Hi Victor,I know about the Flight1 simForums but they still are "generic" fora with only limited options for product-specific stickies and information. Moreover, the Flight 1 General and Product Support forum is currently inhabited by a very vocal and, um, outspoken user, which don't make them a very welcoming place, IMO.Cheers, Holger

Well there you go!I'll send you an invoice for my match making fees ;-)Cheers, Holger

"And Tom, my comments CANNOT be `libellous` as you so brusquely mentioned in the edited topic - BEV HAVE YET TO RELEASE EUROPEAN TEXTURES. You cannot libel something that doeasn't exist!"Brusquely??? You bet your butt brusquely! You don't have to pay the legal fees. When you use words like "fraud", you can bet your last dollar, pound, ringhett, whatever, that we are going to remove and finally ban you from here if you insist on over stepping that line. When you pay the legal fees, you can accuse, castigate and use any word you like. But until then, another post like the one you made earlier will get you banned.

Reading through the forums I'm finding it interesting why so many seem to be forgetting BEV is in every way still a great add-on that found it

:-lolDon't count your chickens Holger. Besides, we don't pay "match making" fees. In our policies manual, that comes under the title of "pimping", which we don't pay for. :)

> :-lol>>Don't count your chickens Holger. Besides, we don't pay "match>making" fees. In our policies manual, that comes under the>title of "pimping", which we don't pay for. :) DRAT; And here I was looking to supplement my meager income when I retireas an AVSIM Pimp.x( Denny

>"And Tom, my comments CANNOT be `libellous` as you so>brusquely mentioned in the edited topic - BEV HAVE YET TO>RELEASE EUROPEAN TEXTURES. You cannot libel something that>doeasn't exist!">>Brusquely??? You bet your butt brusquely! You don't have to>pay the legal fees. When you use words like "fraud", you can>bet your last dollar, pound, ringhett, whatever, that we are>going to remove and finally ban you from here if you insist on>over stepping that line. When you pay the legal fees, you can>accuse, castigate and use any word you like. But until then,>another post like the one you made earlier will get you>banned.Then Avsim will be looking into the issue? If you can show me that buying European textures means a completely different texture set with no repeats and that no textures in the USA sets already released have been used in any other installer then we haven't paid twice for the same product simply because of the packaging choice of the developer. And that won't be a rip-off. Allcott

Tom,I wouldn't use strong or emotive language personally. But clearly BEV and FScene have gone for the maximum revenue earning option. Which is fair play. GE has done what any business would do, if you can't beat them on quality, beat them on price. In this case it seems to be not so much as a beaten, but whipped!

>Tom,>>I wouldn't use strong or emotive language personally. But>clearly BEV and FScene have gone for the maximum revenue>earning option. Which is fair play. GE has done what any>business would do, if you can't beat them on quality, beat>them on price. In this case it seems to be not so much as a>beaten, but whipped!What galls me is that it took a `competitor` to bring this to the consumers attention. To their credit the GE developers have not used it as a stick to beat the opposition, but it certainly does raise a few horny questions about `sharp practices`! Choice is a good thing, but the choice of being fleeced - or not - seems not to be a choice at all!But like I say, if Avsim undertake to review the textures and they ARE substantially different across the various `regions`, then I'd be much happier, However, if things are as Holger says they are (and I have no reason to doubt him) then it would seem that, globally, FS doesn't use different texture sets, rather it uses the existing texture sets in different combinations to create the effect of a global mix - in which case BEV and FScene have some explaining to do - particularly Fscene, where the convenient deflection of the `extra charges cover the complex front end` don't hold up. Allcott

