Sign in to follow this  
Vantskruv

Propeller reverse and mixture control.

Recommended Posts

I skipped the tutorials, as I personally hate the AFE (I don't trust him :Talk to the Hand: ), and after some test and trial without reading any manual I did successfully start up the engines. I did one mistake with the first engine, overheating the carburetor air. But I learned to handle the carb levers and get temperatures between yellow and red marking, slowly increase the levers while in flight. Also I learned to adjust the cowls to get optimal cylinder temperature (if I'm right it is 200 C). I did two flights with great success, not damaging any engines. Yet a great aircraft indeed.

Though I have some questions.

 

1. How do you reverse the propeller pitch? The red handle above the propeller panel (in the center panel between throttle levers) is not possible to move. Tried click on it but nothing happens. After that, I did try setup a joystick button to propeller reverse toggle without any success.

 

2. When to set autorich and lean positions on the mixtures levers? Is it decided by start, taxi, takeoff, climb and so on. Or is it more complicated depending on airtemperature, enginetemperature, throttle position?

 

3. Can you affect motor oil temperature also, or is it only cylinder temp and carburetor temp important to monitor and adjust for?

 

I've some more questions, i.e. fuel management, but I take them for later. The above is the most important right now for me to understand.

 

Thank you PMDG for a great aircraft. :good:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

hi there!

 

1. Make sure your throttle levers are in idle position, then move the reverse handle back, and confirm  reverse pitch by the 4 amber lights underneath the reverse handle. Apply reverse-power by either pulling the levers in the virtual cockpit more back, or move your hardware axis forward (as you would normally accelerate). Because in reverse-pitch mode your throttle axis will move the in-sim levers backwards out of idle position. To return into normal pitch, again set throttle to idle, then move the reverse handle back forward.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 


I skipped the tutorials, as I personally hate the AFE (I don't trust him ), and after some test and trial without reading any manual I did successfully start up the engines. I did one mistake with the first engine, overheating the carburetor air.

 

No offense, but, shouldn't trust be placed in the "person" who knows how to do the things required to properly operate the aircraft? You'll have to forgive me for a bit, but hating the very thing that would help you solve all of these questions and problems seems so...arcane and backward...

 

 

 


But I learned to handle the carb levers and get temperatures between yellow and red marking, slowly increase the levers while in flight.

 

False. Carb ice isn't a problem unless you have what is required for ice: cold + water. Beyond that, temperatures below the yellow band do not require heat, either. Again, the AFE would've taken care of this for you in the proper fashion.

 

 

 


1. How do you reverse the propeller pitch? The red handle above the propeller panel (in the center panel between throttle levers) is not possible to move. Tried click on it but nothing happens. After that, I did try setup a joystick button to propeller reverse toggle without any success.

 

Throttle at idle. Then move the lever.

 

 

 


2. When to set autorich and lean positions on the mixtures levers? Is it decided by start, taxi, takeoff, climb and so on. Or is it more complicated depending on airtemperature, enginetemperature, throttle position?

 

Could've watched the AFE to determine this, but...AUTO RICH at just about any time but cruise.

 

 

 


3. Can you affect motor oil temperature also, or is it only cylinder temp and carburetor temp important to monitor and adjust for?

 

Oil temps will vary based on your airspeed, throttle setting, and a few other conditions.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for both of your answers. :)

 

Though I'm still unable to move the reverse handle. Even at throttle IDLE settings. I've been trying to click and drag, also pressing the prop-reverse button assigned on my joystick. So either it is a bug or I'm doing something wrong.

 

 

 


No offense, but, shouldn't trust be placed in the "person" who knows how to do the things required to properly operate the aircraft? You'll have to forgive me for a bit, but hating the very thing that would help you solve all of these questions and problems seems so...arcane and backward...

 

Kyle, I meant to be sarcastic. I do not hate (I guess I chose the wrong word, and mistakenly being taken too serious), and AFE is helpful of course. But I'm a person who just want to play for himself, I do not like learning by watching, I want to learn by doing, or be told what to do.

AFE does not help at all in learning things (maybe a small fragment), as you only get audible hints of what he is doing. He is not instructor, just a work reliefer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kyle, I meant to be sarcastic. I do not hate (I guess I chose the wrong word, and mistakenly being taken too serious), and AFE is helpful of course. But I'm a person who just want to play for himself, I do not like learning by watching, I want to learn by doing, or be told what to do.

AFE does not help at all in learning things (maybe a small fragment), as you only get audible hints of what he is doing. He is not instructor, just a work reliefer.

