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Pete Dowson

Airport AI traffic clusters around user aircraft

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I don't know which version of P3D in which this started to happen, but I am getting an annoying clustering of AI traffic at airports, generated from Traffic BGLs.

I'm using MyTraffic, as I have been for many years -- I'll try TrafficGlobal as well when I can get it to actually make any traffic).

What happens is that in a larger airport, such as EGLL, the AI traffic generated is all placed at gates or parking positions near my aircraft, leaving gates further away empty. It does not distribute them evenly.

Thinking it was something in my FSUIPC Traffic Limiter, I actually changed the range at which it doesn't delete airport traffic, if it can help it, from 0.5 nm to 2.4 nm. To no avail it seems.

So I re-tested with my Limiter off altogether -- again no change. Here are two examples, both with exactly the same traffic settings but with my aircraft in different places from the 'off' (images from Aivlasoft's EDFv2). My aircraft is the larger pink icon:

EGLL_User_at_T5_end.jpg

EGLL_User_at_T2_end.jpg

Of course, with UTLive (which wasn't running here) I get a more reasonable spread.

Does anyone here have any ideas, or results which disagree? Should I handle this in the L-M Forums? Since MyTraffic AI is only the pre-compiled suff in BGLs, it cannot be down to the traffic program itself, so I presume it must be a P3D bug. Or is it deliberate, to give the user more "company"?

I really want them to be spread out. Seeing T5 empty and all the BA traffic at other gates seems all wrong to me, and will be very noticeable when taxiing to those two runway thresholds.

Pete Dowson

 

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Is the AFCAD for the airport got random gate parking. were aircraft will park in any gate of the right size, UK2000 comes with a airline specific gates option this will stop what you are seeing.

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, rjfry said:

Is the AFCAD for the airport got random gate parking. were aircraft will park in any gate of the right size, UK2000 comes with a airline specific gates option this will stop what you are seeing.

Hes clearly using an add-on EGLL here as you can see from the parking spots. Either UK2000 or Simwings. Both will have a custom ADE file with proper defined airline or ramp parking spots

Edited by GHarrall

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Posted (edited)

Those airport diagrams seem to have a row of gates missing from the north side. Those gates are present in both the UK2000 and SimWings versions of Heathrow Airport, so why are they not represented in this Aivlasoft EDFv2? Sorry for the off topic question...

Edited by Christopher Low

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Well all  can say its not happening to me I have been testing JF TG AI and created some of my own flight plans and when go into EGLL I use the default king in P3Dv4.3, and the aircraft are parked in the same gates depending if time of day and terminal 5 is loaded with BA, and go into the airport by the heli pad then slew to check the AI, UK2000 EGLL also EGKK EGBB EGCC EGNX EGGW EGSS EGPH EGPF, and have not seen gates just loading around my aircraft.

Airline specific gates are colour coded BA dark blue UPS pink that's how you tell an AFCAD with airline specific gates the colour, the AFCAD in post the gates look all green the default AFCAD colour not airline specific, also the south cargo 614 to 616 should have a row of gates opposite making 6 Cargo gates if its UK2000 this tells me its not.

Edited by rjfry

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14 minutes ago, rjfry said:

Well all  can say its not happening to me I have been testing JF TG AI and created some of my own flight plans and when go into EGLL I use the default king in P3Dv4.3, and the aircraft are parked in the same gates depending if time of day and terminal 5 is loaded with BA, and go into the airport by the heli pad then slew to check the AI, UK2000 EGLL also EGKK EGBB EGCC EGNX EGGW EGSS EGPH EGPF, and have seen gates just loading around my aircraft.

Airline specific gates are colour coded BA dark blue UPS pink that's how you tell an AFCAD with airline specific gates the colour, the AFCAD in post the gates look all green the default AFCAD colour not airline specific, also the south cargo 614 to 616 should have a row of gates opposite making 6 Cargo gates if its UK2000 this tells me its not.

Those maps are from EFBv2 not a ADE. 

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, GHarrall said:

Those maps are from EFBv2 not a ADE. 

Like in said its not UK2000 or Aerosoft gates are missing in that CAD and you do not get that behaver, and I don't think its LM problem.

Edited by rjfry

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It doesn't happen to me, but then again I use the FSUIPC traffic limiter with VOXATC. I just looked with Little NavMap while on the ground at Flightbeam KDEN and the AI are spread out nicely at various gates. I'll check their KMSP when I get a chance.

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I also have FB and FSDT airports in the US and Aerosoft in the EU and all aircraft park in the assigned gates.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, rjfry said:

Is the AFCAD for the airport got random gate parking. were aircraft will park in any gate of the right size, UK2000 comes with a airline specific gates option this will stop what you are seeing.

This is currently Aerosoft EGLL, which also has airline specific gates. And it happens also at other airports such as Fly Tampa's EHAM.

And in both the above cases the aircraft appear to be correctly parked at gates which either allow that airline or allow any.

Further, even if what you say is correct, why would where I'm parked when the Scenario starts affect which (other) gates are used for the AI? How would P3D determine that the gates nearer me are the more appropriate? It cannot be the Traffic BGLs -- they are the same ones in both the above cases.