As many of you know I rarely post on forums, but every once in awhile something is brought to my attention and I read through all the many varied posts and add my two pence worth. As a developer of BEV and a owner of GE (yes I have both on my machine) I can attest to the quality of both. OK...I'll admit, I'm biased with my opinon of BEV, but GE is another one of those products that brings about a remarkable change to the world we fly in. Do I like one better than the other?...no...not really, but there are certainly features of both that when used together can enhance the flying environment even further. So... what did I do. When I downloaded GE, I installed it on top of my BEV textures! Yep, right over them...flew around for a few hours checking out the various textures and how they interacted with each other, and found many textures that I really liked. I then re-applied the default BEV theme of BEV and flew around doing the same thing. By installing GE, I now have Peter's textures as the FS9 default and BEV textures as they are normally configured within the Configurator II. This setup allows me to pick and choose among both GE and BEV textures, thus increasing my ability to tweak and create a even better flight simulation experience. Now for many, that may be more work than they like, but for many others it's just the ticket for providing a way to create a better flight experience.As for the post in regards to pricing schemes and the words "rip off"...I think the members of this forum provided some really good answers, especially the post regarding the MS SDK. I would highly suggest a bit of time reading that SDK in order to see what is involved in creating textures. I'm not exactly sure what Peter has done in the world coverage area as his European texture sets are set up a bit differently, but I can tell you that Microsoft does indeed take many of the textures made for North America and simply renames them to be used in various other regions, along with creating some very specific and unique textures for regions as well (primarily European Cities, Farmlands, Mountains, etc.). The initial intent of BEV was to introduce textures that were unique to the various regions throughout the world. Not only would the textures designated for different regions be recreated to represent a better rendition of what that particuliar texture represented, but the textures used throughout North America and show up in many other places in the world would also be re-done to better represent the various regions and their vast differences. As already pointed out, VOZ is an excellent representation of what I had in mind, but the VOZ team beat BEV to the punch and did an excellent job. Those of you who have downloaded VOZ and installed it, are well aware of the vast difference that these textures make in flying in Australia, but (and this is stated only to represent the limitations of the use of textures sets throughout the entire world of FS9) if you forget to uninstall VOZ using the VOZ installer, you'll see the VOZ textures throughout the world you fly in and often times look entirely out of place, which of course they would since they were created with one region in mind! Now if you take that same concept and apply it to other vastly different regions you'll get the idea behind the production and eventual sales of those regions. The work involved in creating these texture sets for various regions may or may not in the mind of the individual flight simmer justify the cost, but certainly the concept of regional texture sets cannot and should not be contrued as a "rip off". As I stated earlier, regional sets BEVs original intent, but with the announcement of FSX, a discussion and opinon poll was conducted on the BEV forum as to the feasibility of further pursuit of this original developement plan. The vast majority stated that it would not be in their interest to purchase regional textures based upon BEVs irratical release schedule (yes I admit it my production schedule can be irratic...health issues can bring this producer to his knees and with a bit of time for recovery...I'm in production again) as FSX is fast approaching and few would be interested in additional purchases in the way of scenery for FS9. With that in mind it was first proposed to finish up the USA-Canada region with all of the seasons...which Spring will be the last official Season, but one of our BTs suggested a compilation of textures along with some specialized textures for Europe. In this case...yes...those who purchase VOL6 will see many textures that are exactly the same as those released in the previous volumes, along with some very specialized textures that better represent the European regions throughout the world...in light of that...VOL6 will be priced substantially less than $12.00 to reflect a price for the specialized work done. In regards to the price difference between BEV and GE... at present BEV includes many, many texture sets with several options. These option can range from only 1 up to as many as 11. All this means is that instead of just one texture to represent grass land there can be 11 different options...and each option represents time spent in creating those options. In addition, BEV also provides water textures, building textures, runway textures, runway detail textures, tree textures, powerline tower textures, and a few others I may be forgetting. We've included these extras with every volume, so that those who are only interested in Summer textures can enjoy them or those who are only interested in Fall textures can enjoy them and so on. For the amount of time spent on these extras and option, I believe the price of $9.00 to $12.00 per volume is justified. Now...understandably there are many who may not, but just like everything else in life, they are certainly entitled to their opinons.I hope this long drawn out post has been helpful to many...let me close this off with this; whether it is Peter's work, Stephen's work, someone else's work, or even Micorsofts work...developers of FS addons have a passion for the "hobby". Whatever can be created by whomever, to enhance the enjoyment of our "hobby" and whether it is presented as Freeware or (fairly priced) Payware, I join the many others who say "Bring it On". What's better....heck...who knows, all I know is that I enjoy flying and will continue to enhance my experience by whatever will up the ante. Clear Skies,StephenBirdsEyeView

2) GE comes from the team that released the ground breaking FE What is FE? Maybe Ive only seen it referred to spelled out, so dont recognize the abbreviation.

Flight Environment

Hi Allcott,instead of spending so much time repeating your odd accusations how about an afternoon with the SDK documents I pointed out above? Educate yourself, then form an opinion. FS *does* use different texture sets in its main regions, which is what I said above.Moreover, it is patently false that it took GE to bring anything about BEV's or FScene's approach to packaging to the consumer's attention. There are very good reasons for bundeling by season and/or region and there have been many posts about the pros and cons of these approaches in various forums ever since FScene gained many satisfied users several years ago. I'd appreciate if you could refrain from stating your own issues with this method as general "facts".Cheers, Holger

>Hi Allcott,>>instead of spending so much time repeating your odd>accusations how about an afternoon with the SDK documents I>pointed out above? Educate yourself, then form an opinion. FS>*does* use different texture sets in its main regions, which>is what I said above.>>Moreover, it is patently false that it took GE to bring>anything about BEV's or FScene's approach to packaging to the>consumer's attention. There are very good reasons for>bundeling by season and/or region and there have been many>posts about the pros and cons of these approaches in various>forums ever since FScene gained many satisfied users several>years ago. I'd appreciate if you could refrain from stating>your own issues with this method as general "facts".>>Cheers, HolgerWhat ARE those reasons, please? Other than making the price look more acceptable because the package is BIG, not small. Just how much duplication is there in these `regional` sets?Allcott

Hi there,the reasons are already outlined in this thread and similar discussions. Unfortunately, you seem to be stuck in "I've been fleeced" mode and thus unable or unwilling to see them.Besides, according to your logic, any aircraft developer that uses the same custom gauges in two different aircraft is "fleecing" customers because they pay twice for them. Your car company is "fleecing" you because it uses the same engine in different models. I'll "fleece" my customers of Tongass Fjords because some of the ground textures will be the same as those in Misty Fjords. If the products sold required each other to function properly then that argument would have some weight. However, all these products, including the regional land texture packages, are stand alone. Cheers, Holger