Doug Pelton

Panel State Load: Engines don't advance

Recommended Posts

I start with an FSX saved flight parked. Then, I Load Panel NGX Default...or even from NGX CLD DRK...and follow startup procedures., Engines spool, but don't advance thereafter. I've tried may Load Panel States---trying to spool up and start engines for  particular Virtual Airline 'test' procedure.  Even if I load a PMDG Tutorial with engines running after pushback, and I cut the engines and restart, the engines don't advance after spooling .  Thanks 

 

Doug Pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

I had a problem similar to this with the T7 not loading correctly after an in-flight save. The plane would load correctly and go through the 40-odd second initialisation period them when that completed nothing would work and it would just fall out of the sky.

After some research I started deleting any saved .FLT files from my [../Users/<myname>/My Documents/Flight Simulator] files before starting a T7 flight and then saving my current flight. Loading the flight from the Load button in the FSX startup window worked every time. Since then I have had no issue. Not sure it will work with the NGX but it's worth a try.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Doug Pelton said:

I start with an FSX saved flight parked. Then, I Load Panel NGX Default...or even from NGX CLD DRK...and follow startup procedures., Engines spool, but don't advance thereafter. I've tried may Load Panel States---trying to spool up and start engines for  particular Virtual Airline 'test' procedure.  Even if I load a PMDG Tutorial with engines running after pushback, and I cut the engines and restart, the engines don't advance after spooling .  Thanks 

Hi Doug,

Try loading from a panel state you have set as the default panel state instead of a previously saved flight situation.  The previously saved situation includes a saved panel state -- the previously saved state is likely the cause of your issue.   I have created my own default startup state from the PMDG-supplied cold and dark state - I connected ground power and a/c made sure the doors were open, put on some navigation lights but neither of the flashing ones, saved that panel state and made it my default startup panel state.

I know it may seem more realistic to start up where you left off,  but it is likely that loading your previously saved panel state is causing the problem.

Mike

PS- Repeatedly saving and reloading a panel state increases the probability that the panel state becomes corrupted.  I think that is what you are doing inadvertently.

 

Edited by Mike777

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, speedyTC said:

After some research I started deleting any saved .FLT files from my [../Users/<myname>/My Documents/Flight Simulator] files before starting a T7 flight and then saving my current flight. Loading the flight from the Load button in the FSX startup window worked every time. Since then I have had no issue. Not sure it will work with the NGX but it's worth a try.

Hi, Tony,

I seriously doubt that deleting .flt files in your FSX documents folder had any effect.  The only .FLT file that is active is the one associated with  the specific saved flight you have loaded.   I have many saved flights from the PMDG 777, NGX, and other aircraft, and my saved flights usually load just fine.  Are you shutting down and restarting FSX every time you load a 777 flight, or at a minimum loading a default aircraft such as the trike in between 777 flights?

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rather than start where I left off, I will end my session at the gate on ground air/power, doors open in a typical "short" turnaround except INS is OFF.  Fuel is left as is and payload is set to zero.  This is saved.  I have my own file name convention going such as 738 KLAS C9 SWA.  Next time I want to fly from KLAS in a SWA B738, I will start with that saved flight and start with my cockpit checks in an aircraft left by the last crew.  Also, next time I fly to KLAS in a SWA B738 I will park at that gate and update the saved flight. True, I end up with more than a few saved but this is how I like to do it. 

On a slow day, I'll sort all my saved flights oldest on top and pick it for my next trip. So easy to keep me entertained.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, speedyTC said:

I had a problem similar to this with the T7 not loading correctly after an in-flight save. The plane would load correctly and go through the 40-odd second initialisation period them when that completed nothing would work and it would just fall out of the sky.

After some research I started deleting any saved .FLT files from my [../Users/<myname>/My Documents/Flight Simulator] files before starting a T7 flight and then saving my current flight. Loading the flight from the Load button in the FSX startup window worked every time. Since then I have had no issue. Not sure it will work with the NGX but it's worth a try.

 

Tony, my PMDG files only show .RTE, so I think the .FLT is only for FSX. Thanks. Doug Pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Mike777 said:

Hi Doug,

Try loading from a panel state you have set as the default panel state instead of a previously saved flight situation.  The previously saved situation includes a saved panel state -- the previously saved state is likely the cause of your issue.   I have created my own default startup state from the PMDG-supplied cold and dark state - I connected ground power and a/c made sure the doors were open, put on some navigation lights but neither of the flashing ones, saved that panel state and made it my default startup panel state.

I know it may seem more realistic to start up where you left off,  but it is likely that loading your previously saved panel state is causing the problem.

Mike

PS- Repeatedly saving and reloading a panel state increases the probability that the panel state becomes corrupted.  I think that is what you are doing inadvertently.

 

 

Mike, I went to FSX Saved flights and loaded it without going to PMDG Load Panel. Engines spooled and advanced. But I was not at the airport I need to be at, so I re-located the plane and Saved with another saved-name. Engines spooled but didn't advance.  I think I will clear out ALL of myt saved flights in the Panel and in FSX, leaving saved only the PMDG default Panels, ie, Tutorial, etc.  Thanks so much for responding. 

