plane users that aren't interesting to our MS based customers.

 

So- give us feedback- and we shall see what we can whip up for you!

 

In the meantime- enjoy the airplane... 

 

Thanks Robert. I realize it's a bit akward getting used to the sim and it's community to boot. We appreciate the hard work and look forward to any improvements in the future. And yes, somethings that FSX/P3D users would not think twice about can cause quite the stir if ommited in an XP addon. Best advice I can give is to take a look at the other high quality add ons in the market and see what people are willing to pay for and expect. But I'm sure you know what your doing :P

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Thanks Robert. I realize it's a bit akward getting used to the sim and it's community to boot. We appreciate the hard work and look forward to any improvements in the future. And yes, somethings that FSX/P3D users would not think twice about can cause quite the stir if ommited in an XP addon. Best advice I can give is to take a look at the other high quality add ons in the market and see what people are willing to pay for and expect. But I'm sure you know what your doing :P

 

Filipe-

 

Thanks.  We will power through the drama- we have pretty thick skin after almost 20 years of doing this...

 

There is a HUGE amount of tribalism in the sim community- which I've never quite understood.  People are very emotional about their sim choices- and why they will or will not support products and developers- and those emotions often have nothing whatever to do with the product or the product quality....  Usually the loudest voices are the least informed and the most toxic- so we become quite good at separating wheat and chaff.

 

In the mean time- we have some interesting updates planned- nay-sayers and all.  :Party:

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