Spacial disorientation

[mp15 138]

Hi MsovO

It would be nice to add Spacial disorientation to the sim according to extreme manouvres or weather episodes in particular places of the world, where all instruments go out of control and the pilot hallucinations apply by a visual distortion of the world independent to the real sim to increment impact possibilities in a visually correct plane position,  with severe color hue changes, and of course twisters, waterspouts, and fuselage dynamic damage on those 1000 points, and we want wreck crashing physics according to speed and surface of impact to see if we can get away with it or not after crashing, so red bloody screen apply if it's fatal.

[GlideBy 324]

Well, I could see high G blackouts and whiteouts.  And hypoxia at altitude under various failures.

Otherwise I don't know how they would simulate spatial disorientation.  Since it relies on internal body feelings and senses, like the inner ear. https://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/Spatial_Disorientation

 

[mp15 138]

right, it could be tricked by actually rotating the sim map to affect the user visual, but the sim map state needs to conserve the real data right before the hallucination event and slowly go back to that state after a minute or so.

the collision attribute only respond to the real state of the map conserved right before the hallucination triggers and do not responde to the fake visual view of the user.

the game engine is focused meaning that it only exist where the plane does, with a big radius, but only where the user is located and not the whole world at the same time.

I don't think it will be a problem to rotate only that piece and then sticks back to normal.

 

 

 

[Noooch 1,084]

Xplane already features a progressive blackout if the pressurization isn't set correctly

[Claviateur 789]

The progressive blackout as well as a head shaking effect vs G force with a vibrating cockpit / Aircraft that rattles and shakes if we pull Gs... All bring some realistic (virtual) feelings in a simulator.

However I had so many times Spacial Desorientation espcially with Xenviro 1.10 3D clouds + high terrain scenarios...  

[bonchie 2,305]

I don't see how the spatial disorientation thing would work. 

In real life, you are taught to get on instruments and stay there if you start feeling it in IMC. As someone who's experienced it in real life (as I think most IFR pilots have to varying degrees before catching themselves), things don't start spinning and you don't start hallucinating. It's a physical feeling that you are moving in a  direction you aren't actually moving. 

In a game, there's noway to simulate that and it'd unduly punish the player to suddenly start making the instruments read wrong or the screen go all wonky. 

Edited January 30, 2020 by bonchie

[vortex681 806]

3 hours ago, GlideBy said:

And hypoxia at altitude under various failures.

The main problem with hypoxia is that it's insidious and you don't really realise that it's happening (so almost impossible to simulate).

[GlideBy 324]

4 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

The main problem with hypoxia is that it's insidious and you don't really realise that it's happening (so almost impossible to simulate).

 

3 hours ago, Noooch said:

Xplane already features a progressive blackout if the pressurization isn't set correctly

Well, Noooch gave one way of doing it.

For sudden depressurization, give them 15 seconds to put on a mask, or they pass out.  While passed out they slump back, or forward which may affect the yoke, and obviously can't control the plane.

For something that causes a gradual loss, if the pilot is modeled, the lips and fingertips could turn blue.  And even if the pilot is not modeled, the audio could have someone breathing faster and deeper.

https://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/Hypoxia

[vortex681 806]

1 minute ago, GlideBy said:

For something that causes a gradual loss, if the pilot is modeled, the lips and fingertips could turn blue.  And even if the pilot is not modeled, the audio could have someone breathing faster and deeper.

https://www.skybrary.aero/index.php/Hypoxia

But the problem with the gradual onset of hypoxia (the most common form) is that you don't notice the symptoms. Others may notice that you're starting to breathe quickly and slurring your words but you don't. That's why it's so dangerous.

[GlideBy 324]

3 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

But the problem with the gradual onset of hypoxia (the most common form) is that you don't notice the symptoms. Others may notice that you're starting to breathe quickly and slurring your words but you don't. That's why it's so dangerous.

Definitely dangerous, but that is even more reason why they should try to model it. 

[vortex681 806]

Just now, GlideBy said:

Definitely dangerous, but that is even more reason why they should try to model it.

How can you model something that you don't even notice in real life? If it was obvious, it wouldn't be realistic.

[GlideBy 324]

6 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

How can you model something that you don't even notice in real life? If it was obvious, it wouldn't be realistic.

Was I not clear before?

Xplane uses a progressive blackout.  That is one way.  Another way is for something that causes a gradual loss, if the pilot is modeled, the lips and fingertips could turn blue.  And even if the pilot is not modeled, the audio could have someone breathing faster and deeper.  Normally you would not hear breathing.  So the struggling breathing should stand out.  They can even gradually bring the audio levels up.

And keep in mind, we are observing our avatar.  So we are like a 3rd party observer who is not affected.

Edited January 30, 2020 by GlideBy

[kowen 64]

You experience it in VR already.  

[Mace 1,951]

4 hours ago, mpozzi said:

right, it could be tricked by actually rotating the sim map to affect the user visual, but the sim map state needs to conserve the real data right before the hallucination event and slowly go back to that state after a minute or so.

the collision attribute only respond to the real state of the map conserved right before the hallucination triggers and do not responde to the fake visual view of the user.

How would you propose they simulate a somatogravic effect though?   That is as bad as or worse than the things you mention...yet it would not involve any map trickery.

[vortex681 806]

43 minutes ago, GlideBy said:

Xplane uses a progressive blackout.  That is one way.  Another way is for something that causes a gradual loss, if the pilot is modeled, the lips and fingertips could turn blue.  And even if the pilot is not modeled, the audio could have someone breathing faster and deeper.  Normally you would not hear breathing.  So the struggling breathing should stand out.  They can even gradually bring the audio levels up.

You don't understand hypoxia. As someone who's experienced it in the real world, the first thing you know about it is usually when someone puts an oxygen mask on you, or asks you to check your oxygen, and tells you to take deep breaths. Up to that point, from your perspective everything seems to be fairly normal. You don't realise you're breathing more quickly or that you're making mistakes. That's why it's so dangerous in single-pilot situations where there's no one to see you deteriorate. It's not like an explosive (sudden) decompression where you have external cues to tell you that something's wrong.

Edited January 31, 2020 by vortex681