Doug Pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I loaded my FXS saved flight location....then loaded Panel NGX Short. Spool up but not engine advance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Doug Pelton said:

engines don't advance after spooling .

Hard to understand exactly what you mean when using unfamiliar terms like advance and spooling; however, what i sounds like is you start the engine with the GND selector switch and the engine spools up but doesn't  "advance."  What are your fuel flow rates? What is happening to EGT?  I suggest you be a lot more specific in the description of your problem and maybe we won't take off on another tangent.  It simply sounds like the engines are motoring, a term than means start air is turning them at maybe 28%N2 but they haven't ignited and started burning fuel.  Sorry if that is not the case but that's all I can gather from your description.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Mike777 said:

Hi, Tony,

I seriously doubt that deleting .flt files in your FSX documents folder had any effect.  The only .FLT file that is active is the one associated with  the specific saved flight you have loaded.   I have many saved flights from the PMDG 777, NGX, and other aircraft, and my saved flights usually load just fine.  Are you shutting down and restarting FSX every time you load a 777 flight, or at a minimum loading a default aircraft such as the trike in between 777 flights?

Mike

Hi Mike,

when flying long haul I usually don't have the time to finish it off in one go so yes, the flightsim is started fresh (usually the next day) and in the initial FSX window I do have the trike spinning around. I then hit the Load button from that same screen and select the flight I want to continue. I am aware that complex add-ons such as the T7 and more recently the FSL bus prefer a clean sim start even if one wants to change liveries.

Funnily enough when I fly for one of the VAs I am a member of their own ACARS client does a stellar job of recovering the flight and allowing me to continue from where I left off. My standard in-sim saves (which I usually name as xxxxyyyy - as in the ICAO airport identifiers - never work. I have recently enabled FSUIPC's autosave function but have yet to do a long haul to check if that works.

Tony

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, downscc said:

Hard to understand exactly what you mean when using unfamiliar terms like advance and spooling; however, what i sounds like is you start the engine with the GND selector switch and the engine spools up but doesn't  "advance."  What are your fuel flow rates? What is happening to EGT?  I suggest you be a lot more specific in the description of your problem and maybe we won't take off on another tangent.  It simply sounds like the engines are motoring, a term than means start air is turning them at maybe 28%N2 but they haven't ignited and started burning fuel.  Sorry if that is not the case but that's all I can gather from your description.

Dan, the EGT iis 376;  FF rates   .65

Thanks

Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, speedyTC said:

Funnily enough when I fly for one of the VAs I am a member of their own ACARS client does a stellar job of recovering the flight and allowing me to continue from where I left off. My standard in-sim saves (which I usually name as xxxxyyyy - as in the ICAO airport identifiers - never work. I have recently enabled FSUIPC's autosave function but have yet to do a long haul to check if that works.

Hi Tony,

I am not familiar with VA ACARS clients, but  maybe it is saving the necessary files somewhere other than  the normal file locations, or maybe it has been installed with file write permissions that need to be given to FSX itself.  Or  to put it another way, try running FSX As Administrator.  Also, after the 777 finishes loading, what happens if you load the panel state with the same name as the file you just loaded?

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will do (or at least start, save then restart) a long haul in the T7 in the very near future and keep a record of the various stages of saves. With and without FSUIPC autosave but without the VA's ACARS client just to be sure that that isn't writing anything to the drive. I do run FSX as admin.

Thanks for the help!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Doug Pelton said:

Dan, the EGT iis 376;  FF rates   .65

Thanks

Doug

We seem to have a couple of topics going here, please excuse me if I has a stupid question.  Okay, that might be a good ground idle FF so we know the engines are running, and not just spooled up and motoring.  Now when you say they don't advance, does this mean you cannot increase thrust by moving your throttles given the conditions you provide in your first post?  When the condition exists where you cannot increase thrust, do the throttles in the VC cockpit move when you move your throttle controller?  Does N1 change at all? What about the F3 key incremental increase throttle key, does that increase thrust?  Trying to get the whole picture since I'm not looking over your shoulder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, downscc said:

We seem to have a couple of topics going here, please excuse me if I has a stupid question.  Okay, that might be a good ground idle FF so we know the engines are running, and not just spooled up and motoring.  Now when you say they don't advance, does this mean you cannot increase thrust by moving your throttles given the conditions you provide in your first post?  When the condition exists where you cannot increase thrust, do the throttles in the VC cockpit move when you move your throttle controller?  Does N1 change at all? What about the F3 key incremental increase throttle key, does that increase thrust?  Trying to get the whole picture since I'm not looking over your shoulder.

---Throttle does increase thrust

----Throttles in VC mode advance

---N1 does not change

---F3 does not provide increase in thrust---Key is properly assigned.

Thanks for drilling down on this

Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Doug Pelton said:

---Throttle does increase thrust

----Throttles in VC mode advance

---N1 does not change

Now I'm confused.  What is telling you that the throttle increases thrust if N1 does not change?  When you say "throttle does increase thrust" and "throttles in VC mode advance," do you mean the throttle levers as they appear in the VC? 

