I agree. Voice recognition is definitely preferred, unless you're like me. My sim computer is in my home office, directly behind my wife's computer. If I were to spend an evening jabbering at simulated ATC, she'd simulate charging the cockpit and choking the pilot. 😉

So a non-verbal interface is very much needed alongside that verbal one.

 

 

Whilst all of these suggestions for errors and non-standard transmissions would possibly make the ATC more realistic, it would be incredibly difficult to inject errors which sounded genuine. For example, to deliberately get just a single digit of a frequency or a height/heading wrong on a very limited and random basis would probably be beyond the scope of a game. Injecting random, unconnected mistakes which were out of context would just sound odd - real world pilots rarely receive instructions, or make readbacks, which are completely wrong. It’s difficult enough to get realistic ATC that works correctly, using the correct phraseology, in a desktop flight sim without wanting random mistakes as well. It would just never sound realistic if it was scripted.

Personally, I’d prefer to have correct procedures and calls which, as I said earlier, would be difficult enough to implement anyway.

On 3/10/2020 at 4:29 PM, eslader said:

Yeah, I can accept some weird. I don't need 100% realism in *everything*. But it'd be nice if ATC wouldn't fly you into a mountain like it used to do in... 2004 or FSX, I can't remember. Might be nice if ATC could handle SID/STAR out of the box. Be even nicer if ATC had an option for diversions (15 left for wx, etc), and had the above mentioned RNG-based shortcut clearances, etc.

The text interface could be improved over fsx/p3d too. Instead of "request higher, x-number-of-feet" just give me an input box so I can type in the *altitude* I want. Relatively simple quality-of-life stuff like that.

Oh, and it'd be really cool if default ATC wouldn't talk as though it overdosed on valium. 😉 Speed that voice up!

 

 

 

 

In addition to proper VFR / IFR, I wish we could get radar vectoring, RVSM and CPDLC procedures "out of the box".

ATC has definitely been a weak point of FSX / P3D for a long time. There is an opportunity for a serious upgrade with AI in 2020. Therefore, I would rather FS to start with the "normal" procedures then, once implemented, variations with discrepancies are welcome.

Edited March 14, 20206 yr by GearUp180

On 3/8/2020 at 7:19 PM, Chock said:

We actually get quite a few pilots (notably Air France) going off recognised procedure and causing us to ask for clarification during pushbacks - they like to release the brakes before you've told them they can, occasionally before they've even called for pushback clearance. They often stick their anti-collision beacons on well before they are ready to go, causing traffic which was going to pass behind them pull up, causing quite big traffic jams on the airport roads. If the new FS 2020 sim has Air France A320s sticking their beacons on for no readily apparent reason, it really will be as real as it gets lol.

Lol. The usual suspects (and easy targets) when it comes to confusion on the radio.

No later than day before yesterday, in a part of the world where most people are French speakers but use English in their professional capacity, one of them bluntly asked the tower to respond in his native French since "the English level in the company is known to be poor".

10 minutes ago, GearUp180 said:

Lol. The usual suspects (and easy targets) when it comes to confusion on the radio.

No later than day before yesterday, in a part of the world where most people are French speakers but use English in their professional capacity, one of them bluntly asked the tower to respond in his native French since "the English level in the company is known to be poor".

Well, to be fair, I too would find it annoying if the required language for radio in flying was not my native tongue I guess, but then again, since I like flying so much, it would motivate me to learn it were the roles reversed. I guess English speakers are lucky in that respect, but my complaint is not the language barrier, it's the fact that AF pilots tend to depart from official procedure more than others, and that is dangerous.

8 minutes ago, Chock said:

Well, to be fair, I too would find it annoying if the required language for radio in flying was not my native tongue I guess, but then again, since I like flying so much, it would motivate me to learn it were the roles reversed. I guess English speakers are lucky in that respect, but my complaint is not the language barrier, it's the fact that AF pilots tend to depart from official procedure more than others, and that is dangerous.

Got it. Nonetheless, I believe that poor communication skills lead to procedures deviations.

8 hours ago, vortex681 said:

Whilst all of these suggestions for errors and non-standard transmissions would possibly make the ATC more realistic, it would be incredibly difficult to inject errors which sounded genuine.

As my OP stated, just thinking some random static sounds, maybe not always crystal clear, random buzzes where controller talks over someone else, stuff like that. Have it sound more like, you know a radio! In the real world we must listen carefully, it's lives at stake. Nothing that requires NASA programming/engineering or would take away from other simulation factors. Meh, maybe someone will create an add on later on.

Edited March 14, 20206 yr by KERNEL32

I wonder if they could get Kennedy Steve to do a cameo...

 

7 hours ago, eslader said:

I wonder if they could get Kennedy Steve to do a cameo...

 

It would be amazing!

Did any of you all ever play the 1999 sim, Flight Unlimited III?  It had a great VFR ATC system that I haven't seen matched anywhere yet (after 20 years!).  What was cool about it?

• You had to "build" your phrases from selections rather than everything being done for you.  This helped teach me how to talk to ATC.
• ATC actually reacted to your actions.
  • Ground would require you to tell them what ATIS you had before clearing you to taxi.
  • If you started taxiing without contacting ground, but were monitoring the frequency, you would hear them warning all the other planes about you.
• Ability to declare emergencies and ATC would actually hold all other traffic, etc.
• Unicom pattern call-outs and such at uncontrolled airports (and hear other planes do the same.)
• ATC was real recorded voice samples that were patched together and had quite a few different voices.  It gave it an authentic sound because it wasn't a synthesized voice.

I would love to see some good VFR ATC in MS Flight Simulator 2020.  If it could be done 20 years ago, it could certainly be done to an ever better level by this team today.

 

@Eclipse  That sounds great.  It would be great if I could become comfortable talking to ATC in class B airspace.  That just scares me, and I avoid it.  That and I don't want to get in the way, or be that guy.