You might find reading the tutorials useful!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You might find reading the tutorials useful!

 

No I refuse!

 

 

Kidding here, I read through relative fast, but there is no information on maneuvering the prop reversers. Most of the tutorials is only about navigating and handling the autopilot, which I master well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Though I'm still unable to move the reverse handle. Even at throttle IDLE settings. I've been trying to click and drag, also pressing the prop-reverse button assigned on my joystick. So either it is a bug or I'm doing something wrong.

 

The only other person I found with a similar issue had the throttle mapped to multiple levers. I'm guessing one or more of them was sending an indication above idle, which would be a null zone issue.

 

 

 

Kyle, I meant to be sarcastic. I do not hate (I guess I chose the wrong word, and mistakenly being taken too serious), and AFE is helpful of course. But I'm a person who just want to play for himself, I do not like learning by watching, I want to learn by doing, or be told what to do.

AFE does not help at all in learning things (maybe a small fragment), as you only get audible hints of what he is doing. He is not instructor, just a work reliefer.

 

That makes a little more sense. All the same, a few uses while paying attention can help you to understand the work flow. While an instructor would walk you through the process to help acquire knowledge faster, that doesn't mean that observational learning isn't effective (this is how we all initially learned to speak, as an example).

 

Then again, as someone who created many an unintentional crater around Merril C. Meigs as a kid with FS5.1, I can completely understand shirking reading and taking the trail and error approach.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only other person I found with a similar issue had the throttle mapped to multiple levers. I'm guessing one or more of them was sending an indication above idle, which would be a null zone issue.

 

 

 

 

That makes a little more sense. All the same, a few uses while paying attention can help you to understand the work flow. While an instructor would walk you through the process to help acquire knowledge faster, that doesn't mean that observational learning isn't effective (this is how we all initially learned to speak, as an example).

 

Then again, as someone who created many an unintentional crater around Merril C. Meigs as a kid with FS5.1, I can completely understand shirking reading and taking the trail and error approach.

 

 

No problem, everyone of us are different humans with different qualities and needs. :)

 

Anyway, I'm using the Thrustmaster Warthog setup and Saitek Rudder Pedals. Also I'm using TrackIR.

 

The throttle base do have 3 axis, where each axis is assigned to:

* Throttle (which moves all the virtual throttles)

* Prop

* Carb heat

 

The joystick has, of course, two axis and is assigned to:

* Pitch

* Roll

 

The rudder pedal has three axis assigned to:

* Yaw

* Left toe brake

* Right toe brake

 

I do not have any axis mapped to multiple functions, X-Plane is only able to map one axis to one function, though maybe I do not know better? Correct me then if I'm wrong. I'll continue to try to solve the problem. At the bottom I'm running the Thrustmaster TARGET GUI. But I cannot imagine that would be the problem, as it only provides raw data to X-Plane, but I'll continue test and trial.

 

Thanks for your support Kyle.

 

UPDATE

Anyway, as a required law. After a minimum amount of written words and time used by troublesolving, you find the culprit. As always.... :unknw:

 

I did recalibrate the input axes in X-Plane, and now I'm able to maneuver the prop reverse handle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 


I do not have any axis mapped to multiple functions, X-Plane is only able to map one axis to one function, though maybe I do not know better? Correct me then if I'm wrong. I'll continue to try to solve the problem. At the bottom I'm running the Thrustmaster TARGET GUI. But I cannot imagine that would be the problem, as it only provides raw data to X-Plane, but I'll continue test and trial.

 

In the earlier post, I was explaining a situation where someone had one throttle lever assigned to one throttle lever in the plane, for four different levers on his hardware (lever 1 - throttle 1, lever 2 - throttle 2, etc.). One of those levers was showing above idle, so it wouldn't go into reverse.

 

Have you calibrated your hardware?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As stated in post above (the last lines). :)

 

haha - great way to put it, too:

 

 

 

UPDATE

Anyway, as a required law. After a minimum amount of written words and time used by troublesolving, you find the culprit. As always....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, it happened again. I needed to recalibrate again. I think it would be nice to set a little higher threshold to allow for prop reverse (just to filter out some axis difference).

 

Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 


(just to filter out some axis difference).

 

That's what null zone is for.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry for late reply, I've been busy flying the DC6 and the Tu154, I cannot get enough learning all the aircraft. :)

 

 

 


That's what null zone is for.

 

I have not found any way to set any nullzone for throttle in X-Plane. It seems this is possible only for yaw, pitch and roll and it is mainly to create a nullzone in this center point of axis. In this case, there are no nullzones definable for endpoints of axes, and I do not recall any software offer settings for endpoint nullzones.