Regarding the F3 key, is it assigned in both FSX controls and perhaps to something different in PMDG control settings?  Are you using FSUIPC, and if so, are F3 or the joystick throttle levers assigned through it?

What happens if you don't start from a saved panel state, but just start FSX, from the startup screen showing the Trike you select a 737 NGX, load it at the gate of any airport?  What is the default startup state showing on the PMDG CDU?

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ditto Mike...., N1 is the primary indication of thrust. What is your definition of thrust?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, downscc said:

We seem to have a couple of topics going here, please excuse me if I has a stupid question.  Okay, that might be a good ground idle FF so we know the engines are running, and not just spooled up and motoring.  Now when you say they don't advance, does this mean you cannot increase thrust by moving your throttles given the conditions you provide in your first post?  When the condition exists where you cannot increase thrust, do the throttles in the VC cockpit move when you move your throttle controller?  Does N1 change at all? What about the F3 key incremental increase throttle key, does that increase thrust?  Trying to get the whole picture since I'm not looking over your shoulder.

---Throttle does increase thrust

----Throttles in VC mode advance

---N1 does not change

---F3 does not provide increase in thrust---Key is properly assigned.

Thanks for drilling down on this

Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Mike777 said:

Now I'm confused.  What is telling you that the throttle increases thrust if N1 does not change?  When you say "throttle does increase thrust" and "throttles in VC mode advance," do you mean the throttle levers as they appear in the VC? 

Regarding the F3 key, is it assigned in both FSX controls and perhaps to something different in PMDG control settings?  Are you using FSUIPC, and if so, are F3 or the joystick throttle levers assigned through it?

What happens if you don't start from a saved panel state, but just start FSX, from the startup screen showing the Trike you select a 737 NGX, load it at the gate of any airport?  What is the default startup state showing on the PMDG CDU?

Mike

--N1 does not change when i advance my Thrustmaster(calibrated)

---VC thottles do advance via Thrustmaster.

----F3 does advance the VC throttles with no increase in N1

No key assignments in my FSUIPC. No alternate F3 assignment on Thrustmaster.

----Opened the Trike, then to PMDG 737 livery and then to my airport. Start up without loading a Panel state but same problem.

----Default startup on the PMDG CDU:  NGX Short

Thanks Mike

Doug Pelton

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Doug Pelton said:

--N1 does not change when i advance my Thrustmaster(calibrated)

---VC thottles do advance via Thrustmaster.

----F3 does advance the VC throttles with no increase in N1

No key assignments in my FSUIPC. No alternate F3 assignment on Thrustmaster.

----Opened the Trike, then to PMDG 737 livery and then to my airport. Start up without loading a Panel state but same problem.

----Default startup on the PMDG CDU:  NGX Short

Thanks Mike

Doug Pelton

 

Voila!! Working. 

I came back to the sim an hour after my last reply to Mike (above) and hit F3: VC throttles advanced as di N1. Same result when using my Thrustmaster.

 

 

Doug

 

Edited by Doug Pelton
.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Doug Pelton said:

Voila!! Working. 

I came back to the sim an hour after my last reply to Mike (above) and hit F3: VC throttles advanced as di N1. Same result when using my Thrustmaster.

 

 

Doug

 

Too bad we couldn't find the problem before it escaped.

I recommend you do not open or load the Trike then the PMDG NGX.  Start from Free Flight with only your default non-PMDG aircraft showing in the little turning preview window, from there select NGX or a saved flight.  This is also discussed in the Introduction document.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, downscc said:

Too bad we couldn't find the problem before it escaped.

I recommend you do not open or load the Trike then the PMDG NGX.  Start from Free Flight with only your default non-PMDG aircraft showing in the little turning preview window, from there select NGX or a saved flight.  This is also discussed in the Introduction document.

 

Solution short-lived: back to same problem.

I'll follow your suggested startup.

Thanks, Dan, and all who have weighed-in.

 

Doug Pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Doug Pelton said:

Solution short-lived: back to same problem.

I'll follow your suggested startup.

Thanks, Dan, and all who have weighed-in.

 

Doug Pelton

Success!

Dan, the sequence of FSX/PMDG and default flight like you noted may have done the trick. But will test again. The N1 increase didn't happen for about 15 min----I used F3 to move VC thttle to full; left the room and came back and N1 was up, as was EGT (90 +). 

I'll get to this again and will post results.

 

Doug pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Doug Pelton said:

Success!

Dan, the sequence of FSX/PMDG and default flight like you noted may have done the trick. But will test again. The N1 increase didn't happen for about 15 min----I used F3 to move VC thttle to full; left the room and came back and N1 was up, as was EGT (90 +). 

I'll get to this again and will post results.

 

Doug pelton

 

Tested again: The problem, I think, has been with the APU after engine startup. I follow the flow as per the manual to shut down the APU , but it doesn't respond to 'shut off' instantaneously. There is a delay, and once the APU shuts down (bleed and packs have been set per manual) then the N1 advances!

Don't know why the delay in shutting down APU, but will focus on that flow next time I start up.

Doug Pelton

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now