3 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

Those airport diagrams seem to have a row of gates missing from the north side. Those gates are present in both the UK2000 and SimWings versions of Heathrow Airport, so why are they not represented in this Aivlasoft EDFv2?

Is the Aerosoft one by SimWings?

I assume you mean 209 (plus L and R) and 210 (ditto). They certainly do not seem to have proper Gate entries in the current AFD for UK2000 EGLL (they used to in an earlier version I had). I'll check the Aerosoft one next week.

2 hours ago, rjfry said:

the south cargo 614 to 616 should have a row of gates opposite making 6 Cargo gates if its UK2000 this tells me its not.

You mean 611, 612 and 613? Yes, they are present in the UK2000 one, but evidently not in the Aerosoft one, though I'll be re-checking that next week when I get my cockpit up and running again (away for a week). 

2 hours ago, rjfry said:

terminal 5 is loaded with BA, and go into the airport by the heli pad then slew to check the AI, UK2000 EGLL also EGKK EGBB EGCC EGNX EGGW EGSS EGPH EGPF, and have not seen gates just loading around my aircraft.

This is happening when the aircraft is positioned there at the start, not slewed there. I think if I start further way from the airport entirely the AI are properly spread on arrival. It is a departure scenario, from initial load of the scenerios with my aircraft at different places, which does it.

============================

Actually, after all the above replies, I think I've figured it out for myself.

EFBv2 reads traffic data from FSUIPC, not from SimConnect. FSUIPC's offsets have limited sized Ground and Air Traffic tables, only providing data on the nearest 96 such aircraft! 

I've not counted the ones in my pix, but if there are 96, then that's it! (I can also try setting the FSUIPC Limiter to 96, and that should theoretically also give an even, if sparser, spread in EFBv2!

Pete

P.S. YES! There are precisely 96 in both pix! 

Phew! Silly puzzle solved. I was deluded by the depiction in EFBv2, not by surveying the actual aircraft on the ground!

 

 

Edited by Pete Dowson

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P3D will not determine the gates that's down to the CAD file and the AI program, and if you when you go in to the sim at the eastern end, terminal 5 is empty then the BA aircraft must be parking at the wrong gate.

Unfortunately for some unknow reason I cannot post links on avsim anymore, if you have traffic Global check the support forum I have posted links to screenshot of EGLL full of traffic parked at the correct gates as well as other airports.    

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, rjfry said:

P3D will not determine the gates that's down to the CAD file and the AI program, and if you when you go in to the sim at the eastern end, terminal 5 is empty then the BA aircraft must be parking at the wrong gate.

Please do see the answer at the end of my last message, above. It was me being blind to one of the uirks of using FSUIPC to read AI traffic data.

17 minutes ago, rjfry said:

if you have traffic Global check the support forum I have posted links to screenshot of EGLL full of traffic parked at the correct gates as well as other airports.  

Not that it is now relevant here, but I do have Traffic Global and tried that again recently after downloading the current release, 1.1.0.6, and still can't make it provide much if any traffic.  I'm sure i'm not doing something right, and I've posted a question on this an the Early Access forum. Maybe you could advise me there? (it's the one with the title starting "Why does TrafficGlobal provide so few ...").

BTW I assume you didn't use EFBv2 to view EGLL "full of traffic"? 😉

Pete

 

Edited by Pete Dowson

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As you will see in my Screenshots I use Super Traffic Board to check the departure times in the sim, how much traffic movement will depend on the time of day and schedules, bear in mind its still early access and has some issues which Rich is working on, there are two ways to develop a product  closed beta NDA or early access but both in the end are trying to get the same outcome, JF early access means they suffer the backlash of users but they also get the product on wider spectrum of PCs and config, How often do you see a product full release after closed beta users find the bugs and a patch is needed, even the flight sims themselves suffer that.

I don't use EFB what you see is UK2000 EGLL desktop shot to show STB times.

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    As you will see in my Screenshots I use Super Traffic Board to check the departure times ian thae sim, how much trafficrf movement will depend on the time of day and schedules, bear in mind its still early access and has some issues which Rich is working on

    Yes, but so many folks seem to get traffic, and presumably a decent size of BGL for the routes . I posted the sizes which just a plain install provides , and the same after a no changes compile. No big difference, and both only a small proportion of that provided by a default My Traffic. Surely feedback as well as pleas for help is what their forum is for?

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I assume you mean 209 (plus L and R) and 210 (ditto). They certainly do not seem to have proper Gate entries in the current AFD for UK2000 EGLL (they used to in an earlier version I had). I'll check the Aerosoft one next week.

I have just checked the NATS AIS website, and it seems that most of the gates on the north side are no longer there. Very strange. Maybe that is why I only ever see a couple of airliners parked on one side at any time! I will have to check my AFD file when I get home from work.

Quote

You mean 611, 612 and 613? Yes, they are present in the UK2000 one, but evidently not in the Aerosoft one, though I'll be re-checking that next week when I get my cockpit up and running again (away for a week).

This is an interesting comment, because those three parking spots are indeed included in the Aerosoft (SimWings) version of Heathrow (at least, they are in the P3D v3 version). In fact, I was asked to park at Gate 612 in my 737-600 NGX the last time I visited!

For the record, I currently use the Aerosoft version of Heathrow.

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