 

It seems everytime I want to fly the DC6, I need to recalibrate the throttle axis. I've never had this problem with any aircraft before. It is not fun being unsure if pitch reverse will work when landing on a short runway (though it is exciting :) ).

 

So I still stand my point, throttle axis endpoint bufferzone for allowing pitch reverse should be increased.

 

:p0304:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

.... and I do not recall any software offer settings for endpoint nullzones....

 

 

It's doable with FlyWithLua and a custom lua script that will intercept the throttle axis raw position and amend it with an offset. I'm using a similar approach to smoothen the values of my rather noisy throttle quadrants.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is an unnecessary and awkward solution. Actually, when I think about it. Why implement a check for throttle axis value, when you still need to flip the pitch reverse lever? It feels like belt and suspenders. Not necessary in this case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I too was not able to reverse the lever almost always, due perhaps to the very little threshold of the throttles idle,  with the Logitech G940

 

Marco Scuto

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 


Why implement a check for throttle axis value, when you still need to flip the pitch reverse lever?

 

Because the throttles need to be at idle before you kick it into reverse. Why implement a check on a number of realistic things? People criticize the start procedure for being too realistic, but reverse is too realistic?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right. It's clear that it depends to the lack of precision of the hardware, whatever it is. If we need to calibrate the throttles every time something seems running badly. We need more realism as possible. It's our goal and a check like that should be fine. But I don't know what to do in .Lua language...

 

 


It's doable with FlyWithLua and a custom lua script that will intercept the throttle axis raw position and amend it with an offset. I'm using a similar approach to smoothen the values of my rather noisy throttle quadrants.

 

tarakanbg, dou you think that this file could be shared with the community? And, do you think it should work properly with all the hardware?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because the throttles need to be at idle before you kick it into reverse. Why implement a check on a number of realistic things? People criticize the start procedure for being too realistic, but reverse is too realistic?

 

You misunderstand me, as I am not complaining about the realistic part ( I want it as realistic as possible). What I am doing is asking a question. To be more clear then, I rephrase the question, as I confess the question was too deep for people to understand.

 

Is the pitch reverse handle physical locked in the real airplane when throttle position is on the positive side?

 

Anyway, still the problem exist that your airplane does not detect a zero throttle position, making it impossible to control the pitch reverse handle. The threshold for approving to move the handle is too strict. PC joystick imperfection must be taken in to account.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 


your airplane does not detect a zero throttle position

 

Correction: your computer is not detecting a zero throttle position. This is not an issue on my computer, and from the looks of the forum here, most others as well. Hardware has error in it that will cause the sim (and therefore the DC-6) to see a positive indication. It is up to you to ensure that this error is nulled out.

 

 

 


PC joystick imperfection must be taken in to account.

 

Again: this is what null zones are for. If you cannot set this in XPL, set it using the software provided by the hardware manufacturer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[...]

Is the pitch reverse handle physical locked in the real airplane when throttle position is on the positive side?

[...]

From POH page 175: "Reversing the propeller on the ground is accomplished by pulling the throttles

aft past the center, or closed, position, which can be felt as a definite stop. At this
point, a cam-actuated switch on the forward face of the control pedestal closes
to energize the propeller reversing circuit."
So I'd say yes, the real one does check if throttles are at idle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I admit that, eventually, I'd like to use the reverse lever... But... Neither with the hardware, as I wrote, nor without them I can do it. I mean that if I try to slip the red bar  even without connect the hardware, I can't. I accurately adjust with the mouse the throttles in idle (and the prop), the 4 amber lights light up, then I persist on the red bar but nothing. It's steady. It proudly holds its position... But, if it suddenly moves and retracts (and I didn't see why, what does it change...), after that it's impossible to push it forward again...

I don't understand why. Please, could anyone help me to solve this mystery? Am I the only one with this issue (as Vantskruv, at least, recalibrating the imput axes do succed)?

 

Marco Scuto

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 


I don't understand why. Please, could anyone help me to solve this mystery? Am I the only one with this issue (as Vantskruv, at least, recalibrating the imput axes do succed)?

 

Single click it instead of clicking and dragging. You could also set a key command to change it using the commands we've provided.

 

Throttles must be at idle first in order to change from positive to negative pitch, and vice versa.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Kyle,

Yes I did it, throttles at idle, even waiting for the lowest MAP, then a shy click, so a determined click, drag, punchs, hammer...  but nothing. Maybe I shall reinstall it.

 

Marco Scuto

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this